PMS kit going to the dyno

R44guy · Dec 18, 2011

PAT2 said:
Did you try a Dyno port pipe? That pipe worked best for me but BMP was really close to it. I also got 2.5 hp more with dyno port muffller vs stock with dyno port pipe. Just wondering how it works on a motor with the fix it kit. I noticed when I'm riding that the BMP stock mod pipe make my sled run a lot hotter.

Pat2, I have not tried a dyno port pipe and I have heard of some good power gains or increases about them on the pro but I have not heard or seen any published HP numbers for the IQ's or the CFI 800's.

I understand dyno port makes a good high quality product and I was surprised to hear that there can/muffler made power compared to all the others that lose power. I would sure like to learn more about how they make power when the others have been unsuccessful. If you run both there pipe & muffler together may explain the increase together like SLP does but if you ran there pipe with the factory muffler the power increase would probably be greater as is all of the other after market exhaust manufacturers have been.

Obviously the right combination of components with the right tuning makes all of the difference in the world power wise but with out the basics like installing a MtnTk/PMS Polaris Piston update fix kit or something similar you woul never have a good consistent platform to start with to then build off of.

I am not sure about getting adequate tuning on a track dyno but I imagine the track set up applies resistance or pressure like or similar to the engine dyno? I do not have any experience with this kind of dyno. This SW forum is sure a nice tool to share repair information with other like minded sled heads or owners.

R44guy · Dec 18, 2011

PAT2 said:
Did you try a Dyno port pipe? That pipe worked best for me but BMP was really close to it. I also got 2.5 hp more with dyno port muffller vs stock with dyno port pipe. Just wondering how it works on a motor with the fix it kit. I noticed when I'm riding that the BMP stock mod pipe make my sled run a lot hotter.

Pat2,

Sorry I forgot about your sled running hotter with the BMP pipe. You are correct the pipe mod traps some additional heat in the pipe but if your not running a PCV adding a bunch of extra fuel the engine is too lean up top. My PCV map is like a +5 & + 6 up top and then it runs close to normal from what I recall from my dyno tune sessions.

KJAssault · Dec 18, 2011

R44guy,
the track dyno i was on had a water brake on it so the could load the engine and run at any rpm at any load% for as long as you wanted it was pretty cool. i have sent the map to a few guys to look at. just wondering if any of you have gave it a shot. how'd it run. wish I could run mine but the weather is Bad for sled guys. today 57*F so no snow = no riding= SUCKS

R44guy · Dec 18, 2011

KJ,

Thanks for the update and here in MN we had record high temps here today too and still no snow so I know what your talking about. Did you use any additional cooling options during the dyno session or did you have to let it sit and cool down between pulls?

PAT2 · Dec 18, 2011

R44guy said:
Pat2, I have not tried a dyno port pipe and I have heard of some good power gains or increases about them on the pro but I have not heard or seen any published HP numbers for the IQ's or the CFI 800's.

I understand dyno port makes a good high quality product and I was surprised to hear that there can/muffler made power compared to all the others that lose power. I would sure like to learn more about how they make power when the others have been unsuccessful. If you run both there pipe & muffler together may explain the increase together like SLP does but if you ran there pipe with the factory muffler the power increase would probably be greater as is all of the other after market exhaust manufacturers have been.

Obviously the right combination of components with the right tuning makes all of the difference in the world power wise but with out the basics like installing a MtnTk/PMS Polaris Piston update fix kit or something similar you woul never have a good consistent platform to start with to then build off of.

I am not sure about getting adequate tuning on a track dyno but I imagine the track set up applies resistance or pressure like or similar to the engine dyno? I do not have any experience with this kind of dyno. This SW forum is sure a nice tool to share repair information with other like minded sled heads or owners.

This is the first Dyno Port pipe I have had and it is a well built pipe. Dyno Port is more Skidoo. My buddy's that have ski don'ts have always been happy with there DynoPort stuff and Rich always does good at the races. I spent a whole day at the dyno testing different pipe combos and maps. Glad I did I would be mad if I had just bought a SLP pipe like everybody else and then found out that for $200.00 less I could have a DP pipe and 17 more hp! Or for $125.00 I got BMP stock pipe mod and made 14 more hp than the $684.95 pipe. The 17 HP was worth the money for dyno. I still can't get over the difference in pipes. I would like to see how they compare on stock motor. Only thing not stock on my motor is the head, porting, Swain tech coating and pipe. The FIX kit was not out when I did this or I didn't hear of it. I have 3900 miles on sled 1000 since build and everything is excellent. From day one I have never had problems with this sled. Motor looked good when apart except chipped reeds. If I had to do again I would look into the FIX kit and 2010 cylinders. Hopefully this one holds up and I wont have to do again. I always let it warm up to 100deg before ride. For some reason my sled has 10LBS more fuel pressure than any other at dyno or dealer and it seems my stock ports measured different than other 09 800's. These sled are really each there own! On MY sled the dyno port with stock muffler makes less hp (-3) (168) than with the DP muffler (171). I'm not the only one who has had best luck with the full DP pipe and muffler. I believe Casey Mulkins found the same. That's why Rich Daly a.k.a. mad scientist. wins more races that others. He can find that extra 2-3 hp that nobody else can. At least on my sled and Casey's. Never seen any other info on stock motor and DP pipe. He doesn't even advertise HP on website. Sorry If I got of topic a little bit.

R44guy · Dec 18, 2011

PAT2 said:
This is the first Dyno Port pipe I have had and it is a well built pipe. Dyno Port is more Skidoo. My buddy's that have ski don'ts have always been happy with there DynoPort stuff and Rich always does good at the races. I spent a whole day at the dyno testing different pipe combos and maps. Glad I did I would be mad if I had just bought a SLP pipe like everybody else and then found out that for $200.00 less I could have a DP pipe and 17 more hp! Or for $125.00 I got BMP stock pipe mod and made 14 more hp than the $684.95 pipe. The 17 HP was worth the money for dyno. I still can't get over the difference in pipes. I would like to see how they compare on stock motor. Only thing not stock on my motor is the head, porting, Swain tech coating and pipe. The FIX kit was not out when I did this or I didn't hear of it. I have 3900 miles on sled 1000 since build and everything is excellent. From day one I have never had problems with this sled. Motor looked good when apart except chipped reeds. If I had to do again I would look into the FIX kit and 2010 cylinders. Hopefully this one holds up and I wont have to do again. I always let it warm up to 100deg before ride. For some reason my sled has 10LBS more fuel pressure than any other at dyno or dealer and it seems my stock ports measured different than other 09 800's. These sled are really each there own! On MY sled the dyno port with stock muffler makes less hp (-3) (168) than with the DP muffler (171). I'm not the only one who has had best luck with the full DP pipe and muffler. I believe Casey Mulkins found the same. That's why Rich Daly a.k.a. mad scientist. wins more races that others. He can find that extra 2-3 hp that nobody else can. At least on my sled and Casey's. Never seen any other info on stock motor and DP pipe. He doesn't even advertise HP on website. Sorry If I got of topic a little bit.

Pat2,

Thanks for sharing all of the info and keep us informed how your sled stays together. I will do the same!

PAT2 · Dec 18, 2011

R44guy said:
Pat2,

Sorry I forgot about your sled running hotter with the BMP pipe. You are correct the pipe mod traps some additional heat in the pipe but if your not running a PCV adding a bunch of extra fuel the engine is too lean up top. My PCV map is like a +5 & + 6 up top and then it runs close to normal from what I recall from my dyno tune sessions.

Yep that additional heat that gets held in the pipe is what helps it make more power. The hotter the center section the more power. It would make my sled run about 25 deg. hotter vs Dyno Port pipe. Which will start to make it lose hp do to hotter motor. I think mine is ok tho cause it runs 118-123deg with DP pipe and 140ish with BMP mod. 145 isn't to bad. Those are the temps I dynoed at also with stock cooling system. I wonder If I could keep motor at 120 with BMP pipe if I could get 2-3 hp back. then that would mean that $125 mod could make same hp as DP pipe. huh. just thought of that. Might have to go back to dyno! lol That's the best part about my sled and the BMP stock pipe mod. I can run that pipe with stock heat shield on it for stock appearance, with out a PCV, just April flash and still get 165hp trail ride able, no deto. I have a map that will bump it to 168 if I want to run PCV. My fuel pressure being 10lbs higher than most helps. (There is a good tech article on RK-Tek website about fuel pressure and fuel controllers.) When you open my hood it looks bone stock

KJAssault · Dec 19, 2011

R44guy said:
KJ,

Thanks for the update and here in MN we had record high temps here today too and still no snow so I know what your talking about. Did you use any additional cooling options during the dyno session or did you have to let it sit and cool down between pulls?

R44guy
ya at the dyno we took coolant out and plumbed in web water at let it run slow.

Pat2
the dyno port has a heat shield on it like the stock one? or did I read that wrong

PAT2 · Dec 21, 2011

KJAssault said:
R44guy
ya at the dyno we took coolant out and plumbed in web water at let it run slow.

Pat2
the dyno port has a heat shield on it like the stock one? or did I read that wrong

No the Dyno Port is ceramic coated. The stock pipe with the BMP mod done to it has heat shield put back on it. Looks stock I mean it is stock He! He! He!

KJAssault · Jan 21, 2012

ok brought old thread back! just wondering if the guys I sent my map to are having good luck or if they had to mod it at all. finally got to ride mine at home and thing rips here and in mountains. just wondering your results?
Happy Snowmobiling!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

ajbond · Jan 23, 2012

I didnt dare take fuel away in the mid. Goes against everything said about the lean mid range. top end is the similar to the 157 stoutner. this is what I just ran in 40" of fluff on sunday. top end was killer, mid was blubbery but on the last 2 miles before getting back I lost a reed pettal. Hurray for Vforce. These will be replaced with boysens not for sure if this was the reason mid ran bad. I modded the stoutner map by cutting everything over +20 by a third and adding on top 1% to be safe.

Jeff95 · Jan 24, 2012

KJ,

Added fuel in mid range (+1 to +4).
09 Dragon 800, Fix kit, 13.2-1 SLP head, SLP pipe/can, PC5, MTX 68 w/1gram in belly &Running 08 ECU map.

I have had it out a couple of times in this fresh deep powder and it rips. It pulls hard and runs clean with no bobble in mid range. I also pull about 8150 RPM on hill climbs.
This sled has never ran better!

Start at 4250 and ended at 8750.

0 0 4 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
0 0 4 3 0 0 0 0 0 0
0 0 4 3 0 0 0 0 0 0
0 0 4 3 3 0 0 0 0 0
0 0 0 3 3 2 0 0 0 0
0 0 0 3 3 2 0 0 0 0
0 0 0 0 3 2 2 0 0 0
0 0 0 0 3 2 2 0 0 0
0 0 0 0 0 2 2 1 0 0
0 0 0 0 0 0 2 1 0 2
0 0 0 0 0 0 2 1 0 0
0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 -2 -3
0 0 0 0 0 0 0 -1 -2 -3
0 0 0 0 0 0 0 -1 -1 -2
0 0 0 0 0 0 0 -1 -1 -2
0 0 0 0 0 0 0 -1 -2 -1
0 0 0 0 0 0 0 -1 -2 -1
0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 4
0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 4

Jeff95

gerrman · Jan 24, 2012

Jeff95 said:
KJ,

Added fuel in mid range (+1 to +4).
09 Dragon 800, Fix kit, 13.2-1 SLP head, SLP pipe/can, PC5, MTX 68 w/1gram in belly &Running 08 ECU map.

I have had it out a couple of times in this fresh deep powder and it rips. It pulls hard and runs clean with no bobble in mid range. I also pull about 8150 RPM on hill climbs.
This sled has never ran better!

Start at 4250 and ended at 8750.

0 0 4 0 0 0 0 0 0 0
0 0 4 3 0 0 0 0 0 0
0 0 4 3 0 0 0 0 0 0
0 0 4 3 3 0 0 0 0 0
0 0 0 3 3 2 0 0 0 0
0 0 0 3 3 2 0 0 0 0
0 0 0 0 3 2 2 0 0 0
0 0 0 0 3 2 2 0 0 0
0 0 0 0 0 2 2 1 0 0
0 0 0 0 0 0 2 1 0 2
0 0 0 0 0 0 2 1 0 0
0 0 0 0 0 0 1 0 -2 -3
0 0 0 0 0 0 0 -1 -2 -3
0 0 0 0 0 0 0 -1 -1 -2
0 0 0 0 0 0 0 -1 -1 -2
0 0 0 0 0 0 0 -1 -2 -1
0 0 0 0 0 0 0 -1 -2 -1
0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 4
0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 0 4

Jeff95

Jeff95....what elevation are you running at? I think we, at least I do, still need more detailed info on what the actual differences are between the original '08 ECU flash(recommended by PMS for the Fix kit) and the original '09 flash and the '010 update flash. With the Fix I am currently running the '010 Update flash, PCV, SLP 70-216 Map. There still is a little Grrr at 5800-6200. It has not affected anything, throttle response, no bog. It is just a little noisy, then gone. I would like to get rid of it, however. Add fuel, take away? Tried the original '09 flash, it was terrible. Only have a few rides on the current flash/map setup.

Garth · Jan 24, 2012

Update flash

gerrman said:
Jeff95....what elevation are you running at? I think we, at least I do, still need more detailed info on what the actual differences are between the original '08 ECU flash(recommended by PMS for the Fix kit) and the original '09 flash and the '010 update flash. With the Fix I am currently running the '010 Update flash, PCV, SLP 70-216 Map. There still is a little Grrr at 5800-6200. It has not affected anything, throttle response, no bog. It is just a little noisy, then gone. I would like to get rid of it, however. Add fuel, take away? Tried the original '09 flash, it was terrible. Only have a few rides on the current flash/map setup.

Not too many are running the original update flash, I had mine running nice with it and the SLP 70-217 map with accelerator pump enabled(PCIII) before "the fix", spent a couple days last spring with the fix and same mapping and ran strong but seemed way more sensitive to tripping the DET sensor, even went into limp mode a bunch of times.. H2O temps were higher then usual too (hard snow) which I'm sure added to the problem.
Have not ridden this season yet.

I too am curious to try other Polaris flashes, but it ran so well at times on the update flash I don't want to mess with it too much. Low elevation here too.

Jeff95 · Jan 24, 2012

6000 to 8000'.
I started with the 2010 update flash and it went into limp mode all the time. It ran fine before the Fix Kit, 13.2-1 head and SLP pipe/can. I tried adding fuel and didn't help. My plugs where black. Talked to Shawn and went to the dealer and had them load the 08 flash. Cleared my PC5 map and ran great except a little bobbal in the mid range and fouling plugs. Added fuel in the mid range and this thing rips. My plugs are coco brown at all RPMs.

Jeff

jim9006 · Jan 25, 2012

FYI Guy’s, according to my copy of Polaris Digital Wrench the part numbers for the ’08 and the original ’09 flash are the same.

Race · Jan 25, 2012

I was talking to Shawn at PMS Polaris about 08 Flash Part number's and what he said was there is a different part number depending on your injector color.

gerrman · Jan 25, 2012

jim9006 said:
FYI Guy’s, according to my copy of Polaris Digital Wrench the part numbers for the ’08 and the original ’09 flash are the same.

Would it be possible for you to post the part number for us. I hope to get out this weekend, weather permitting and try two different PCV maps to see if I can get rid of my slight mid gurgle. Thanks

Race · Jan 25, 2012

I don't know about the 09 Flash but the 08 Flash part number's according to PMS Polaris is

4012137 injector color?
4012138 injector color?
4012139 injector color Yellow

jim9006 · Jan 25, 2012

Pretty sure I’ve posted all the information before… I’ll see what I can find.

############## EDIT ###################

The 800 has 3 injector colors (dots located on body of each injector) - Blue, red, Yellow. All injectors should be of the same color.

The 04-15-10 flash number = Blue 4013135 , Red 4013134 , Yellow 4013136

The 01-11-10 flash number = Blue 4013066 , Red 4013065 , Yellow 4013067

Original 2010 (AUG/Sept of '09) update flash = Blue 4012959 , Red 4012958 , Yellow 4012960

You can have your dealer run a "Service Report" and it will list the "Software part #". That will tell you what you have loaded.

##### END #######

I'll add the orginal '08 and '09 numbers later.

PMS kit going to the dyno

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