Riot trenching

[eric82930]

I planned on slowing the rebound for the stiffer spring but want to wait until I decide on any compression changes. Its good to hear they ditched the bleeds. Falling rate shocks work way better without bleeds the shaft speed is so low at the bottoming point any bleed at all kills the damping force. I like to convert to scrader valves when there is room. Bleeding air from a no bleed shock is tricky but I don't worry too much if there is some left. Any damping inconsistencies from air foaming is negligable compared to the damping change we have to deal with from sub zero temps.

 

[hucklberryMT]

To me you would be better off putting the 3 inch paddle on the 120.. I am in Utah though...

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Do they make a 120 3" aftermarket track? Would it fit the current Riot? I am really hoping they come out with a 3" Riot so I can snowcheck one in April.

 

[wwillf01]

Do they make a 120 3" aftermarket track? Would it fit the current Riot? I am really hoping they come out with a 3" Riot so I can snowcheck one in April.

That's all I am waiting for...

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[SteepNdeep450]

If you are getting stuck on take off that has nothing to do with float, you need to get the weight off the ski and on to the track to get moving first. Try adding the preload back on the center shock and reduce preload on the rear. Is your strut short enough so the front paddles barely touch down before the back?

One tuning trick is to watch your forks when you first let out the clutch, if you are set up right you should see the forks extend when you let it out. Your comment "leaning back makes it better" is key that you don't have enough weight on the track for traction. Forget about floating that doesn't happen until 2nd gear or higher. Get it to go first then tune for float speed as conditions permit. Grease those threads on the rear shock and leave the lock nut loose and you can adjust it on the fly just as easy as clickers on the LE.

Reporting back from my ride Saturday, completely different snow conditions. Had a foot of newer snow on top of a really good base. I took a good amount of preload out of the rear shock, little back into the front and it was an incredibly different kit. Weight transfer is way more apparent, I didn't feel any bottoming in g outs. Felt better over whoops in the trail. Might take a little more out and see if it's too light. I was so much happier with how it was working, took off from a stop better. This kit shines when it gets the track spinning, seems like it gives up a little compared to my MH from a dead stop till it has some good track speed but after it does it goes just as good if not better. Taking some getting used to moving around more on the bike ha, the old chassis you could be so lazy and it didn't really change much. You can feel a big difference leaning back or putting your weight forward on a climb.

 

[eric82930]

I'm still riding a lot and really enjoying the spring snow with the riot in wheelie mode it is night and day more fun in spring. I think more people would ride later in the year if they had a properly set up riot.

A few weeks back when we got our first big warm up there was some really rotton snow I had to deal with on the down slope side of our mountain range. It had spring corn on top but you sink past your waist if you try to walk on it. The non-wheelie mode did climb better but it shoved the ski down under the corn layer and into the danger zone just like in early season pow. It was best to just leave in wheelie mode and pick better lines that don't go straight up.

Water skipping is best in non wheelie mode unless you have over 60hp.

 

[dooman92]

Eric, you or anyone you know have any track stabbing issues with a riot? One of my riding buddies has a riot and only had about 20 hrs or so when the front of rails stabbed and ripped the track. He is bigger guy (250) and rides hard but very familiar with set up. We had to tie up rails to get out. Front of rails seemed to walk around a lot. He advised that it was a known issue via the Facebook site but, I haven't seen much comment on this forum. His track was destroyed and I understand was replaced under warranty.

 

[eric82930]

Did he hit a log or stump? I've never had trouble stabing a riot. The rail caps look the same as aro. My 15 kit stabbed all the time it was a dumb design rail with no cap. I put rollers on my 15 but don't think the riot needs them.

 

[dooman92]

I was two bikes behind him and I don't recall a stump being involved. I'm uncertain what dynamics were involved. I do recall thinking the front of rails were fairly easy to push sideways and that when the rear was significantly compressed the rails pivoted down into the track at a significant angle. We were able to ride it out a few miles but had to keep front of rails tied up high with a strap and when that strap slipped the rail speared the track again.

 

[Hawkster]

Your best set up is limited , the shock positions are the dead give away . The skid is constantly searching for traction . They came out with someone else's skid and botched it for what it's famous for . This kit theoretically should and would of ran circles around the other . The skids swing arm and shocks are battling each other .

Relocate the shocks

 

[Specialkman2day]

Hawkster,
Where would you recommend relocating the shocks?

 

[Hawkster]

That's trial and error , with a bunch of holes from the back yard mechanic . It's set up for ditch pounding . What they haven't taken into consideration is that these machines are limited when it comes to floatation , quit thinking snowmobiles .Bump stop it like a dirt bike if you have to , valving , it's gonna cost ya
What they have in common with the sleds is bashing first , mountain riders second , majority rules .

 

[eric82930]

I'm not sure I understand what your saying? How are the shocks and swing arm battling each other? The riot swing arm is so long it doesn't create any down force or lift like an aro. So there is no force for the shocks to battle with... It's neutral force all the time weather your on the gas or not. Beyond that it's just simple spring preload and if shock position is limiting rail contact don't relocate the shocks just adjust the strut. But it still requires trial and error testing to fine tune your setup.

 

[wwillf01]

I'm not sure I understand what your saying? How are the shocks and swing arm battling each other? The riot swing arm is so long it doesn't create any down force or lift like an aro. So there is no force for the shocks to battle with... It's neutral force all the time weather your on the gas or not. Beyond that it's just simple spring preload and if shock position is limiting rail contact don't relocate the shocks just adjust the strut. But it still requires trial and error testing to fine tune your setup.

I think this goes for any kit... whether I have ran timbersled, mototrax, yetis there was at least 5 rides to get dialed and even then you could get picky per conditions and snow type...but i always pick a setting that works well in all conditions instead of perfect in one or another... so many different geometries of bikes and kits. Takes a little time is all.

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[cbc76am]

Such a true statement. I've been on a lot of kits and they all need to be tweaked to work correctly for your riding style. Boondocking isn't ditching and the riot can do both... but it takes a lot of preload changes to get there. Speaking of the Riot... i'm pretty bent right now... cause my front shock carrier is bent to ****. To make it wheelie they made the front shock so soft that it slams through the travel and mangles the bottom mount. My skid was running half an inch left on the front of the track. I didn't notice until I just went to install an anti-stab and the wheels were not landing in the drive lugs. Guess it's time to change springs and potentially change the valve stack. Wheeling is over rated anyway, as long as it still lifts under power and steers off the rear I'll be happy with the Riot over the Aro - not that I won't keep the Aro too.

 

[cbc76am]

oh and they want 570 dollars for this hunk of shiet

 

[eric82930]

I was worried about durability for the longest time but I've beat the pizz out of it and not concerned any more. My back shock was over filled from the factory and didn't go full stroke before hydro lock. You might have had the same issue with your front one. If the rails are allowed to hit the rubber I can see no way for bottoming to bend anything and I've hit mine hard. Catsledman said his cracked at the lower shock bracket so might been slightly over full as well. I suppose some crazy ice build up could possibly bend things too. Whatever happened though the aro does look more stout on paper but anything can break.

 

[eric82930]

I've been out on days where a mototrax was floating better and breaking trail for me. I put a few twists on the rear spring and the riot was equal for climbing and breaking trail (with a skinnier track) but not as playful. I switched it back same day and left it in wheelie mode. I just had more fun going a half mph slower but felt like riding a real dirt bike. And it was a big advantage going down hill in creek bottoms. The mototrax works well after all the updates but "wheelie" isn't in it's vocabulary so it can lawn dart quite easily on the opposite side of a creek crossing.

 

[cbc76am]

My buddy is an ambassador and said he's seen lots of these bent. They also updated it silently for 2021 apparently. I'll be filing a warranty claim or fabrication is on deck. It's carbon steel, I'll bud a chromolly one.

 

[Hawkster]

I'm not sure I understand what your saying? How are the shocks and swing arm battling each other? The riot swing arm is so long it doesn't create any down force or lift like an aro. So there is no force for the shocks to battle with... It's neutral force all the time weather your on the gas or not. Beyond that it's just simple spring preload and if shock position is limiting rail contact don't relocate the shocks just adjust the strut. But it still requires trial and error testing to fine tune your setup.

Yes , I agree with what you are saying but to add to that an E-Z-Ryde skid will smoke this knock off . The straighter the shocks the deeper the trench . It's not a dirt bike anymore .

 

[eric82930]

I think the ezryde skids always had a pretty smooth approach angle. I suppose a Riot s might be closer to what ezryde was in the front track angle. I personally wouldn't try to copy an ezryde it would end up like a camso with the drivers too close to the ground. You would get the magic float factor though if that's all you want.