Ski pressure on Alpha 2019

[Teth-Air]

I don't want to send this into a tail spin as I agree shock pressures is the first approach you should try but I will share with the forum on what I have been working on with my 174 AXYS. It too is harder to steer in spring snow compared to a Doo. I noticed the caster was fairly steep and turning the skis causes quite a bit of scrubbing of the skis. I am testing some proto-type top A-Arms that stand the spindles up more vertical by moving the top of the spindle forward. This has resulted in easier steering. The 155's and possibly the 163's may find this mod too twitchy but the 174 loves it. With the OEM's sharing the same geometry in the front ends with most of their line-up, I thing there has been some compromises made.

 

[summ8rmk]

Cats caster, trail sleds are 17° and mountain sleds are 27°.
Big difference in steering and sidehilling.
I'll deal with the increased steering effort for the improved sidehilling.

This is partially why ski-doos steer easy and sidehill worse....



Sent it

 

[Teth-Air]

Cats caster, trail sleds are 17° and mountain sleds are 27°.
Big difference in steering and sidehilling.
I'll deal with the increased steering effort for the improved sidehilling.

This is partially why ski-doos steer easy and sidehill worse....

Sent it

I agree with you and am just saying the longer the sled the more you can get away with more vertical caster and not be punished in the side-hill.

 

[Fredrik]

So whats the best compromise 27 degrees is to much skis tilt in alot
would 23-25 degrees still sidehill good and steer easier?

 

[summ8rmk]

So whats the best compromise 27 degrees is to much skis tilt in alot
would 23-25 degrees still sidehill good and steer easier?

I believe wyo was trying spindles in that range.

Sent it

 

[CO 2.0]

I tried those upper ice age a arms as well. Same ones Wyo is trying. It's still tough to steer. Does sidehill a bit better though. Overall though I'm in the middle on them. Creek bottom transitions are harder as it wants to stuff the front end more.

 

[Teth-Air]

The best way to deal with the heavy steering is to lighten the front end. Especially now that the Alpha is lighter in the rear (compared to twin rail) the weight distribution is more biased to the front. A light can, TKI belt drive and no E-start are the most obvious ways to address this.

 

[turboless terry]

There is more to the equation than lightening the front end. Skidoo is way more front biased than anything and steers twice as easy.

 

[Fredrik]

Seems like ice age are coming out with billet upper a-arms that changes geometry for easier steering this fall
im guessing they reduce caster angle.

 

[bcsnowdog]

I agree on e start just taking out stock muffler helps a lot on alpha. Wife has 16 600 with e start with can gripper skis with regular skags and steers way easier than stock.

 

[CO 2.0]

Gripper skis do help a lot. I ran stock and a gripper on opposite skis for a day. The stock skis catch a lot more and beat up my shoulders quicker.

 

[boondocker97]

Jason Nethercott's sled he has for sale right now has the SX/Riot spindles on the front with custom upper a-arms that look like they tip them up a little more vertical. No info on what the improvements or drawbacks are. just throwing it out there. Tipping the spindle forward at the top might have just given more tie rod clearance to the a-arm with those spindles instead of using a large spacer/bolt at the steering connection too.

Just a note when I put a new lower steering stem in my proclimb last season I noticed the steering with the sled off the ground was pretty stiff. I took the upper bushing back off and even with grease it was really tight over the painted finish. I used a piece of emery cloth to take all the paint off the top of the stem, reinstalled with grease, and effort dropped quite a bit. This is with the canada sled parts bushing. Not sure if the stock cat bushing up there fits that tight on a new stem.

 

[kiliki]

Grippers!

 

[Jviper]

My old sidewinder that was 100lb heavier on the skis, steered easier than my alpha hardcore. Only difference is the skis I think.

 

[bcsnowdog]

The bottom of 2020 skis look just like a polaris to me

 

[CO 2.0]

Might look similar, but they act a lot different on the snow.

 

[kiliki]

Might look similar, but they act a lot different on the snow.

This^^ takes about half of the effort with the grippers

 

[turboless terry]

What is needed to put grippers on the alpha? I was going to put mohawks on it but i might try grippers. I really hate cats ski loops.

 

[summ8rmk]

What is needed to put grippers on the alpha? I was going to put mohawks on it but i might try grippers. I really hate cats ski loops.

12-15 or 19-21 cat ski rubbers and 19-21 cat ski bolt, 12-15 cat ski spindle bushing.
Finally, gripper skis...
I prefer the 19+ cat skis in deep snow and gripper skis in set up snow.

Grippers push a bit more Cats turn quicker.


Sent it

 

[kiliki]

12-15 or 19-21 cat ski rubbers and 19-21 cat ski bolt, 12-15 cat ski spindle bushing.
Finally, gripper skis...
I prefer the 19+ cat skis in deep snow and gripper skis in set up snow.

Grippers push a bit more Cats turn quicker.


Sent it

This^^