M8 turbo electrical?

[Snofreak3]

09 M8 with Twisted Pump Gas Turbo

I can't figure this sled out. Sometimes it will run awesome, sometimes it will stall, sputter and puke.
Sometimes, when it does it stall and sputter thing, if I cut the power to the temp sensor on the bottom of the motor, it will run fine until the ECU senses that it's not getting info from it.
I rode it Saturday, and sometimes, the bottom end sounded like it wouldn't get going, other times it was the top end. I had it in my backyard a week ago and it flashed ECU 6; temp sensor short. So I just traced from the sensor to the switch, no rubbed wires, etc. I honestly don't know why it's doing what it's doing. Could it be the temp sensor itself? Why is it falling all over itself randomly (almost like a TPS issue)? Any help would be awesome!

 

[smokindave]

It could be your switch.
Your code should be there when you use switch.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Snofreak3]

It could be your switch.
Your code should be there when you use switch.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk[/QUW]

Which code? It eventually flashes a code when I switch it off (so the temp sensor is interrupted.)

 

[matt159]

charts to check resistance on sensors

just use an ohm meter to test the temp sensors.

don't need to remove them, just unplug & probe the connector.
i would test all 3 to rule them out.


water temp sensor
air temp sensor
pipe temp sensor

if those all check out it could also be your throttle safety switch.
other options also, but these are good ones to start with.

 

[av8er]

I had issues with my TPS

on a 09 m1000, so i disassembled the throttle, and installed a small screw in the TPS switch to disable it. never had any issues, and rode it that way for 2 seasons before I got Addicted to BOOST.

 

[Snofreak3]

on a 09 m1000, so i disassembled the throttle, and installed a small screw in the TPS switch to disable it. never had any issues, and rode it that way for 2 seasons before I got Addicted to BOOST.

So you disabled the TPS safety switch? Or what exactly does that screw do? Would it work if I'm boosted?

 

[Tonysnoo]

Just a point of clarification

TPS throttle position sensor is the potentiometer on the side of the throttle bodies to give a voltage feedback telling the ECU what position the throttle butterfly's are at.

TSS throttle safety switch is the switch in the throttle lever assembly on the handlebars, mostly used if the throttle cable goes slack from stuck open/iced throttle butterflies, linkage, or cable.

I think av8er is talking about the safety switch. When its not adjusted right it can act like you kill the motor when you just touch the throttle, but I don't think it would do the things you are describing... It sure wouldn't hurt to eliminate it at least temporarily for testing only.

 

[Snofreak3]

I think I got it... But the liquid???

So today, I pulled it out of my shop and took it into my garage. ECU 06 was flashing. So I killed it, started it back up, still came on... (Just to make sure it wasn't a fluke like I had on time) Still coming on every time I start it. So I start with the smallest thing to eliminate, the interrupter switch. Pulled it off and connected the wires. Started, no code. killed it, put back on switch. Threw the code, and while running, I pulled the wires off the switch and connected them. Code went away after about 10 seconds. I think that has been my problem. Since doing so it idles at 2300-2500 RPM as compared to the sputtery 1500 RPM.

Other question. I tipped it on its side to look at the connections a few days ago. Tipped it back up. The next day when I started it, it had gray liquid coming out the can, then it later had oil coming out. Not a lot. My brother thought I effed up the pistons, so I looked at them. Didn't see anything wrong with them. Then I got thinking, tell me if I'm right... When I tipped it, the oil from the turbo leaked out, over night, it gathered water/condensation and made the grayish liquid then the other few drops from the turbo being tipped came out after. Am I right? Should you never roll a turbo over??

 

[compound 1300]

Turbo

Check your turbo! Make sure it is spinning smoothly, it will have some play in it but not much. What you described is a symptom of turbo going out (good bottom end but no top end or vice versa) the gray liquid / oil could be bearing shavings seals on turbo go out and they will leek (blowby) you can roll a turbo over it's just like any sled you don't want to leave it upside down for extended periods of time. Your turbo oil tank may not have baffling in it so it could leek out while upside-down. Check pipe temp sensor and water temp sensor as mentioned in previous post. It could be the switch itself? Good luck!!

 

[av8er]

Yes, thank u tonysnoo

I was refering to the TSS throttle safety switch.

 

[Snofreak3]

So it got stranded on the mountain. I Changed the temp switch, the old one was shorting out. It ran great for an hour, and then I shut it down, wouldn't start. Yes, I did the temp switch everything every way possible. Pulled it till we got stuck, it was fluff. Went to the truck, got my king cat, came back, started, ran for 300 yards, saw the wrench (no code) then it shut down. Tried to drag it some more, an our later, it started rode it another 300 yards to the truck. I didn't let it warm up and it was throwing the knock sensor code (ECU 21) and it idled in the parking lot for a minute or 2 and died, wouldn't start again, and we had to pull it onto the trailer.

It has to be electrical. Like something heats up, and grounds out or sends the wrong signal. I just bought a cat manual and am going to test the coolant sensor on the bottom of the case and go from there..

Does anyone know what might be going on? Has anyone heard of this or had this happen?

 

[ketil]

Had the same problem on an old ZR EFI the capacitor in the ECU shorted. Had to switch ECU.

 

[matt159]

So it got stranded on the mountain. I Changed the temp switch, the old one was shorting out. It ran great for an hour, and then I shut it down, wouldn't start. Yes, I did the temp switch everything every way possible. Pulled it till we got stuck, it was fluff. Went to the truck, got my king cat, came back, started, ran for 300 yards, saw the wrench (no code) then it shut down. Tried to drag it some more, an our later, it started rode it another 300 yards to the truck. I didn't let it warm up and it was throwing the knock sensor code (ECU 21) and it idled in the parking lot for a minute or 2 and died, wouldn't start again, and we had to pull it onto the trailer.

It has to be electrical. Like something heats up, and grounds out or sends the wrong signal. I just bought a cat manual and am going to test the coolant sensor on the bottom of the case and go from there..

Does anyone know what might be going on? Has anyone heard of this or had this happen?

had some similar weirdness once from spark plug wires getting worn & shorting --- you may be surprised how much of the rubber coating is gone from vibration/rubbing together... sometimes exposes the copper if let go long enough. could be a lot of things... but that would be another easy one to inspect and hopefully rule out. if you didn't already, test the air temp & pipe temp sensor as well while you are at it.

what's your fuel pressure while this is going on? fuel pump failing as it gets hot? cools down & works for a while?

electrical gremlins are a special kind of hell. --matt

 

[Snofreak3]

So it's been sitting on the trailer for a couple days and needed to get it off this morning. Figured it would start since it's been 17 degrees here for 3 days... Started, died. Started, died. Tried cutting the temp sensor with the switch, same result. It fires right up, runs for 5 seconds, throws the wrench but no code, and kills itself. Wouldn't run for more than 30 seconds.

I don't have a pipe temp sensor, it's got the resistor in place of it. How would the air temp sensor mess it up? A day or two before riding it, it would idle funny sometimes, like 1600 rpm and all sputtery and sometimes it was good around 2300-2500 rpm.

 

[matt159]

silver lining?

since it won't run now... it should be easier to find the problem.

 

[Tonysnoo]

Just a few suggestions as I suspect you have compound problems by now working against you. As you know, when the temp switch is open the ecu drives the injectors on the very rich side. If you ran this way very long it's pretty easy to flood and foul your plugs. I suggest starting with some very basic steps to see if the motor will start.

My suggestions are in this order:
1) find a 1000 or 1500 ohm resistor. Temporarily install it in the water temp sensor circuit so that the ecu thinks the water temp is around 90ish. This is only to verify the water temp probe and circuit, don't leave it in permanently after you are done testing. (just a note: I like to install this resistor on my hot start switch. When the hot start is used the ecu thinks the motor is 90ish not minus 40 and doesn't put so much start fuel in, plus the code doesn't trip...when started and motor cools down, I switch back to the sending unit.)

2) replace your plugs with new(not old spares), gap them to .020. While you have a plug out of each cylinder look at the pistons as well as do a compression test to make sure you don't have some internal damage. You can remove the power valves pretty easy to look at the fronts of the pistons too.

3) Try to start, if it fires watch your fuel pressure. Make sure it stays up if it does you know you have fuel, a good pump, and the electrical power to run the pump

4) If it starts and then dies but fuel pressure stayed good, you may
need to check the fuel box settings and any error codes that pop up then.

5) If it doesn't start or just sputters other things to look at would be reeds, and ignition issues.

I don't mean to insult you with this really basic stuff, but sometime, we gotta go back to square one.

Good Luck!!!

 

[Snofreak3]

So I tried the resistor in place of the temp sensor. Typical starting routine. It would run and die. The one time AFTER I pulled, it all the sudden fired up and then died. It ran long enough for me to watch the display. Showed a wrench but no code. I've thought about unplugging the box to see if that's the issue. I'm afraid it sounds like a stator issue... What do you guys think??