3" track on XP without extended chaincase

thegeneral · Oct 14, 2009

I just put a 3" Camo and 7 tooth Avids on my 08 XP without extending the chaincase or trimming the track. I have also lowered the front suspension bolt 1.5" and put Smitty's drop brackets on the rear. I have also ported the track with side by side 1-3/8" holes between the paddles.There is 130 thou clearance between the tunnel and the track. Everyone is telling me that this setup is going to " Hydraulic " or as ledoo said " snowdraulic "

My contention is that the track will only be carrying 15% or so of the snow that it actually treads and of that 15% or so at least a couple % will drop through the porting in the track. not to mention that there is 4 or 5 "v" notches cut into every paddle allowing yet more snow to escape.

all feedback appreciated.

Robbie · Oct 14, 2009

3" track on Xp

You have .13" clearance. The anti-ratchet points are .75" long. You are going to have to run your track very tight. If any slack gets up to the front of the tunnel, the track will hit the tunnel. The track will be fully engaged in the anti-ratchet teeth. Depending on how hard the track hits the tunnel, you will spin out the drivers or break the chain. The very least that will happen is a loss of track speed by having the track rub on the tunnel. Remember the purpose of anti-ratchet drivers is to allow the track to lift off the basic wheel of the driver and still be engaged via the points of the drivers.

xp mountainrider · Oct 14, 2009

I think with out doing the extended Chaincase it will loose alot of track speed because it won't be able to push the snow out fast enough with only 130 thou clearence between the top of the track to the tunnel IMO.

xp mountainrider · Oct 14, 2009

Guys, not looking to start a bashing match here. But i am really wanting to here everyone else's Honest Opinion on this aswell, I agree with what Robbie said but I am hearing of more and more people this year that are going to just try it with out the extended chaincase. Maybe the Helecopters will do very good this year taking out sleds with stripped drivers and broken chains...lol

Diamond8 · Oct 14, 2009

Not a bash...........but I completely agree with Robbie......extros are so you can run the track a bit loose to avoid suspension binding and decrease the rolling resistance a bit............now a tight track isn't going to "totally" bind the suspension or kill rolling resistance.........but at 0.130 thou........I believe that the track will be striking the front of the tunnel........it may not "snow-draulic" as stated above......but it may damage the tunnel, track, break a chain, or bind and kill track speed.

Not trying to rain on a parade.......if it were me I would probably try to run it like it is........like you and the other buddies you know.....but if after your 1st couple trips it hangs up......it would suck to have to tear it all apart in the middle of a good winter to try and do a drop and roll during the snow season. Just saying........it may be worth the extra time now to do it as prevention before the snow flies. Just one other opinion.......not a bash by any means.......

Cheers :beer; and good luck with which ever way you go!

Dave

P.S.----If you run it as is and it works please post up your experience so the rest of us can know how it went.

Revdawg · Oct 14, 2009

When i did the drop and roll on my Rev i went from .7" to 2.5" of clearance and it was the single best thing i did to it in a long list of mods. It made more difference than the big bore. I would say its all about clearance to get the snow out. Have a look at some of the vids of sleds with the skis in the air, there is a ton of snow coming out in front of the drivers.

my .02

winter brew · Oct 15, 2009

I would listen to Robbie, he has as much experiance with the 3" installs as anyone. Sounds like not enough clearance to me. I thought our 174-2.5 was about right with the 7T drivers. Let us know how it works out. :beer;

shoppingcart111 · Oct 15, 2009

I would listen to the people on here, lots of information. And if all the people that put that type of track on did the drop and roll there must be a reason for it. 0.13" is really not enough clearance once things start moving and packing with snow and ice.

xp mountainrider · Oct 15, 2009

I find it hard to believe that no one else have tryed to short cut this by not installing the extended chaincase. I thought there would have been at least a couple on here that tryed it before.

thegeneral · Oct 15, 2009

Great feedback,thanks

Thanks for the info guys.
I have everything I can cross crossed that this is gonna rock despite going against the seemingly conventional wisdom. Then with the money I save on the Avid extended chaincase, I can pick up one of BJ's 860 kits and really kick some butt this winter.

exprider · Oct 15, 2009

Snowdraulic

Snodraulic-
from the german term snine dreau lik.
Meaning to force binding. To cause mechanical interference. To limit or eliminate motion.
Generally used in conjunction with or in dealings were excess amounts of snow are carried forward in a snowmobiles tunnel
When limited space is provided to allow sufficient removal of snow.
While engineers design in sufficient clearance, often overzealous do it yourself sled modders circumvent design tolerances and create a situation where snodraulicing may occur.

cdnsleddog · Oct 15, 2009

Man this takes us back ten years...maybe twelve.
I have a list of buddies with "mountain mod machines" from some of the big names up here that they spent huge money on that did not work. It was because of this one issue.

Back then the solution was a new tunnel, do the drop and roll properly and watch for the smile on their face the next trip out. You need the clearance boys IMHO.

Spend the money on the extended chain case...

Beauford t · Oct 16, 2009

People want through this putting the 2.4 track under stock edge sleds.
There are lost still running around without any issues. I'm sure it is not ideal but just run it and I'm sure you will be fine

Teth-Air · Oct 16, 2009

Sure you may move some snow through the tunnel but I don't think anyone can say it will just be like the old days because this is a 3" track and there is much more room between each paddle to give room for the snow. Sure maybe these big paddles can pick up more snow but then again you would think that big paddles would provide more cooling to the heat exchanger and I have seen in many cases this not being true. I have seen guys go to a deeper lug track and the engine runs much hotter. Some say more loading but I'm not so sure.

As far as the track hitting is concerned, you may not be able to run the track too loose but any close clearance tracks that I have ever run did not hit at the front where the track bends around the driveshft. The track however did bounce and hit the top of the tunnel right under my seat.

Give her a whirl and please post your findings.

xp mountainrider · Oct 25, 2009

Guys, I went to the sled show here in Edm today and there was a few sleds set up with the 3 Inch tracks and regular chain case, I am very curious on how it willl work. I realize that it could get costly if it strikes, but I will watch to see how my Buddys performs and if it seems to run great I will jump on the wagon and Install one aswell. It will be a hell of alot cheaper then buying the extended chaincase and the install. I wasn't sure about this at first but I am seeing more and more done with just changing to the 7 tooth drivers and the 3 inch track.

roughriders · Oct 26, 2009

One of the xp's in the mountain magic booth in edmonton had the 3'' paddles with only different drivers, the guy didn't know which one's they were though. it looked to me like it had the same clearance as the stock track does.

CARBONDEATH · Oct 26, 2009

Yeah saw the same 2010 Orange and black 163. The drivers they had on it were avid 7 tooth 3.00 pitch. It had like 1/2 inch clearance from the end of the paddle to the cooler. I was there to buy a 174x2.5x16 and after talking with them decided a 162x3x16 would give me similar traction but more mobility in some situations. I bought the same setup from them at the show, going try it once my new skid comes in and if it doesn't work I will put on the avid extended chainsase.:beer;

xp174 · Oct 26, 2009

I've tried it ... doesn't work for all reasons listed previously. If You can afford the track You can afford the chaincase. A 21/2" track however works perfectly with the stock chaincase and 7 tooth drivers.

xp mountainrider · Oct 26, 2009

xp174 said:
I've tried it ... doesn't work for all reasons listed previously. If You can afford the track You can afford the chaincase. A 21/2" track however works perfectly with the stock chaincase and 7 tooth drivers.

What were you noticing mostly when you tryed it? Track speed, Hitting, To much snow and not enough clearence to get it back out.....ETC Please fill us in.

I went with the 163 inch 2.5 3 pitch 7 tooth but I am very curious on the 3 inch track. I haven't got to try my set up yet, I just put it on my 2010 sled.

Thanks

MtnDoo · Oct 26, 2009

<<Thanks for the info guys.
I have everything I can cross crossed that this is gonna rock despite going against the seemingly conventional wisdom. Then with the money I save on the Avid extended chaincase, I can pick up one of BJ's 860 kits and really kick some butt this winter.>>

Yeah - put the 3"lug in w/ stock chaincase against the better advice here, then invest in a 860BB and simply melt the edges off the track quicker!

Please post pics mid-season.
Great idea.

;-)

MD.

3" track on XP without extended chaincase

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