UHMW (plastic) snow eliminators
- Thread starter eludnu
- Start date
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rotax
Well-known member
Same thing I thought when I looked into them....
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eludnu
Well-known member
I'm building my own, since they aren't available. Yami first, then REV
Good luck with that! We did extensive lab grade testing on multiple heat released plastic formulas, natural non-coated 6061 aluminum with both a grained finish as well as non-grained finish, multiple hydrostatic nylon based powders, and hybrid combinations of poly powders thinking that the plastic compounds would be the ticket over our 6061 aluminum products for snow adhesion, ice crystallization, durability, hardness, surface heat signature. GONG! Plastic wasn't even in second place to our coated hydrostatic application EVEN IN SIMPLE ICE CRYSTALLIZATION AND SURFACE ADHESION. Shocking results as it was my theory that plastic would far outperform coated metals in at least snow sticking. It only got worse for plastic from there...strength and surface durability results were so far off of the charts that that project was completely abandoned and we settled on a hybrid formula of hydrostatic hard metal powder achieving the best over all coating product. Just another reason why Better Boards are the Better Product!
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longtrack156
Well-known member
The trouble I had with snow eliminators that I made was the spacing of the rungs for comfort.
A lot of the manufactured ones look like the rung spacing is wrong for me as I ride standing all the time.
These ones never collect snow but are hard on the feet as the rungs are too far apart, 3-1/2" spacing.
These are the latest that I made, I think the rung spacing will be much better, UHMW 2-1/4" spacing.
A lot of the manufactured ones look like the rung spacing is wrong for me as I ride standing all the time.
These ones never collect snow but are hard on the feet as the rungs are too far apart, 3-1/2" spacing.
These are the latest that I made, I think the rung spacing will be much better, UHMW 2-1/4" spacing.
yeah, cuz we know how great aluminum ski's would work, some parts have different requirements. you want skis to bend, not so much on the running boards.Yeah, that is why all the manufacturers run plastic skis. Give me a break.
with the good comes the bad. and sometimes the bad is outweighed by the need for a certain charactersistic.
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cpatts2000
Well-known member
I had fastlane's on my M1000 and I absolutely loved them, I would buy them again for sure, and by the way I had 2500 hard miles on them and had no probs.
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eludnu
Well-known member
F-Bomb, You make the best aluminum boards hands down! Your service and rep, stand by themselves, and is well deserved.
I may even have some of your boards on one of my machines. My understanding of the principles you mention is not close to yours either. (Ignorance sometimes is bliss.)I powdercoat large quantities of both steel and aluminum on a weekly basis, and I simply wanted to try something different, based largely on the fact that I have the material, tooling, and like to experiment. Snow sticks to my Phazer like it's a magnet. I'm more concerned with traction on the UHMH as it's slippier than snot. Should make for some good laughs from my riding buddies.
If my boards suck, will you take my order, or am I banned as a customer?
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longtrack156
Well-known member
I used 6/32 flathead machine screws countersunk. the foot traction will be the nylock nuts with about 2 threads sticking up feels like enough.
I hear ya! Expiramentation is fun if you have the time and energy.
Simply for adhesion......I spent a sick amount of time and money on plastics and testing only to find out what we were doing was close to better then with a little bit of mad scientist we formulated a coating that simply smoked plastic in every test. The world's foremost applied plastics company from Europe worked with us in depth and we tested and tested different formulas and applications. I had visions of all metal sled parts being encased in this formula and being totally non stick and revolutionizing the industry. Then you guys wouldn't know me anymore because I would be so stinking filthy rich!
I am here to tell you guys that if you cut out that exact pattern in aluminum 6061 or higher compression grade and coat it you will accomplish a better finish and far better performance then you do with any available poly compound or nylon based compound.
eludnu you might have to order under an assumed name. Maybe try reno911 when you order. Our fans get a discount!
Simply for adhesion......I spent a sick amount of time and money on plastics and testing only to find out what we were doing was close to better then with a little bit of mad scientist we formulated a coating that simply smoked plastic in every test. The world's foremost applied plastics company from Europe worked with us in depth and we tested and tested different formulas and applications. I had visions of all metal sled parts being encased in this formula and being totally non stick and revolutionizing the industry. Then you guys wouldn't know me anymore because I would be so stinking filthy rich!
I am here to tell you guys that if you cut out that exact pattern in aluminum 6061 or higher compression grade and coat it you will accomplish a better finish and far better performance then you do with any available poly compound or nylon based compound.
eludnu you might have to order under an assumed name
. Maybe try reno911 when you order. Our fans get a discount!Do you make some that fit 08-09 mseries. We tried some on 05-07 m's and worked better than stock but the snow still stuck and plugged up the boards after awhile. They might not have had this coating on them.
Being a long standing Senior SnoWester...maybe one of the very first....the powers that B at the home office in IF have me on a short leash! They know I'm relatively harmless. We've all had some good chuckles about the nonsense over the last 10 years. The good old days of me making dumb people smarter by making them realize how dumb they really are is GONE! {sortof} Oh well...I still think IT! bah ha ha ha
Yea for 09 I'm working on the newest Cat. Brad Story one of the more famous cat guys on the planet has been after me to do something about them. About ten other misc guys as well. Like you say...they look good in theory but they don't really work that great. It's a semi waste of time and money to do a first year model. You have to wait for the masses to figure out that stock just sucks. I tell them but it often falls on deaf reno911 like ears. Just like our current best seller, the XP. On those 05-07 Cat M series the coated ones really do outperform natural aluminum pretty significantly.
Sorry about the highjack....but it's all good info....now back to plastics
They know I'm relatively harmless. We've all had some good chuckles about the nonsense over the last 10 years. The good old days of me making dumb people smarter by making them realize how dumb they really are is GONE! {sortof} Oh well...I still think IT! bah ha ha haYea for 09 I'm working on the newest Cat. Brad Story one of the more famous cat guys on the planet has been after me to do something about them. About ten other misc guys as well. Like you say...they look good in theory but they don't really work that great. It's a semi waste of time and money to do a first year model. You have to wait for the masses to figure out that stock just sucks. I tell them but it often falls on deaf reno911 like ears. Just like our current best seller, the XP. On those 05-07 Cat M series the coated ones really do outperform natural aluminum pretty significantly.
Sorry about the highjack....but it's all good info....now back to plastics
Rob,
I have your Better Boards on my RMK... Sweet stuff...
I call BS on this one...
Your BB's ROCK for sure, but C'mon man!!
Are you talking about a plastic COATING on YOUR aluminum parts or are you referrering to UHMW sheet inserts???
UHMW could not be used as a coating for aluminum parts as it would not stick to it (unless you molded it AROUND the entire part)
UHMW... aka Ultra High Molecular Weight Polyethylene
UHMW will not allow snow to stick no matter what... even if you break the gloss with sandpaper.... used on USGC ice breaker rail caps, bow guards.....
Also used on snowplows, quality snowblower chutes, not to mention most of the Sled skis out there (Simmons uses Tivar, a trade name of UHMW by Quadrant polymers)
The bases of alpine snow skis and snowboards (known as Ptex...a brand name given to UHMW, which has a sintered structure to allow wax to enter the open matrix of the structure of the PTEX, but not absorb into the plastic itself... wax absorbtion is not possible with UHMW)....an unwaxed ski/board still slides down the hill pretty good, just have a look at the average rental ski/board out there (non demo)
...SAR air boats in icy areas have uhmw sheet applied to the bottoms of the the boats a UHMW is extremely Hydrophobic in nature (does not absorb water) and therefore ice can't stick to it either (the search and rescue boats would not work well with ice crusted to the bottoms of thier boats).
The Hyfax on my sled is UHMW... no snow sticking there either..... wait...all Factory hyfax is UHMW to think of it.
All of the factory idlers and drive sprockets (both involute and extrovert) are made of a lower grade of Poly Ethylene... HDPE.
I dont see ice caking up on these, unless you are talking about the 3 driver polaris RMK setup on the Dragons... that is held in mechanically between the drivers.
Ice trays in freezers are made of HDPE.
UHMW does not get brittle till waaaay below -100 C and it is super durable...it is used in concrete mixers and dock rub bumpers for our Navy's aircraft carriers
Some of the properties of UHMW
Now... it would be cool if you could use a UHMW compound as a powder coating material as THAT wouldn't ice up till the aluminum became brittle on the sled!!...
Sintered UHMW sheet (similar to PTEX) is actually used in artificial ice rinks if that gives you an idea of how durable and slippery it is.
I have your Better Boards on my RMK... Sweet stuff...
I call BS on this one...
Your BB's ROCK for sure, but C'mon man!!
Are you talking about a plastic COATING on YOUR aluminum parts or are you referrering to UHMW sheet inserts???
UHMW could not be used as a coating for aluminum parts as it would not stick to it (unless you molded it AROUND the entire part)
UHMW... aka Ultra High Molecular Weight Polyethylene
UHMW will not allow snow to stick no matter what... even if you break the gloss with sandpaper.... used on USGC ice breaker rail caps, bow guards.....
Also used on snowplows, quality snowblower chutes, not to mention most of the Sled skis out there (Simmons uses Tivar, a trade name of UHMW by Quadrant polymers)
The bases of alpine snow skis and snowboards (known as Ptex...a brand name given to UHMW, which has a sintered structure to allow wax to enter the open matrix of the structure of the PTEX, but not absorb into the plastic itself... wax absorbtion is not possible with UHMW)....an unwaxed ski/board still slides down the hill pretty good, just have a look at the average rental ski/board out there (non demo)
...SAR air boats in icy areas have uhmw sheet applied to the bottoms of the the boats a UHMW is extremely Hydrophobic in nature (does not absorb water) and therefore ice can't stick to it either (the search and rescue boats would not work well with ice crusted to the bottoms of thier boats).
The Hyfax on my sled is UHMW... no snow sticking there either..... wait...all Factory hyfax is UHMW to think of it.
All of the factory idlers and drive sprockets (both involute and extrovert) are made of a lower grade of Poly Ethylene... HDPE.
I dont see ice caking up on these, unless you are talking about the 3 driver polaris RMK setup on the Dragons... that is held in mechanically between the drivers.
Ice trays in freezers are made of HDPE.
UHMW does not get brittle till waaaay below -100 C and it is super durable...it is used in concrete mixers and dock rub bumpers for our Navy's aircraft carriers
Some of the properties of UHMW
- The highest abrasion resistance of any thermoplastic polymer
- Outstanding impact strength even at very low temperatures
- An excellent sliding material due to the low coefficient of friction
- Self-lubricating (non-caking and sticking)
- Sound dampening properties
- Good chemical and stress cracking resistance
- Easily machined
- Extremely Hydrophobic
Now... it would be cool if you could use a UHMW compound as a powder coating material as THAT wouldn't ice up till the aluminum became brittle on the sled!!...
Sintered UHMW sheet (similar to PTEX) is actually used in artificial ice rinks if that gives you an idea of how durable and slippery it is.
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BTW... Rob, are you going to Reno in 2 weeks?
