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05 Liberty 700 occasional bog problem

M
Dec 2, 2007
230
27
28
Glencoe, MN
I have a 04 Pro XR with a 05 liberty 700 motor. I have been to the snowy mountains twice this year and when riding down the trail to get to the snow after about 3 miles or so it acts like it all of a sudden runs out of fuel or going into "retard mode". I have diagnosed it back and forth from fuel to electric thinking it might be a bad cdi box??? I have so far put in a new temp switch, new thermostat, took out inline fuel filter, tryed different fuel pump, and its still being dumb. I am gonna take apart my carbs AGAIN and maybe put in new needle and seats and maybe floats. Any other ideas would be awesome cuz im getting frustrated. Thanks Jay
 
M
Dec 2, 2007
230
27
28
Glencoe, MN
I live in Minnesota so yes I have ridden at low elevations, same crap. The bog happens whenever it wants to it has happened going fast and bucked me off over the hood and it has happened when I tryed to start moving? When we were in the snowy's last week it didnt do it the whole first day at all so i thought I had it fixed by putting in the new thermostat but then it started again the 2nd day. Is it bad to not run a thermostat at all??? May be i could rerule out the thermostat if i took it out and it still ran crapy. I dont know if i said this already but it only does it after "about" 2 miles on trail or if i climb a decent hill it will do it the last 1/8 of the hill but not every time??? If it runs crapy and I stop and shut it off it wont start right away and when it does it runs good again for about the same "2 miles", Even if i just stop and play with the throttle to keep it running it will clear up and then let it idle for a bit then it will take off again for aways??? Extremely confusing I know believe me.
 
X

XC700116

ACCOUNT CLOSED
Oct 2, 2007
8,130
340
83
Milliken, CO
I would look towards The DET sensor, CDI or your stator. I doubt that the cooling is the issue. Don't run without the Thermostat. You can be riding hardpack and have it warm up then get fresh cold snow cooling the water too fast and then cooling your cylinders faster than your pistons causing them to seize. The risk is minimal but it is there. If you have any buddies with an 04 or 05 700 swap CDI's and see if that fixes it, or moves the problem to the other sled. Do the same with the DET sensor. Also make sure your running the correct plugs if you get a set of non-resistor plugs it can damage your coils or CDI.

Does your motor have any Mods? especially heads? if so it may be actual Deto and you need to do something with your fuel. Although it should happen way more in the flatland than in the elevation of the Snowies.

If you still can't find the problem I would lean towards your stator.
 
X

XC700116

ACCOUNT CLOSED
Oct 2, 2007
8,130
340
83
Milliken, CO
If you think you might have an airlock just let the motor run with the coolant bottle cap off until it starts circulating water. With the heat building up it should force the air out but watch it because the water level will start to rise and you will need to cap it again before it starts coming out. Also raise the front end higher than the back of the seat/coolant crossover hose (with the sled cool) and let it sit for a while then loosen the bleeder screw on the thermostat housing until all air if any stops coming out.
 
M
Dec 2, 2007
230
27
28
Glencoe, MN
were is the DET sensor located?? what does it look like?? I never though about possible air lock i will try that also. As far as mods it just has SLP single pipe and can and kick a$$ shorty pods. (I want a airbox if you know of anybody with one for a 04 proXR) The sled originally came from a factory polaris team as a 726 mod sled but it does have all the same coolers as my 03 pro xr with 01 700 that runs awesome. It does the bog in powder as well as on the trail so I dought it is actually over heating but it might think it is, is that what the DET sensor is??? As far as spark plugs i have always run NGKRes.
 
X

XC700116

ACCOUNT CLOSED
Oct 2, 2007
8,130
340
83
Milliken, CO
DET sensor is a round black disk bolted to the botom of the head between the cylinders directly below the thermostat housing w/ a small black 2 wire cable coming from it to your CDI. Your CDI should be from an 04 or 05 machine and say DET on the side of it. Does the machine have PERC Reverse? If not and or If you have an older CDI and no DET sensor on an 04 or 05 motor you will need to change the flywheel to get the timing curve correct. Get one from an 02 or 03.

Also try running a set of Champion RN57YCC plugs this is the OEM reccomendation and was specificly developed for Polaris libety twins. The NGK cross reference is not a direct replacement and could get heated causing detonation. I know a lot of guys hate Champ plugs (especially in fuji motors) but I personally have had little to no problems with them in domestic twins.

Do you have a temp light, and Prem light in your tach and do either of them flash when the bogging starts?

Your carbs should also have a TPS sensor (Throttle position sensor) on them (MAG side CARB) This controls the timing curve and must be correctly adjusted. If we get past all other problems I can send you the test box that I made and you can check it and send it back to me. This can cause al these issues and overheating even in good snowconditions.

If you have an airlock in your cooling system (very common on all edge sleds) it won't matter what your snow conditions are, it will overheat.

Where do you have your CDI mounted if you do not have an airbox? Don't mount it to any part of the motor, the vibration will destroy it.

Also since you don't have an airbox it is extremely important that your exhaust system is seald well, including the outlet in the bellypan. if you suck exhaust into your carbs it will bog like a mother.

Let me know if you find anything. once all other options are exhausted we can check into the TPS
 
M
Dec 2, 2007
230
27
28
Glencoe, MN
yes it does have perc (but i dont have it wired so it doesnt work) the cdi does say DET. The cdi is mounted on a aluminum bracket that is riveted to the bulk head solid just over the jack shaft beside the oil resovoir.

The temp light and the Prem light dont do anything when it bogs.

I just looked and the exhaust is leaking back where the pipe and can come together. It doesnt look like much but it is a little black around that area. I will high temp silicone that.

I have a bad feeling now that you say something about the tpi. I checked before we went out west last time to make sure the carbs were going WFO and there was about 1/4 inch of slide left before WFO. I adjusted the throttle cable so it went WFO and loaded up and went. There for meaning it has been that way the hole time i have owned this motor and it has run like this the hole time aswell. But it also has been getting worse this year than last year to.

there isnt much snow here anymore to test much. Hopefully it snows soon cuz feb. 18th to feb.23rd im going to the big horns.

I just called NAPA and there are delevering sprak plugs tomarrow.
THANKS Jay
 
X

XC700116

ACCOUNT CLOSED
Oct 2, 2007
8,130
340
83
Milliken, CO
The temp light and/or prem light will blink when deto is sensed by the Det sensor.

I would hook up a perc button to it (a simple push button in console will work fine) just because there is 2 different maps in the cdi that you can switch between on that motor. 1 for below and 1 for above 6000 ft. If you need an electrical diagram I can email you one (in fact I have an electronic copy of the service manual for 05 RMK's so it might come in handy). The electrical schematics also show where to check your stator and at what values.

PM me your info and I can mail you the TPS test box (just need a few bucks to cover the postage) or if you can read a schematic I can email you it and you can build your own. about $10 in parts from Radio Shack and about 20 minutes to put it together. Polaris and SLP get over $100 for the f-in thing. One other option is I could build you one and send it for $20 total (i'm bored).

Do you have a multi-meter that you can do some checking with? let me know what you need. I would hate to see you have to deal with this out west.

On another note, that's the same week I'll be in Island Park. :D
 
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