Install the app
How to install the app on iOS

Follow along with the video below to see how to install our site as a web app on your home screen.

Note: This feature may not be available in some browsers.

  • Don't miss out on all the fun! Register on our forums to post and have added features! Membership levels include a FREE membership tier.

What would you like to see from your manufacturer?

0neoldfart

Well-known member
Premium Member
Good afternoon all.
This post is intended to be constructive critisism, and not a bashing of the manufacturers. Simply put, I feel that the companies that makes the sleds we love to ride could all do a much better job, and I have some suggestions for all of them to perhaps take notice. I do realize they are in business to make money for their shareholders, but the bottom line is that the consumer should have a voice.
- In the automotive world, when you factory order a vehicle, it is assigned a VIN and a tenative delivery date. No reason we shouldn't be able to "check up" on our spring orders
- How about putting in place a customer service phone number, rather then the "call your dealer if you have a problem." Sorry, but a poor design is not the dealer's fault - he didn't build it, and he isn't the guy making the bulk of the profit.
- Quit flooding the market, and devaluing our trade ins. Hard to trade in a used sled when the dealer is selling 1,2, or 3 yr old non current iron for half of it's original MSRP.
- Quality control. While it is true that a new sled isn't $50K like a new loaded truck, they run about $14000 - 17000 her in Canada, depending on model. For that price you are entitled to a 1,2, or 3 year warranty that is VERY limited, on a machine that is used for 3-5 months (if you're lucky) each year. Most riders may put on 2500 miles in a year max. My truck has a much longer warranty, is worked harder, and has a life expectancy of 300,000 kms if I maintain it. Cost per km (or mile) is far less on the truck, and it serves more then just one purpose.
- If you are brining a product to market, ensure it is ready, and have parts readily available to repair it in a timely fashion. Nothing worse then having a new snowmobile in the shop for half of your riding season, yet you are still making payments on it. All major auto manufacturers offer some sort of concession (rental allowance) to keep you on the road.
- Listen to your dealers, and perhaps your customer base as well, by reading these forums, and then doing something about it. Fix the issues that pop up in a timely fashion. Don't hand build a couple prototypes and then pound out a lesser product to the consumer.
- Spring order pet peeves: offer color choices, better shock packages, and options that we actually want, other then a different color. I realize the aftermarket has to make money too, but I'm tired of having to "fix" your poor designs and quality control at my expense. By gosh, we pay a lot of hard earned money for these machines, and what you call "new features and improvements" every year are simply changes to poor design. Throwing a fancy paint job, stickers, and a different shock caliberation doesn't do it for me. I don't applaud mediocrity.
I'm done with my rant. I've ordered 2 new sleds from different manufacturers this year, and unless they meet at least 2/3 of my expectations, I will be done with this sport, something I've enjoyed actively for 36 years. Manufacturers, you had better start taking better care of the consumer, because this is fast turning into a rich man's (or woman's) sport, and if you lose us, good luck getting newcomers to the sport, especially in light of the world economy. "toy sales" usually take a backseat to food, shelter, and clothing. Food for thought, thank you for your time.
 
I had to laugh while reading this post and looking at the Avatar.

I am over the top happy with Polaris and the sleds they have delivered to me the last 3 years. If I or any of the 20 or 30 guys in my riding circle had anything to say to them it would be "great job guys." Maybe we just have low expectations LOL.
 
I had to laugh while reading this post and looking at the Avatar.

I am over the top happy with Polaris and the sleds they have delivered to me the last 3 years. If I or any of the 20 or 30 guys in my riding circle had anything to say to them it would be "great job guys." Maybe we just have low expectations LOL.

Funny how opinions change from person to person. I have owned a few Polaris sleds and while they have been really fun to ride, all 3 have been dismally unreliable. If it weren't for the dealer support I have received I would have jumped ship. I agree with many of the OP's points. It would be nice if the benchmark of reliability for a sled was around 4,000-5,000 miles. Is this possible? Who knows? I do think that Polaris has been listening to mountain riders, I just wish I knew that there was a better than 70 percent chance of me riding back to the truck without being towed. If it is all pie in the sky dreaming I would love to see a manufacturer come up with a sled that has all the positive attributes of each model, with none of the drawbacks.
 
I have always felt that people that offer $ up front and a commitment to snow check a sled should be rewarded with a better price. I mean come on, you snowcheck one and give the manufacture a head count on sales and they reward you with some bs graphics/a coat or (300.00 bux of gear)then slap you in the face by letting your buddy buy same sled 60 days later for 1000's cheaper!!! Its a insult. I quit snowchecking years ago because of it.
 
Definitely some good points here. The manufactures are in a unique position where they need to incorporate the reliability and consumer service of an automobile manufacture but not behave like one when it comes to their communications. I'm not that young anymore and I really do not identify with their marketing, they are stuck in the stone age and do not speak to me in any meaningful way. Snowmobiling is possibly the dynamic sport on the planet and rather then behaving like an automotive manufacture, I believe they would be far better served to identify with the culture and present themselves as dynamic entertainment companies that offer the best sporting experience on the planet...which they do not.

As for reliability, they all have a lot of work to do. I think I've seen it all over the last couple years. They want bragging rights for weight reduction, then compromise structural integrity in the process to point that it really limits one's ability to ride the machine aggressively. Suspension is also another area that is in serious need of improvement. The stock shocks on most sleds are complete garbage, they can't even handle the smallest bump without going through the travel and bottoming out. If you buy a brand new dirt bike, you really don't have to do much to them anymore, sleds are getting better, but still have a long way to go.


Good afternoon all.
This post is intended to be constructive critisism, and not a bashing of the manufacturers. Simply put, I feel that the companies that makes the sleds we love to ride could all do a much better job, and I have some suggestions for all of them to perhaps take notice. I do realize they are in business to make money for their shareholders, but the bottom line is that the consumer should have a voice.
- In the automotive world, when you factory order a vehicle, it is assigned a VIN and a tenative delivery date. No reason we shouldn't be able to "check up" on our spring orders
- How about putting in place a customer service phone number, rather then the "call your dealer if you have a problem." Sorry, but a poor design is not the dealer's fault - he didn't build it, and he isn't the guy making the bulk of the profit.
- Quit flooding the market, and devaluing our trade ins. Hard to trade in a used sled when the dealer is selling 1,2, or 3 yr old non current iron for half of it's original MSRP.
- Quality control. While it is true that a new sled isn't $50K like a new loaded truck, they run about $14000 - 17000 her in Canada, depending on model. For that price you are entitled to a 1,2, or 3 year warranty that is VERY limited, on a machine that is used for 3-5 months (if you're lucky) each year. Most riders may put on 2500 miles in a year max. My truck has a much longer warranty, is worked harder, and has a life expectancy of 300,000 kms if I maintain it. Cost per km (or mile) is far less on the truck, and it serves more then just one purpose.
- If you are brining a product to market, ensure it is ready, and have parts readily available to repair it in a timely fashion. Nothing worse then having a new snowmobile in the shop for half of your riding season, yet you are still making payments on it. All major auto manufacturers offer some sort of concession (rental allowance) to keep you on the road.
- Listen to your dealers, and perhaps your customer base as well, by reading these forums, and then doing something about it. Fix the issues that pop up in a timely fashion. Don't hand build a couple prototypes and then pound out a lesser product to the consumer.
- Spring order pet peeves: offer color choices, better shock packages, and options that we actually want, other then a different color. I realize the aftermarket has to make money too, but I'm tired of having to "fix" your poor designs and quality control at my expense. By gosh, we pay a lot of hard earned money for these machines, and what you call "new features and improvements" every year are simply changes to poor design. Throwing a fancy paint job, stickers, and a different shock caliberation doesn't do it for me. I don't applaud mediocrity.
I'm done with my rant. I've ordered 2 new sleds from different manufacturers this year, and unless they meet at least 2/3 of my expectations, I will be done with this sport, something I've enjoyed actively for 36 years. Manufacturers, you had better start taking better care of the consumer, because this is fast turning into a rich man's (or woman's) sport, and if you lose us, good luck getting newcomers to the sport, especially in light of the world economy. "toy sales" usually take a backseat to food, shelter, and clothing. Food for thought, thank you for your time.
 
id agree it is turning into a very expensive sport now. it is nothing to drop $1000 for something random related to snowmobiling. it is kinda sad really.
 
used to buy new ever year.i quit doing that when a dealer said bring me $7500 and your cherry trade in.
 
Re: Avatar

I had to laugh while reading this post and looking at the Avatar.

I am over the top happy with Polaris and the sleds they have delivered to me the last 3 years. If I or any of the 20 or 30 guys in my riding circle had anything to say to them it would be "great job guys." Maybe we just have low expectations LOL.
Although the pic in my avatar is a polaris, I don't own one. Bought the wifey a 2013 ProRMK 600 155 ES though. I've always had mod sleds, the platform this year will be an M1100 turbo. I'm glad you have had no issues with your sled, but a lot of others have, from every manufacturer. Try selling an IQ chassis, M-chassis, or XP chassis. Worth less then half of new, even if sled is in pristine condition. The manufacturers devalue their own product, simply by overproduction. This is more common due to some of the "big box" stores, which tells me that the manufaturer has forgotten about the mom & pop sled stores that helped build this industry. I almost picked up a dealer snowmobile franchise in the late 90's, but the building requirements and storefront (along with the stock I was expected to keep) wasn't realistic for my geographical area, period. I know several dealers in Canada that were in business 25+ years, who were basically tossed aside cause a new player agreed to build the super showroom. Half of the "new" dealer owners don't even ride a sled. And please don't start about quality control - there is a major lack of it in this industry - perhaps it comes down to lack of pride in their work on the factory floor? Even if a dealer does a good PDI by the book, I always find things that need attention before I ride it in the backcountry. At least with a car or truck, you have roadside assistance. If my new sled fails mechanically in the backcountry, I'm on my own - and I choose to ride in very remote areas, often not seeing another rider on the mountain...
And I'm not knocking my dealers - one is a 9 hr round trip for me, the other a 6 hr round trip in the opposite direction - worth the drive to deal with people who recognize your face when you walk in the door.
 
i want the stock sled to come with the stand alone self adjusting fuel/air ratio capabilities for modifications that the sled owner may embark on
 
We are the reason that sleds have gotton so expensive.
We demand the latest & greatest.
Example: Look how cheap the old tech 2013 SkiDoo XP 800 Sport is.
If you do not have to have the latest & greatest, this is the best bang for the buck.
I've talked to a few dealers & this was not their best seller this spring, so I guess we are willing to pay for more, so the manufacturers will give us more & charge us more.
Free market.
 
I agree with some of the arguments, but stop and look at the history again.
Sleds at half price of new after a few years? So are cars? (That's why I buy used)
Some models hold value better than others (just like cars). Take the M7. I gave $5500 for an 05 M7 with only a couple hundred miles on it 5-6 years ago. That sled now with a couple thousand miles (not alot) would still fetch $4k this fall I bet. Of course it's stock and not beat up, wife's sled. By way of comparison I'd be lucky to get $5k out of my M1000 with half the miles. Not as good of a sled.
Yeah they're getting more expensive every year, what isn't?
But 20 years ago we wanted more hp, so we got 600lb plus sleds with big triples that made 150hp and went like stink, but they were tanks!
Now everyone wanted lighter sleds, so we got big twins, but the 150hp wsa gone (in stock form).
FOr mtn sleds 10yrs ago, it took a serious mod sled to get sub 500lbs and 150hp.
Now all the mtns sleds are sub 500lbs, some are closer to 400lbs, all are over 150hp out of a twin and the suspensions are waaaay better than even 10 years ago.
That development costs money. DOes it cost as much as they are charging? I dunno, but I can honestly say I can see and feel the difference between a new-2yr old sled and a 10-12 yr old sled.
Heck, I'm sure a Proclimb or a Pro will rail my 5 yr old sled in every way except raw power (only because my M1ooo is modded, otherwise it would be a close call I bet)
Sled prices could easily be sub $10k still if we had Mikuni carbs and pogo stick suspensions.
It's summer, good time time to b!tch about stuff since there's no riding, but would you really get out of the sport if your new sled didn't perform up to your standards???
(How bad can a mod M1100T really be? 250hp and a mile long, climb like a billy goat track)

I for one think relaibilty is getting better, but I haven't owned any of the scuds that people have issues with (must have got a good M1000, not a belt eater).
The only thing I'd like to see is the mfr's pick up quicker on the little stuff that WE find wrong and fix on the newer models and incorporate that into thier updates or new models quicker, but as anyone who works for a large company can attest, that never happens quickly.....red tape.
 
Last edited:
I agree with some of the arguments, but stop and look at the history again.
Sleds at half price of new after a few years? So are cars? (That's why I buy used)
Some models hold value better than others (just like cars). Take the M7. I gave $5500 for an 05 M7 with only a couple hundred miles on it 5-6 years ago. That sled now with a couple thousand miles (not alot) would still fetch $4k this fall I bet. Of course it's stock and not beat up, wife's sled. By way of comparison I'd be lucky to get $5k out of my M1000 with half the miles. Not as good of a sled.
Yeah they're getting more expensive every year, what isn't?
But 20 years ago we wanted more hp, so we got 600lb plus sleds with big triples that made 150hp and went like stink, but they were tanks!
Now everyone wanted lighter sleds, so we got big twins, but the 150hp wsa gone (in stock form).
FOr mtn sleds 10yrs ago, it took a serious mod sled to get sub 500lbs and 150hp.
Now all the mtns sleds are sub 500lbs, some are closer to 400lbs, all are over 150hp out of a twin and the suspensions are waaaay better than even 10 years ago.
That development costs money. DOes it cost as much as they are charging? I dunno, but I can honestly say I can see and feel the difference between a new-2yr old sled and a 10-12 yr old sled.
Heck, I'm sure a Proclimb or a Pro will rail my 5 yr old sled in every way except raw power (only because my M1ooo is modded, otherwise it would be a close call I bet)
Sled prices could easily be sub $10k still if we had Mikuni carbs and pogo stick suspensions.
It's summer, good time time to b!tch about stuff since there's no riding, but would you really get out of the sport if your new sled didn't perform up to your standards???
(How bad can a mod M1100T really be? 250hp and a mile long, climb like a billy goat track)

I for one think relaibilty is getting better, but I haven't owned any of the scuds that people have issues with (must have got a good M1000, not a belt eater).
The only thing I'd like to see is the mfr's pick up quicker on the little stuff that WE find wrong and fix on the newer models and incorporate that into thier updates or new models quicker, but as anyone who works for a large company can attest, that never happens quickly.....red tape.
Not complaining about the cost or performance of a box stock sled - you pay to play. I guess in a nutshell, I'd like to see a manufacturer be more proactive instead of reactive. In regards to the M1000, it was and is a great sled - just had a bunch of setup issues, and Cat (in my opinion) didn't do their homework mapping it. My 07 was great until it had the 08 recall, took a bunch of tuning with a BD box to get it right after that. I've seen fuel pressures that were on both sides of the scale (38-50 lbs STOCK). No wonder half didn't run well. I suppose a good portion of the problem could have been rectified by the selling dealer, but they were more interested in selling me a new one then fixing the problems, hence a new selling dealer. Offering up a CSI index for franchised dealers may help them decide who should be representing them, rather then what dealer is in the largest demographic who bolts the skis on & kicks it out the door, or has the 16 yr old work experience kid do the PDI on your new ride. You have valid points, but if you had the dealer support and limited riding time in the winter (mine is due to work schedules) - you would expect your expensive toy to work well, not be choppered out, or sit in the dealer's shop for 1/2 the winter due to parts availability, no? I'm not saying they are doing a bad job, but they could strive for excellence and do a better job...if they aim higher and remember that the consumer pays the bills - nature of any service industry.
 
I would like to see a 1000cc two stroke factory turbo mountain sled.

Me too!! But then I'd probably complain about how heavy it was :face-icon-small-con I'm the first to demand excellence in everything but I understand that it isn't a reality. I think the bottom line is that if the manufacturers were making better sleds, the price would be that much higher. I don't imagine that any of the manufacturers are making hand over fist in profits (even though I read the cat article about that very thing). There are enough manufacturers to complete against one another to not make that so. Business competition helps keep any single one have a monopoly and therefore set any price they want. Everyone can always do better but honestly I don't complain too much about what sleds are nowadays. They have made leaps and bounds over the years if you think about a new sled compared to the old rupp I learned to ride on.
 
Not complaining about the cost or performance of a box stock sled - you pay to play. I guess in a nutshell, I'd like to see a manufacturer be more proactive instead of reactive. In regards to the M1000, it was and is a great sled - just had a bunch of setup issues, and Cat (in my opinion) didn't do their homework mapping it. My 07 was great until it had the 08 recall, took a bunch of tuning with a BD box to get it right after that. I've seen fuel pressures that were on both sides of the scale (38-50 lbs STOCK). No wonder half didn't run well. I suppose a good portion of the problem could have been rectified by the selling dealer, but they were more interested in selling me a new one then fixing the problems, hence a new selling dealer. Offering up a CSI index for franchised dealers may help them decide who should be representing them, rather then what dealer is in the largest demographic who bolts the skis on & kicks it out the door, or has the 16 yr old work experience kid do the PDI on your new ride. You have valid points, but if you had the dealer support and limited riding time in the winter (mine is due to work schedules) - you would expect your expensive toy to work well, not be choppered out, or sit in the dealer's shop for 1/2 the winter due to parts availability, no? I'm not saying they are doing a bad job, but they could strive for excellence and do a better job...if they aim higher and remember that the consumer pays the bills - nature of any service industry.

I do agree with you and hope you didn't take my prev post as bashing you or anyone in particular either.
 
All I want is my six dealer/riders back that were here five years ago, between me and my new "superdealer" which schedules repairs in terms of "weeks" rather than "minutes".

" Sure drop it off, we can take a look at it in five weeks"

"Hey drop in on your way to the mountain, It'll only take me a minute, mind if I ride with you today?"

Oh yeah, I'll take one of those two stroke 1000's also.
 
Premium Features



Back
Top