SnoWest is Dying

gonehuntnpowder

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It's important to remember it's a forum. That means there is "experts" that haven't road for years and guys just looking to start fights. That also means there is lots of good people interested in sharing there knowledge about something we are all passionate about. I personally enjoy this forum.
When I first joined it wasn't long before determined all the cool snowmobilers had turbos. After much soul searching I determined I was indeed a cool snowmobiler so I had to have one. It was a disaster. Never ran right, got it figured out about the time I was so sick of it I sold it for a huge loss.
Turns out none of this was sno west forum's fault. Keep up the good work, I enjoy it here. If you don't. No problem, BYE.
 

christopher

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When I first joined it wasn't long before determined all the cool snowmobilers had turbos. After much soul searching I determined I was indeed a cool snowmobiler so I had to have one. It was a disaster. Never ran right, got it figured out about the time I was so sick of it I sold it for a huge loss.
.
Turbos are almost ALWAYS a financial loss.
But, when they are dialed in, MAN, they are a BLAST to ride!
 

christopher

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Wow! Some pretty bold statements there.In my opinion, no forum is as bad as totally yamaha.
That made me laugh.
Totally Yamaha is NOT a horrible place.
When I was hard core in my 5 Yamahas I would go there from time to time myself looking for brand specific information if I wasn't able to find it here.

There IS room enough in this world for several different snowmobiling sites!
 

Teth-Air

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Although I don't like how LoudHandle behaves, he is on to something this time. As a manufacturer and seller of sled products, Snowest sure does not make this forum easy for a small business to grow. I have supplied product for testing (to Harris Pub.) and nothing has come of it. I am asked regularly for my advertising money but we simply are not big enough yet to afford to play with the "Big Boys". We can't even get listed in the vendors list unless we spend beyond $1000/year. R&D is expensive and we tirelessly work on new products and we are told by our customers that it is appreciated. We could easily just buy and sell the same products as everybody else and then maybe we could afford the cost to advertise. Finally we don't want a free ride and would up the advertising dollars when a magazine issue would include a real test of one of our products.

I know I don't make a real distinction between the forum and the magazine but from our point of view it is all the same.
 

christopher

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Although I don't like how LoudHandle behaves, he is on to something this time. As a manufacturer and seller of sled products, Snowest sure does not make this forum easy for a small business to grow. I have supplied product for testing (to Harris Pub.) and nothing has come of it. I am asked regularly for my advertising money but we simply are not big enough yet to afford to play with the "Big Boys". We can't even get listed in the vendors list unless we spend beyond $1000/year. R&D is expensive and we tirelessly work on new products and we are told by our customers that it is appreciated. We could easily just buy and sell the same products as everybody else and then maybe we could afford the cost to advertise. Finally we don't want a free ride and would up the advertising dollars when a magazine issue would include a real test of one of our products.

I know I don't make a real distinction between the forum and the magazine but from our point of view it is all the same.
Okay.
Just to make sure you and I are on the exact same sheet of music here.

Harris Publishing "OWNS" the SnoWest Forums.
But they do not manage or run it.
I run the site full time as a completely independent contractor.
They establish a set of guidelines for how they would like to me run it on their behalf, and the rest is pretty well left up to me.

That said.
I have absolutely nothing to do with the magazine nor with their advertising. They manage the "Boarders" (Top, Right Side and Bottom) of the forum space where the ads appear, I run all the internal content.

Over the last 10 years my experience has been that those manufacturers that chose to take on an ACTIVE role in participating in the forums themselves by posting and replying by far and away have the most success in promoting their products. And when myself or one of the other members does an "Installation and Review Article" those tend to get very good response.

Members desperately want HONEST UNBIASED feedback on what actually WORKS and what DOESN'T, and in today's market place that has become increasingly hard to come by.
 

Bendy

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Nostalgia is the golden age of fallacy. I seem to get more help on the forums now than I have in the past. I don't know if there are more or less people here? But that patina Loudhandle loves so much is a perpetual reminder that the past is long gone!
 
I have found that most of the forums wether it is a fishing site, old ford truck site,snowmobile site etc, all have the same deal, until you are well known or if you have a very good question you pretty much get ignored. you have guys that seem to know a lot but keep quiet, and some guys that apparently think they invented the sport. that being said there is a wealth of information you just have to look for it .

you never know what the job entails until you lace up the boots and walk in their shoes. just my .02 cents
 

johnathon007

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The real cure to the forum/snowmobiling dieing is to lower the buy in cost of machines. It seems all that the industry is doing is trying to make everything "better" and forgetting that some people don't need "better". A good 4-6k machine that can trail well and survive off trail would boost the sport big time. Ive still got a 1987 el tigre 530 kicking around that does just fine in up to 2' of powder with 1/2" lugs and a 121. There always will be a market for monster machines but most people really dont need them or even have the skill to use them.
 

Teth-Air

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Okay.
Just to make sure you and I are on the exact same sheet of music here.

Harris Publishing "OWNS" the SnoWest Forums.
But they do not manage or run it.
I run the site full time as a completely independent contractor.
They establish a set of guidelines for how they would like to me run it on their behalf, and the rest is pretty well left up to me.

That said.
I have absolutely nothing to do with the magazine nor with their advertising. They manage the "Boarders" (Top, Right Side and Bottom) of the forum space where the ads appear, I run all the internal content.

Over the last 10 years my experience has been that those manufacturers that chose to take on an ACTIVE role in participating in the forums themselves by posting and replying by far and away have the most success in promoting their products. And when myself or one of the other members does an "Installation and Review Article" those tend to get very good response.

Members desperately want HONEST UNBIASED feedback on what actually WORKS and what DOESN'T, and in today's market place that has become increasingly hard to come by.
So Christopher, so how about we send you a demo Phantom Teth-Air and you install it on your Doo and let your readers know if you like it? I guess the one we sent to Harris Pub. was a waste of time.
 

t300

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The real cure to the forum/snowmobiling dieing is to lower the buy in cost of machines. It seems all that the industry is doing is trying to make everything "better" and forgetting that some people don't need "better". A good 4-6k machine that can trail well and survive off trail would boost the sport big time. Ive still got a 1987 el tigre 530 kicking around that does just fine in up to 2' of powder with 1/2" lugs and a 121. There always will be a market for monster machines but most people really dont need them or even have the skill to use them.
$1200 onesies don’t help. Gearing up these days costs almost as much as the sled. Having said that the Polaris shift or Indy is a step in the right direction
 

MountainTrashCat

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Without derailing this further, I need to chime in now. Yes, the sport is freaking expensive. Many of us are trying to support a family. The sleds are expensive. The gear is expensive. The travel is expensive. But... (cue up mastercard commercial here...) the trips, the memories, the PEOPLE, they keep us wanting more. Yup, priceless. I love how my pretty much stock sled performs, I love how my gear keeps me warm and dry, I love how my avy gear keeps us safe(er), and I love how all the things I learn here help me enjoy the sport more. But it all costs money. And hey, if it was generally TOO affordable then the riding areas would be even MORE crowded and guys would be complaining about that. Bottom line, I give up a lot to ride, paid in the currencies of cash, gas, dirty hands, worn out belts etc etc... but it’s so much fun and it what keeps me going.

Ok, hopping off the soapbox now. And looking forward to pemby.
 

stingray719

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Lack of control of troublemakers has been the cause of the forum demise that I have seen. I posted the fix for the dreaded Viper front ends issue in the Viper section and I get bashed from a guy that doesn't even own a Yamaha but hangs around only to cause trouble. So I delete my post and move on.

Said my piece deleted my fix for the Viper and have no use to continue to come over here to be bashed by garbage trolls. Need anything you know where to find me.

Thanks.

Bill
 

christopher

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So Christopher, so how about we send you a demo Phantom Teth-Air and you install it on your Doo and let your readers know if you like it? I guess the one we sent to Harris Pub. was a waste of time.
I have to plead ignorance here, so please excuse me..

What does the Teth-Air do differently that the current Ski-Doo Tethered Key??
 

christopher

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Without derailing this further, I need to chime in now. Yes, the sport is freaking expensive. Many of us are trying to support a family. The sleds are expensive. The gear is expensive. The travel is expensive. But... (cue up mastercard commercial here...) the trips, the memories, the PEOPLE, they keep us wanting more. Yup, priceless. I love how my pretty much stock sled performs, I love how my gear keeps me warm and dry, I love how my avy gear keeps us safe(er), and I love how all the things I learn here help me enjoy the sport more. But it all costs money. And hey, if it was generally TOO affordable then the riding areas would be even MORE crowded and guys would be complaining about that. Bottom line, I give up a lot to ride, paid in the currencies of cash, gas, dirty hands, worn out belts etc etc... but it’s so much fun and it what keeps me going.

Ok, hopping off the soapbox now. And looking forward to pemby.
My turn to climb up on the soapbox..




I live in a college area where we have a TON of young people flowing through our community. Many that are absolutely PRIME candidates for our sport.

South East Idaho is FULL of people that LOVE the outdoors. And over the years I have taken a pile of these kids out on their very first ride. And most of them absolutely LOVED every minute of it.

But.
The cost of admission to play this game is HIGH.
And buying a well used cheap sled is a piss poor idea for someone who has NO connection to this sport and no set of friends ready to support them.

I came into sledding all by myself.
I had NO ONE take me out on a ride and NO friends that were sledders.

I drove up to Island Park and rented a sled one day.
Absolutely freaking loved it.
Went back and rented again, but took my wife and kids.
They loved it.

Went out and bought 3 brand new sleds, and started the process of LEARNING what the heck I was doing all by myself. It was a long painful journey where I absolutely learned the HARD WAY damn near every step of the way. It was a LOUSY way to come into this sport.

This sport is INSANELY EXPENSIVE to get into in a serious way.
The sleds
The gear
The trailer
The Truck
Ect.

This is just not a simple affordable sport that the average joe can jump into. It's HIGHLY seasonal, so you're only going to get to use your gear for a few months of the year. It is HIGHLY location specific, which for most people means you must travel to participate. It is Maintenance intensive, and you are 100% at the mercy of the weather, over which you have NO control whatsoever.

In short, this is just a bear of a sport.
But, in my humble opinion, is FREAKING AWESOME and totally worth all that pain and hassle.

But the reality is fewer and fewer NEW riders are coming into this sport, and if it's going to survive, more than anything else, WE NEED NEW RIDERS joining and strengthening our ranks.
 

LoudHandle

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I have to plead ignorance here, so please excuse me..

What does the Teth-Air do differently that the current Ski-Doo Tethered Key??
I don’t want to speak for Teth-Air; but in short it is a leashless tether. I believe low power RF transmitter is worn and a receiver is mounted on the sled, if they loose communication with each other the reciever assumes you are no longer in control of the sled and instigates the shut down.

Feel free to correct any of my assumptions. I can edit or delete this as appropriate.
 

Adam12

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I want you to know that I truly appreciate Snowest, Christopher. I think I was a member in another life when I lived in N. Utah from 1999-2006. I'm still trying to find the video I posted here of my buddy and I braaaaping around the Monte area on our Yamahas to some Audioslave song.

At any rate, I love popping on here each day to learn about my current sled and read what is going on in other manu's worlds. We have a good, strong community here and I'm happy to be able to add my $.02 as I can.
 

Bendy

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Lack of control of troublemakers has been the cause of the forum demise that I have seen. I posted the fix for the dreaded Viper front ends issue in the Viper section and I get bashed from a guy that doesn't even own a Yamaha but hangs around only to cause trouble. So I delete my post and move on.

Said my piece deleted my fix for the Viper and have no use to continue to come over here to be bashed by garbage trolls. Need anything you know where to find me.

Thanks.

Bill

The best way not to get your feelings hurt on a daily basis is to remember... "What other people think of you is none of your business". I can't believe how much whining and crying goes on these days!
 
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