2009 TM8 Refresh List to remedy issue.

[RideGuy]

2009 Twisted Race Gas M8 with over 1000 boosted miles in need of some refreshing.

I have a small problem that is getting worse and more frequent so I suspect the stator, temperature sensor, capacitor, reeds or all of the above......

My problem is after casual riding I'll shut down the sled. After a few minutes I will start the sled but it will not leave the line clean without dying no matter how I feather the throttle. I used to be able to feather the throttle and go. After a few attempts it starts to rev up and I can feather the throttle and go. Once running it is almost flawless. In the morning when loading/unloading the sled it does not act up.

At idle my rpm's are 1500 (seems low thus I suspect the stator is failing from turbo heat and electrical load) headlight isn't as bright as 2010 TM8 at idle, fuel pressure is 38-40psi, 9 pounds of boost average, AF is 14.5 to --- so it is lean at idle and 12.2 on a pull. Oil mixed 40:1. Stock M8 reeds.

I have been told that the temperature sensor high temperature reading can activate or even go bad and default the ECU to a safe mode. I am told that this will pull the fuel and make it hard to start. I am of the understanding that I can put a switch in line with the temperature sensor to remedy this. Opening the contact will tell ECU that it is cold resulting in fuel being added acting like a choke thus aiding in starting the sled. Closing the switch enables the sensor signal back to the ECU mapping for the sleds given instrumentation.

I am not seeing any wrench's or flashing check engine lights progressing to solid check engine lights so I'm not sure if my temperatures are hot enough to activate safe mode? Installing a switch is great insurance and may remedy a few related and non related problems. I'd prefer fixing the issues and have the switch for when the temperature has activated safe mode.

Is it true that when safe mode is activated that it pulls fuel on M8's ? On my old Polaris I was sure that safe mode retarded the timing and added fuel. This has been confusing for me I'd just like confirmation on M8's safe mode??

Refresh List;


1.) M1000 reeds stacked with old M8 reeds. Any other good reeds for TM8? OVS reed stops to help prevent chipping. Service once in summer and once in winter.
http://www.snowestonline.com/forum/showthread.php?t=253115
http://www.snowestonline.com/forum/showthread.php?t=255952

2.) Temperature sensor and switch. Any suggestions or upgrades available?

3.) Stator. Even though it hasn't failed yet it will.... Any upgraded stators out there? Last resort and expensive.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ARCTIC-CAT-M8-EFI-SNO-PRO-STATOR-2007-2008-_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem43a458d853QQitemZ290520094803QQptZSnowmobileQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories
http://stores.ebay.com/RMSTATOR

4.) Capacitor. Do they even go bad? To charge I would assume extra stator wear not to mention the heat from the turbo and the capacitors location.

5.) Primary Clutch. What to look for and replace? Known issues??

6.) Secondary Clutch. What to look for and replace? Known issues??

7.) Inline Fuel Filter. How many miles till it should be changed? I'm not finding one, screens on pickups only?

8.) Diamond Drive bearing has been replaced. Service once in summer and once in winter.

9.) ECU has a cover over it to protect it from snow.

10.) Air temp sensor is in split loom and dangling in belly pan section.

11.) Barometric pressure hose pointing to rear in belly pan section.

12.) TPS how often do they fail?

13.) Plugged injector... How to test?

14.) Fuel Controller issues. Any Codes how do you know when?

15.) Check Ground Connections.
http://www.snowestonline.com/forum/showthread.php?t=255480

Only the Y pipe had to be replaced last year, everything else is stock.

No top end work done yet. I've seen a few TM8's with several thousand miles on the pistons and they look good....


What am I missing or what should I consider?

T.I.A.

 

[glassman]

The first thing I would check is the voltage coming from your voltage regulator. When it heats up it can screw with your voltage. If you have one of the updated dc regulators they control the ground to the engine as well and will do all sorts of interesting things.

 

[RideGuy]

The first thing I would check is the voltage coming from your voltage regulator. When it heats up it can screw with your voltage. If you have one of the updated dc regulators they control the ground to the engine as well and will do all sorts of interesting things.

My last few rides have had more under hood heat. I have been running the cold air intake and I have noticed a temperature rise under the hood. I have not updated the voltage regulator and I am the original owner. I will check this when I tear into my sled next week to change my reeds.

I downloaded the AC manual and in the manual it says safe mode richens the fuel mixture. I guess the switch must pull fuel when the temperature sensor enables safe mode.

I will try and add some links and information as I find it to my above list. Maybe the list will help some people including my self. If people have some answers or links to some of the questions above please ad them.... I didn't expect somebody to answer them all... LOL

J.

 

[Jeff K]

It sounds like you are on the right track with the stator and reeds. I changed my reeds before the season, but the old ones weren't that bad. I stacked my old ones on top of new M1000 reeds. To me it sounds like the stator is on it's way out.

 

[WyoBoy1000]

09 twisted HCR RG 5-7lbs
Mine has started doing something wierd, after riding I let it idle down for a bit then shut it off, I wait or bs for a few. Then I start it and if I go full throttle it starts to pull and bogs, if I don't let off it will die. Its a real b1tch when trying to get out of a creak bottom. But if I start it and let it idle for a bit it will pull no problem, or if it bogs and I let off and it stays running it wont do it again. 1400ish miles, turbo since day one, I don't think anything has been changed other than belts and plugs. I got it with 1150miles and it didn't do this.

Its either that letting it run for a few seconds it cycles the coolant enough to run on the right mapping, like its in a heat soaked mode until the coolant clears. But its prob due for reeds as well.

 

[RideGuy]

It sounds like you are on the right track with the stator and reeds. I changed my reeds before the season, but the old ones weren't that bad. I stacked my old ones on top of new M1000 reeds. To me it sounds like the stator is on it's way out.

I tend to agree Jeff.... I sure don't want to change the Stator cause they are a faily expensive.... I think I'll do the reeds and put a switch inline with the temp sensor and see how she fairs after that.... I plan on stacking them the same as you since that is what Shain told me to try.

Still up for some spring time riding this year??

 

[RideGuy]

09 twisted HCR RG 5-7lbs
Mine has started doing something wierd, after riding I let it idle down for a bit then shut it off, I wait or bs for a few. Then I start it and if I go full throttle it starts to pull and bogs, if I don't let off it will die. Its a real b1tch when trying to get out of a creak bottom. But if I start it and let it idle for a bit it will pull no problem, or if it bogs and I let off and it stays running it wont do it again. 1400ish miles, turbo since day one, I don't think anything has been changed other than belts and plugs. I got it with 1150miles and it didn't do this.

Its either that letting it run for a few seconds it cycles the coolant enough to run on the right mapping, like its in a heat soaked mode until the coolant clears. But its prob due for reeds as well.

Sounds similar for sure. I've heard a person needs to let the pipe temp sensor heat up but in our cases they would be warm.

Interesting theory about letting the coolant circulate a bit which would change the resisitance of that sensor.... Do you have a switch installed on the sensor?

The sensor is only $65 and I hear that they are very sensitive and if they are failing they will act up like this.... Might be a cheap alternative to the stator.... I suspect the stators get weak from all of the heat cycling but at $650 from www.arcticcatpartsnation.com and that being the cheapest one I've found.... I think I will try the simple stuff first..... Like a new temp sensor $65 or a switch for $10....

Do you know if you have the M8 or M1000 reeds?

 

[WyoBoy1000]

Not sure on the reeds, bought it used, I plan on calling shain and will do what he says on the reeds. Mine does have the temp switch.

 

[Jeff K]

I tend to agree Jeff.... I sure don't want to change the Stator cause they are a faily expensive.... I think I'll do the reeds and put a switch inline with the temp sensor and see how she fairs after that.... I plan on stacking them the same as you since that is what Shain told me to try.

Still up for some spring time riding this year??

I hear ya on the Stator cost. Have you tried calling Michelle (FreeAgent)? I get a lot of stuff from her and I haven't found better pricing

I have a coolant temp switch that came with my Cutler kit. I only used it once, and I am not sure if it really needed it or not. Their kit is nice because it is plug and play.

I am up for some spring riding for sure! Can't wait!

 

[RideGuy]

Reeds and Temp Switch's.

Shain told me to stack the M1000's and the old 8's a while back.

Can reeds get softer when hot?

This would explain a poor air/fuel mixture issue as the reeds age and fail.


Temperature Switch seems like great insurance for a high temperature condition.

I would like to know how the temperature sensor fails. Dead band or inconsistent output's as temperature fluctuates ? And how much that sensor adjusts fuel in the mapping from cold to hot?

Cheap and easy to replace the temperature sensor if they degrade so rapidly.....

 

[trk800]

STATOR AVAILABLE

IF YOU DECIDE TO GO THE STATOR ROUTE I HAVE A USED ONE, BOUGHT ONE HOPEING IT WOULD FIX MY PROBLEM AND DIDNT SO NOW I HAVE A EXTRA ONE IF YOU NEED IT.

 

[harf69]

id start with a set of reeds depending on boost level and milage.ive had to replace the tdr reeds at 400 miles and i lost a set of stock reeds before that, around 1500 miles.first low idle sluggish throttle response then poof it would not run because i lost a piece of a corner it seems to wear on the outer corners of the reeds now im running stock 1000 reeds at around 10lbs just my experiance.before i got the sled brad ran it around 12lbs at that level it tends to heet the reeds basiclly cook them without a cooler

 

[Hairy Mark]

i go through a set of reeds every 1000 miles so it sounds like you are having a reed problem. i would change them. but i just put the stock 1000 reeds and nothing else in there. i didn't stack them. the reason that i think that you are having the low end bog is that the corners on the reeds are shot and letting fuel in and flooding the sled.

 

[Klimbing Kitty]

So if reeds are shot will you see higher numbers on your A/F? mine was running like a raped ape and now low end is shot. If I can get through the low end boggy feeling it runs well again but A/F is climbing as high as 13 at full throttle.????

 

[JSCC]

So if reeds are shot will you see higher numbers on your A/F? mine was running like a raped ape and now low end is shot. If I can get through the low end boggy feeling it runs well again but A/F is climbing as high as 13 at full throttle.????

Yes that is classic reed failure.

 

[WyoBoy1000]

Now if we could just figure out which ones and how many to use.

 

[Hairy Mark]

Now if we could just figure out which ones and how many to use.

personally ijust use the stock m1000 reeds and let it go. change them at 1000 miles and you are usually running good all the time.

 

[RideGuy]

What are people doing with Air sensor and Barometric sensor?

I have some M1000 reeds ready to install. It sounds like it's time!! I've been lazy...

I've been thinking about the Barometric Tube on the ECU and the Air sensor from the air box.

I have had mine routed under the air box. Since removing my ECU cover twice in the last week I've noticed that the Barometric Hose to ECU has water in it surely affecting pressure sensing.

I'm now wondering how my air sensor looks throughout the day as well......

What does everyone do with their barometric sensor hose and air sensor?

T.I.A.

 

[m8lovin]

I have my tube just sitting under airbox and air temp sensor is in the same area, zap strapped too the wiring harness to keep it from rattling around too bad..

 

[RideGuy]

After seeing water in my pressure sensing tube to the ecu, I am cosidering a vented chamber with the hose twisted like a pipe syphon... Or maybe using another pre filter bag around it to prevent water or ice obstructing to pressure sensor... Maybe something similar for the air temp sensor...??

Has anybody done this? Is it necessary or overkill??