Your snowfalls are measured in feet instead of inches, can you imagine trying to use a plow like this through Thompson Pass? The snow would laugh!
State highway plow drivers
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Your snowfalls are measured in feet instead of inches, can you imagine trying to use a plow like this through Thompson Pass? The snow would laugh!
I concur, that the tow plow would be useless for our local snow. The record of which is 25 feet in 24 hours. The only way to stay ahead of that quantity of snow is a good crew with a good plan, good equipment and staying after it. A few good blowers to get it off the road, once it has been winrowed.
Because your highway gets shut down. You pay overtime to clean it up, to have police officers out there, ambulance, etc. You can only bill so much of that back. When good stop moving, they stop going through your state. Here in Colorado, if people from Denver can't get to Summit and Eagle counties to ski, you lose money. If people flying in from out of state, can't get up to the high country to ski, you lose money. If they decide to go somewhere else because our roads suck, you lose money.
Putting Mag chloride down saves time and labor. It prevents snow from sticking and makes it easier to remove once it is on the ground. It also is a great dust control. Salt, sand and mag are all needed. There are times they shouldn't use it, but you need to keep interstates and highways open. You can't just shut everything down in the state when there is a storm here. Buses need to move, people need to drive, goods need to be shipped, etc.
The argument of why do we plow and salt roads is about as valid as, why do we pave roads. Lets just use dirt roads and everyone can slow down.
That's strange, we live in a development with zero outside tax dollars maintaining our roads. Zero. We fund it 100%.
There is no chemical or sand used.
We have the snow cleared when needed, which is about one tenth of the plowing frequency seen on the local roads maintained by our tax dollars & salted.
So I guess it is possible to traverse a road which is not coated with salt.
There is no chemical or sand used.
We have the snow cleared when needed, which is about one tenth of the plowing frequency seen on the local roads maintained by our tax dollars & salted.
So I guess it is possible to traverse a road which is not coated with salt.
M
It's funny, I don't think I've ever talked to anyone around here that has anything good to say about salt or mag chloride because of what it does to our vehicles that we spend our hard earned $$$ on. In fact alot of people around here that I have talked to about it share my opinion, plow efficiently and sand only. Yet there are people on this forumn defending this cr@p that rots away our vehicles and trailers that we pay for, and are paying the state to do to us through our tax dollars. I'm curious if they are state workers trying to justify their jobs???? Or maybe they sell salt and mag chloride???? hmmmm.........:suspicious:
I work for MN, not hiding it or defending the state. I simply stated some things because it was obvious that some people are clueless about how or why salt works. It's plenty obvious that salt is bad on vehicles but your gonna lose that argument with politics when trying to defend either having safe roads to travel on or worrying about your vehicle rusting. The people and nature of this forum would rather have shtty roads and no salt cause well most of us drive nice rigs and couldn't care less if the roads are shtty or not, unfortunately we are not in the majority. Montana and the alike states are a different deal simply because your traffic volumes and amounts of highway are a fraction of what the Midwest has to cover.
Sand works great in some applications, such as intersections, and is cheap to, but sand doesn't break down ice, it clogs sewer systems, and is unrealistic to apply on our long stretches of highway.
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Towplow is interesting, haven't seen that before.
Screw the vehicles, they are replaceable. Salt, mag, and sand all prevent accidents which protect human life.
Wash your vehicle after each storm. It's not hard. Mag does corrode vehicle but its a hell of a lot easier on the vehicle than sand and gravel bouncing off the front of it.
I drove from Fort Collins CO to Vail twice weekly. Racked up 190k miles on my car doing so, there is little to no rusting.
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Wash your vehicle after each storm. It's not hard. Mag does corrode vehicle but its a hell of a lot easier on the vehicle than sand and gravel bouncing off the front of it.
I drove from Fort Collins CO to Vail twice weekly. Racked up 190k miles on my car doing so, there is little to no rusting.
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S
190K miles and not a sign of rust? Yea right! was the 190 in 5 years or less? Could you really see behind the fenders, inside the frame? Places where it is not obvious? That is where the rust starts. And until it starts eating through to the outside you will never know it is there. Then 1 day you are at the carwash and you blow a pin hole thru your fender and say WTF. Remember those late 70's and early 80 Chevy pickups that rusted out above the rear wheel well? Do you really think that anybody that owned one knew that they were rusting out until it came thru the paint? These new pickups today with the boxed frames are really going to have issues when they are 10 yrs old because the salt will get in but there is no way to wash it out. And your statement of to hell with vehicles they are replaceable. Wel obviously you have more money than you know what to do with so how about you replace mine for me every 5 years and I won't bitch about salt anymore. I have never owned anything less than 11 years. I own a 2010 3500 bought new and it likely will be my last pickup from here on out if it doesn't rust out. My car is an 04 and don't plan on replacing it for at least 4 yrs. I'm not rich.
M
More infinite wisdom from MileHigh. Love it when he shows up......
Wash your vehicle after every storm huh??? Yeah no prob, cause it's really easy to wash a vehicle when it can be below freezing for weeks on end. Replaceable huh......more great logic. Unlike some people in this throw away world we live in, there are still some people that can't afford to buy vehicles every 4-5-6 years. And so, we do our damndest to take care of them and keep them looking good for as long as we own them. But, then there's the people with the ohwell, it's replaceable attitude. The people that door ding your vehicle and don't give 2 $hits about it, the people that are to FU%$ING LAZY to walk another 30 feet to put a shopping cart back in a cart corral so the wind blows it into the side of someones vehicle, the people that say to hell with the vehicles let'em rot away from salt and mag chloride as long as I feel safe driving in the winter, notice I say "feel" safe, are you really?? Ever catch that $hit when it is freshly applied, slick as ice, much slicker than snowpack. If ya can't drive on winter roads I'm sure Florida, or Arizona would welcome you with open arms.
Actually yes. Hit a deer and the front fenders had to come off. Zero rust.
Only place that as any rust is on my winter steel wheels. Just a tad where gravel has wore the paint off them. Nothing a wire brush could knock off and repaint. Any paint that has been properly finished its a non issue.
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I own a 2006, a 2005 and a 1999. I hear you on not buying all the time.
Point is that life is not replaceable, a vehicle is.
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Point is that life is not replaceable, a vehicle is.
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I
I work for a municipality and work in snow removal/plowing 5-6 months a year, I don't know about you guys who have winter for only 2-3 months a year. Salt is necessary in SOME conditions. Throwing sand down can only give you traction but doesn't cut through the ice and hard pack snow, some residential streets where i work had 3 feet of hard packed snow on the roads because straight salt isn't used on residential streets.
There is a few different kinds of material we use. Anything below 20 degrees Celsius we use straight sand, Dry Sand. Salt does not cut ice effectively at temperature below -21 degrees. Anything above -20 we use a spiked sand mixture, which is anywhere between 20% crushed salt mix with 80% sand, to a 50%/50% mix of crushed salt and sand. High speed roads(70km/h and up) get straight salt in these situations. If salt wasn't used the sand just gets thrown off the road with passing vehicles.
Snow doesn't stick to dry cold pavement salts used to get it back to pavement and not hard packed snow.
When it comes down to it, would you rather have a vehicle with rust spots, or have lost a loved one?
There is a few different kinds of material we use. Anything below 20 degrees Celsius we use straight sand, Dry Sand. Salt does not cut ice effectively at temperature below -21 degrees. Anything above -20 we use a spiked sand mixture, which is anywhere between 20% crushed salt mix with 80% sand, to a 50%/50% mix of crushed salt and sand. High speed roads(70km/h and up) get straight salt in these situations. If salt wasn't used the sand just gets thrown off the road with passing vehicles.
Snow doesn't stick to dry cold pavement salts used to get it back to pavement and not hard packed snow.
When it comes down to it, would you rather have a vehicle with rust spots, or have lost a loved one?
T
From the hospital end of things, the really bad accidents are the most frequent on roads that have been inadequately cleared and icy or not yet cleared. Say what you will about salt and slop, but no matter what people are generally terrible at driving in anything other than dry pavement conditions :face-icon-small-dis
In theory a world could exist without road salt if the trucks were out plowing the instant snow was down and not getting stuck to the surfaces...
Also, not enough people have driven a rear wheel drive pickup around parking lots for hours of joy to know how to handle an emergency maneuver either...
In theory a world could exist without road salt if the trucks were out plowing the instant snow was down and not getting stuck to the surfaces...
Also, not enough people have driven a rear wheel drive pickup around parking lots for hours of joy to know how to handle an emergency maneuver either...
S
One last thought to those who say life is not replaceable. News flash!!!! It is. Do I need to have the sex talk with you people. Accidents happen on wet or dry or icy roads and people die. Life is not forever. I firmly believe that when it is time for someone to go, they go. There is nothing that is going to stop that from happening. Not even 5 million pounds of salt on an icy road. That is my belief and those of you who think salting a road is going to prevent that death, well you are entitled to your opinions.
M
LOL!! True!! We used to go to big empty parking lots at night to spin cookies and do power slides all the time as teens, even into early adulthood. Oh who am I kidding, I still do it every once in a while. Good Times!!!! :face-icon-small-hap
3' of hard pack because salt isn't used....NO WAY! That would be around 8' of unplowed snow to pack that thick. No salt is used on the residential roads where I live (Alaska), and I've never seen that much hard pack in an entire year. Salt and Mag are a substitute for good plowing. If you plow when the snow is falling and not after it fell, chemicals aren't needed. Properly equipped vehicles (dedicated snow tires) and common sense driving prevents accidents, not salt.
I
When residents push all their snow into the street it gets 3' thick, especially when snow drifts into the street with wonderful 60km winds for weeks on end. By no means am I saying salt prevents every accident, sand doesn't prevent every accident either. Accidents will always happen, using salt, sand, and calcium cloride help the odds for accidents to be avoided. I agree salt is not necessary at all times and there are other substitutions but we are talking on such a large scale that it would not be cost effective to swap everything over. Regular washing, and car care will help prevent rust.
Salt is cheap, almost all trucks are equipped to handle salt. Finding an effective non corrosive de icer and changing over all equipment to it would not be considered due to the cost.
And for plowing while the snow is falling. Cities are getting larger and larger, it's not possible to go down every residential street in the time frame of when the snow's falling. There is priorities to keep the major drags of the city moving.
6 years later and I still hate corrosive chemicals on public roadways.
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