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Great Burn action needed!!

hilpulr

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Dec 3, 2007
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Corvallis MT
This is an email i received from Stan Spencer please read and leave constructive comments on the webpage provided.

There could be decisions made by the FS this week re:the Travel Plan that our comments could impact. Also the comment website will only handle about 140 words so comments need to be concise and brief.

I need everyone to comment - not just Great Burn riders. The outcome impacts Forest and Travel Plans everywhere.

TALKING POINTS FOR COMMENTS ON CLEARWATER NF

Adjacent to the proposed Clearwater Great Burn RWA are 3,873 million acres of Congressionally approved wilderness. Selway-Bitterroot, Frank Church and Gospel Hump. This is the largest almost contiguous wilderness area in the lower 48 States. Population centers within the region are not placing any additional demand for additional wilderness acreage.

The Clearwater Forest Service presented the participants in the Collaborative process the results of a study that showed documented access into the backcountry by foot power has remained static over the past five years yet motorized use has doubled. This study conflicts with the desire to reduce historic motorized access and increase pedestrian only access.

There are no similar areas in the Clearwater NF to duplicate or even come close to offer the experience snowmobilers enjoy in the Great Burn Area. The closest area to similarly duplicate this experience would be 400 miles north in the Revelstoke, BC area, which has several primitive snowmobile access areas.

There is no documented evidence of any species that need protection in the Great Burn Area. Snowmobile tracks are gone when the snow melts which negates any impact on other social or ecological values. Snowmobiling causes no depreciation of the wilderness resource.

Region one guidelines allow for boundary adjustments to a proposed RWA to accommodate historic motorized use. The proposed boundary adjustments within the Great Burn RWA presented to the Clearwater NF Collaborative participants on March 8/2014 accurately reflect the acreage historically used by snowmobilers. There are no user conflicts in the winter months.

The 2012 Travel Plan did not present any documented evidence that would substantiate a need to close the historic snowmobile areas to snowmobiling. It is very doubtful that the Record of Decision will stand up to a legal test.

_________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

The information outlined above is a guideline that examines a minimum of factors the Forest Service must consider when determining a need for more wilderness. While I personally do not feel we need any more wilderness, I can support a wilderness designation for the Great Burn that includes boundary adjustments to permanently keep our historic snowmobile areas open.

Take a look at the above material and frame your comments around them. This particular comment session is to show continued support for snowmobile boundary adjustments. We out commented the wilderness advocates substantially last year which was a determining factor for getting our proposed boundary adjustments to the table. The wilderness people will have this figured out and will likely be taking counter measures. Your comments will make a difference. There will be two more formal comment opportunities (I'll advise dates) as the Collaborative Forest Plan progresses.

The Judge handling the ISSA lawsuit recently ruled that the three senior Forest Service officials including Tom Tidwell that are involved with the 2012 Clearwater Travel Plan can now be deposed to a discovery. This means our lawyer can ask them questions pre-trial and ask for specific information. Of particular interest is the guidance Region One has for managing a RWA as DEFACTO WILDERNESS.

It is critical that you emphasize in your comments that the Collaborative Forest Plan must adhere to the proposed boundary adjustments for snowmobiles because it is very probable the 2012 Travel Plan will be partially or fully overturned in a legal action.

TIME IS OF THE ESSENCE. THESE COMMENTS MUST BE SENT THIS WEEK. My gut instinct tells me there could be an OPPORTUNITY for real meaningful negotiation on the Travel Plan now that the deposition ruling has been made. The more comments, the more leverage we have. DON'T BLOW THIS OPPORTUNITY!!!


The website to comment on is: Http://my.usgs.gov/ppgis/studio/launch/4290

If any questions call me at 406 544 0144 or stanspencer@montana.com
 

Blown Motor

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Saw this yesterday and took the chance to poke around a bit! We are close as a group to finally having an authoritative hand in sled related backcountry issues. Please, take the time to read over this guys/gals!! Also, if you havnt read the article in the last issue of Snowest that Stan wrote. Page 8, letters to the editor.
 
ALL MOTORIZED SPORT LOVERS NEED TO COMMENT PERIOD.

get in your thoughts, comments, etc... and ask every single person you know to do the same...

everyone loves to quickly chime in to complain ,,, so here's your chance to complain and make a difference if you do it in a constructive way...

NO EXCUSES, COMMENT :rant::rant::rant::amen:
 

Summit74

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Commented last evening. Who's next! Please comment...it really is some of the best riding in the lower 48 and it could be illegal forever if action by all is not taken!!
 
regardless of where you live you NEED to comment YOU MUST comment.

This is the easiest most simple way we have ever been able to band together and show support of the sport.

All you need to do is send a simple 140 word or less email .

come on
post up if you have commented and lets see how big how fast we can build this thread...

We only have a couple days to get it done.
 
also if you know of or are a member of any Mountain Biking Forums please share this there as well..

this closure also shuts out PEDAL POWERED VEHICLES>>>>to noisy!!

there is no reason that we can't overwhelm the email and web site with our comments ....

spread the word!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
also if you know of or are a member of any Mountain Biking Forums please share this there as well..

this closure also shuts out PEDAL POWERED VEHICLES>>>>to noisy!!

there is no reason that we can't overwhelm the email and web site with our comments ....

spread the word!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
R

rmscustom

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Jun 8, 2010
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Only 53 members have viewed this... I would think if Christopher can PM everybody about the Yamaha snow weight video:face-icon-small-win maybe something like that could be done for this.
 
R

rmscustom

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Jun 8, 2010
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Another email from Stan today. Everyone that views this please take the couple minutes it takes and comment on the above link and the email address below even if you don't ride there.


Sandra Mitchell passed on an idea that sending comments directly to Rick Brazell, Clearwater Forest Supervisor, might have more impact due to some of the Travel Plan issues recently surfacing in conjunction with the Collaborative Forest Plan. I suspect Rick would only see a recap of comments if they go to the e-collaboirative site but if they come directly to him it may peak his attention. I think it is well worth the effort.
This is an opportunity to send a more comprehensive comment if the word limit on the e-collaborative cut you short. You can also just send a copy of your e-collaborative comment. email: rbrazell@fs.fed.us
Stan
 

Scott

Scott Stiegler
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Remember, its important to argue points for content....but ALSO procedure!!!

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

More from Stan:

Sandra Mitchell passed on an idea that sending comments directly to Rick Brazell, Clearwater Forest Supervisor, might have more impact due to some of the Travel Plan issues recently surfacing in conjunction with the Collaborative Forest Plan. I suspect Rick would only see a recap of comments if they go to the e-collaboirative site but if they come directly to him it may peak his attention. I think it is well worth the effort. <?xml:namespace prefix = "o" ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:eek:ffice:eek:ffice" /><o:p></o:p>
This is an opportunity to send a more comprehensive comment if the word limit on the e-collaborative cut you short. You can also just send a copy of your e-collaborative comment. email: rbrazell@fs.fed.us Stan<o:p></o:p>
 

Scott

Scott Stiegler
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Doh, you beat me to it. I hadn't even looked to see what the new posts said. LOL
 
I

IndoubtGASIT

Well-known member
Nov 26, 2007
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Everyone, please comment! We DO NOT need any more wilderness that doesn't allow snowmobiling. We have already lost enough riding areas. Lets fight to keep this area open!
 
you need to comment on both areas the USFS and the email.
don't take a chance on them only accepting one!
On the USFS site look at the top on the map area you will see an area you can read and respond to the comments that others have posted.
get on there and respond to some of the idiotic comments you will find.
Don't stoop to their low life levels but comment , once you read a few you will understand what I'm saying.
Also look at the great number of people wanting it open ,,, how is it we are always ignored!!
 

Scott

Scott Stiegler
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I saw that a couple of emails came in from Stan while I was on the mountain today.
What was Stan talking about with the goat comments?

I must have missed out on something.
 
there are quite a few comments on the USFS site about how sleds are decimating the Mountain Goat population in the great burn.

They wont comment on the fact that there if 15 feet of snow and no animals up that high.
These college educated idiots have never heard of migration of animal heard's or hibernation of certain animals
come on you know mountain goats can tunnel amazing depths to get to the foods they need .. heck that's why we don't see them!! they go all subterranean on us in the winter.
 
I sure hope more people commented than responded on here!
if that is the type of response we put forth we might as well all start learning to ski and snowshoe.

close an area you'll have hundreds on here whine and moan.

have an chance to have your voices heard at a special meeting that just may set precedence for future closures and nothing...

it is literally a five minute deal to do both comment areas..
plus they are allowing you to comment on the other entries on the USFS site


Not a good showing of support I must say
 

hilpulr

Well-known member
Premium Member
Dec 3, 2007
554
118
43
Corvallis MT
Great burn

I have left comments on both the website and email! Let's keep this going. People that don't ride here need to comment also - remember Cooke borders wilderness - if they can close this area what's to say Cooke is not next! We need to be proactive. Thanks
 
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