• I've received emails and PM's asking me about "Group Buys" and promotions.

    A Group Buy here on SnoWestOnline.com would be a situation where a normal member (non vendor or mfg) personally collects orders from other members. That member then uses those orders to negotiate a better price with the Vendor/Mfg for HIS/HER "Group" of buyers.

    Here is an example of a viable "Group Buy"

    http://www.snowestonline.com/forum/showthread.php?t=269222

    A promotion that has the words "Group Buy" in the title is still a promotion, and from the rules that were handed down to me by Harris Publications is that non-advertisers cannot run promotions or open sales programs on the forums outside of the swapmeet.

    If a members wants to become a group buy manager, maintain a thread and collect the funds and negotiate a group buy... as a member, you are welcome to do that as long as you are not attached to the business of the vendor or Mfg.

    If you are a vendor/MFG and you want to offer an EXCLUSIVE "SnoWestOnline ONLY" promotion that is exclusive to snowest readers, please contact me and you'll be able to put it up in the Polaris forums.

    Also, before any vendors/mfgs get all "riled up" over this know that the moderators are strictly volunteers and do not receive a dime from any advertising $$ spent on this site.

    As ALWAYS, since DAY ONE of me becoming a moderator, I have pioneered, supported and encouraged vendors and mfgs in getting the word out to our readers with "New Product Announcements.

    Have a great season.

    From this point on, all vendors/mfg's promoting Pre-Season tiered sales programs, in the Polaris Forums, that are not paid advertisers will be appropriately moved to the swapmeet section of the forums.

    MH

Kreating Khaos, 162" extreme and other easy mods

Prayn4snow

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Starting a build on my 2020 Polaris 850 Khaos. For those that know me, I spent a lot of time on the Khaos last winter so I have a solid baseline to start with on how the 155" handled in different snow conditions. Polaris only offered the Khaos with a 155" track with the 2.6" or 3" factory tracks. I posted my conversations with Kurt's Polaris last spring where he would convert them to longer tracks for customers. But to save money they were using the Composit tracks. Mine will use a Camso, I'll talk about the difference later.
I wanted to start this build weeks ago after Haydays but after looking at all the track options and going over my notes from previous tracks Ive ran I wanted to try out the new Epic by Camso. The 162" Epic just came off the assembly line and shipped to Tracks USA, it looks like a pretty amazing track. In the meantime I ordered a set of IceAge Khoas 162" rails. The rails are awesome and you will see some side by side pics to see the differences between the stock rails and the stronger IceAge rails. I have much more planed for this sled and you will see some basic bolt ons that anyone can do. Polaris did a great job with the Khaos with excellent shocks and fun nibble suspension geometry. The goal is to keep that playfulness and add a little more traction. Some other parts and mods I will do soon: Performance clutching, RSI handle bar options and billet controls, TKI belt drive and geardown kit, Bumpers, performance parts and more. If you have questions I will try to answer them.
Check out more on the Camso Epic at: https://shop.tracksusa.com/camoplast-epic-280-detail.htm?productid=-8534691
More on the Iceage Khoas rails here: https://iceageperformance.com/rmk-khaos-rail-kits.html
 
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Prayn4snow

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As on my previous builds Tony and family at Tracks USA in Lake Lillian MN have always been very helpful (pic below is by their shop). They have helped me make choices on tracks, rails, rail extensions, wheel kits, drive axles, drivers, anti-stab kits and more. Once again, to see what would fit so they can educate customers as well I drove down from Upper MI to their shop. The choice to start with a Camso Epic started weeks ago at Haydays taking to the reps from Camso and Tracks USA. They explained the new technology, changes to paddle configuration with its unique deep "cup-shaped" lug, gaining more track speed in deep snow, yet excellent flotation instead of trenching. Better sidehilling, and a multi duromomitor rubber that is stiffer at the base and ribs, and a bit softer on the edges and tips that you will see in the pics. I had particular needs and wants from a track and the Epic stood out as the best choice. IMG_7154.jpg
 
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Prayn4snow

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I usually weigh everything, even the things that don't seem to matter to some people.
1st pic is box with weight from a stock Camso Epic 162" coming in at 45lbs with every other window clipped. 2nd pic is stock Polaris track with same clipping, keep in mind this is a Shorter 155" track that weighs 48.5 lbs.
. IMG_7164.jpg





IMG_7206.jpg
 
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Prayn4snow

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I like to fully clip my tracks. You do gain a little weight (less than 2 lbs on this 162"). You can pick up track speed with less drag, cooler/longer lasting hyfax and they are easy to install. If you order the track from Tracks USA they can install the clips for you without the need to buy the expensive clip tool seen below. These are Camso part number AFT120107 that Tracks USA keeps in stock. IMG_7155.jpgIMG_7156.jpgIMG_7157.jpg
 

Prayn4snow

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Info on the durometer of tracks. I will add some pics below to show you the difference in the rubber at different points of the Camso Epic. Tony at Tracks USA can test any tracks you want with this tool.
The Shore durometer is a device for measuring the hardness of a material, typically of polymers, elastomers, and rubbers.[1]
Higher numbers on the scale indicate a greater resistance to indentation and thus harder materials. Lower numbers indicate less resistance and softer materials.
The term is also used to describe a material's rating on the scale, as in an object having a “‘Shore durometer’ of 90.”
The scale was defined by Albert Ferdinand Shore, who developed a suitable device to measure hardness in the 1920s. It was neither the first hardness tester nor the first to be called a durometer (ISV duro- and -meter; attested since the 19th century), but today that name usually refers to Shore hardness; other devices use other measures, which return corresponding results, such as for Rockwell hardness.

IMG_7158.jpgIMG_7159.jpgIMG_7161.jpgIMG_7162.jpg
 

Prayn4snow

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Before you start, Make sure you have all the tools and parts you need. Not naming names, but some of my buddies decide its a good idea to start a project at 10pm the night before riding :rolleyes:
Start by removing the side panels, factory drive belt and Driven (secondary) clutch with a 15mm. Keep "all of the washers and spacers together"!
Next, to make it easier I recommend removing the stock can, then remove your quick drive belt and lower sprocket. If you have a chain case refer to my chain case removal and replacement with pics here: https://www.snowest.com/forum/threads/my-camso-conquer-280-experience-with-tracks-usa-on-axys-850.446393/
Next remove the 17mm suspension bolts, then the T-40 bolts holding the drive axle.
Laying the sled on its side with a handlebar stand is easier for some unless you have a lift.
Remove the skid, you can do it by yourself but its easier with a friend.
When you remove the drive axle, it helps to turn the flange end to pull out of the hole easier. IMG_7163.jpgIMG_7168.jpgIMG_7169.jpgIMG_7170.jpgIMG_7171.jpgIMG_7172.jpg
 

Prayn4snow

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Keep track of your bolts and where they go. Once the axle is out you can take out the track. Now is a good time to inspect anything for damage. Bent suspension parts, ripped lugs on track etc. If you have a new pull off track, you might be able to sell it to help offset the cost of your new track. Tracks USA also buys tracks used or new pull offs. I don't know how much they would give you so call them at 1-320-382-6483.
Here is a couple side by side pics of my stock Polaris 2.6" 155" track and the Camso 2.8" Epic 163" IMG_7173.jpgIMG_7174.jpgIMG_7175.jpg
 

Prayn4snow

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I wanted the playfulness of the Khaos (which Ive already spent lots of time on), but with the slightly longer track so I ordered some new rails from IceAge. They make a great replacement for the stock or the Khaos geometry, plus you can get them in different colors. My snow check rails were red, but I ordered black Iceage rails. They can also cut the fronts for you like mine and add the anti-stab kit. As you can see they come with everything you need. I recommend cleaning off a table to work on. It's easier to swap if you pull components off one set of rails to swap to the other as shown. You will need 13mm, 15mm, and 16mm sockets and wrenches for the next steps.
Notes from their web site on the swap:
Replacement slide rails for your Polaris Axys Pro RMK KHAOS 800 and 850 snowmobile suspension.
Our Khaos rails feature a bend profile unique to the Khaos RMK. They have an increase bend radius designed to mimic the OEM rails. DO NOT install these rails onto an RMK with out additional parts (shocks, FTA, etc). Installing Khaos rails onto a regular Pro RMK or SKS will result in front track shock damage.
Designed and machined from 7000 series aluminum with special attention paid to cutout design and location to create a stronger, more durable rail package then OEM.
Classic rails are comparable in weight to OEM while being superior in strength.
Bomber rails have fewer cut outs to create a much stronger, more durable rail that can withstand substantial abuse in the backcountry.
We offer 146, 155, and 163 variations. This allows you to shorten, lengthen or just beef up your stock 155 with all of our different options.

Kit includes:
  • 2 rails
  • 2 hi-fax
  • 2 idler adjuster housings, bolts, and mounting hardware
  • Iceage decal
***Note*** Rails are cut to accomodate 8" or 9" rear idler wheels. Stock Polaris wheels are 7 1/4". I picked the 8" for mine. Appropriate wheels are required for proper fit and function. Do not run the stock wheels on rails configured for larger wheels, damage to your track/rails/wheels may occur!IMG_7167.jpgIMG_7165.jpgIMG_7176.jpgIMG_7177.jpgIMG_7178.jpgIMG_7179.jpg
 
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Prayn4snow

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Start assembly of the new skid. You will need to reuse most of the stock components including the rubber bump stops. The stock rear of the rails have the track alignment and tension adjustments riveted on, the IceAge rails are bolted. Note that I stacked the old and new rails on top of each other so you can see the difference in the webbing strength. It might not seem like much, Polaris did a great job on the design but wanted to cut out weight on the RMK's everywhere they could, this little bit of webbing doesn't weigh much, and its worth the weight in my view. My last set of IceAge rails on my 2019 were the IceAge Bomber rails, but I'm getting older and not hucking and chucking things big anymore lol. These rails Im installing now are the right combination of light weight and strength for me. They also have cross braces for the rear that are pre-drilled on the rails that I might add later. Notice two things, the limiter straps will appear too narrow on the anti-stab axle, don't worry, they are fine and intended that way. 2nd notice the difference in the front of the rails, same geometry but cut for the anti-stab kit I installed. IMG_7180.jpgIMG_7181.jpgIMG_7182.jpgIMG_7183.jpgIMG_7184.jpgIMG_7185.jpgIMG_7186.jpg
 
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Prayn4snow

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If your going to change the pitch of the track you will need to change drivers. The stock 2.6" is a 2.86 drive. Many other tracks are like the 162" I picked are 3" pitch. It's not hard to swap drivers but there are some tricks to it. I'm sure some of you guys can add your tips to swapping drivers or tracks. 1st you need to establish a baseline of where your stock drivers line up. You can take a square like the one shown and make some marks of the centers of the factory drivers your going to press off. This baseline will be used when you press on the new drivers. I will add some pics of side by side of the stock drivers and some Avid drivers sold by Tracks USA. One huge benefit to the Avid drivers is you can run the track much looser freeing up HP and letting your suspension travel more freely. If you look close, you will notice the Avid drivers are now pulling from the two outside ports that are now fully clipped instead of just 1 center port (besides the inside lugs) If you dont have a press, you can take your axle to a local machine shop or send your axle to Tracks USA or stop by their shop if you live close. Tony's dad Bruce is really handy in the shop, he has built many of the tools they use everyday including this huge hydraulic press! Next tip is to install the Hyfax slides after you measured and cut them then sand down the fronts to round them off smooth.IMG_7187.jpgIMG_7188.jpgIMG_7189.jpgIMG_7190.jpgIMG_7191.jpgIMG_7192.jpgIMG_7193.jpg
 

Prayn4snow

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Time to resemble everything. Start with stretching the track out and sticking the drive axle in.
Once you orient the axle into place I start the T-40 Torx bolts by hand, then use a ratchet to tighten them until getting to the final with a torque wrench. Yes, I used an impact driver to take them off, but I always hand tread them because they would be easy to cross tread. I use blue locktite on everything on the suspension. Before installing the clutches its a great time to look over everything on the motor. Check the wire and oil line routing, make sure everything is good or if something needs protecting from rubbing through. IMG_7194.jpgIMG_7195.jpgIMG_7196.jpgIMG_7197.jpgIMG_7198.jpg
 

Prayn4snow

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Since you have everything apart, it's a good idea to take a minute and drill out this hole on the bulk head that was overfilled with the glue that binds the chassis. The reason to drill it out now is if you ever brake the pull rope you can easily fix it in the field. To keep from side tracking this build there is more pics and info on a separate post here: https://www.snowest.com/forum/threads/tip-how-to-prepare-for-pull-rope-breaking-on-the-850.450849/ If your bulkhead is filling up with oil, check your Y-pipe connection. These take some time to break in together to seal. If after some run time if it's still leaking you can take it apart and add some high temp sealant. Some aftermarket Y-pipes tend to have a better seal and pick up a couple HP.

IMG_7209.jpgIMG_7210.jpgIMG_7211.jpg
 

shattuck

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Great write up. I had a brand new Polaris 2.6 163 track and new epic 280 163 I weighed them both the epic was slightly more then 2 lbs lighter don’t remember the total weight I already installed the epic so can’t weigh it again.
I weighed my 2.6 163 again and got 48.2 pounds a 155 2.6 should be 44 pounds
 
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FatDogX

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Great job!!
I cannot wait to hear the ride report on the 163 Khaos and especially some feedback on the track!!
 

Prayn4snow

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Great write up. I had a brand new Polaris 2.6 163 track and new epic 280 163 I weighed them both the epic was slightly more then 2 lbs lighter don’t remember the total weight I already installed the epic so can’t weigh it again.
I weighed my 2.6 163 again and got 48.2 pounds a 155 2.6 should be 44 pounds
Thanks shattuck! I get different weights depending on what scale I use so when I do a build like this I try to do apples to apples. I used the scale at Tracks USA because I could zero it out and it has a hold feature so if you cant get your camera focused at the window you can hit the hold button and pull the object off the scale without it changing. I don't doubt that your scale maybe different, I know the one I have at home is different yet lol. We got 48lb I think on my 155" 2.6". I will see if Tony has had differences in weight from one track to another. I have much more to post on here about this build but doing to many projects at once. Soooo more to come...
 

Prayn4snow

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Time for the next stage of this build: TKI belt drive/gear down kit shown here: https://tkicnc.com/product/2016-2019-polaris-axys-2-6-belt-drive/
Ive wrote before on several threads about gear downs and belt drive options. To keep this build on track and to answer questions about how to convert a chain case Axys to a belt drive see my previous post here: https://www.snowest.com/forum/threads/tki-adjustable-belt-drive-conversion-for-axys-850-axys-rmks-install.448444/

There are several reasons I switch to the TKI belt drive. 1. I like to be able to adjust my belt tension. 2. As you will see, there is a huge increase in belt clog contact to the upper pulley (18 clogs on a TKI compared to about 6 or 7 on the stock belt!) This is one of the main reasons people strip clogs off the stock belt and blow belts. 3. The TKI can be ran slightly looser because of the tensioner. 4. Because of the gear down from stock, my primary and secondary clutches and belt stay cooler and run more consistent. 5. Better track speed which sounds wrong, because its geared down your clutching runs more efficiently, this leads to lower under hood temps which makes the engine run more consistent. Why? The EFI sled constantly adjust fuel and ignition curves based many variables one of which is outside temp which is actually read from under the hood! More to come on this once I get to engine mods.
IMG_7199.jpg
 

Prayn4snow

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I wanted to lay out the TKI kit with the CNC upper and lower gears plus the CNC belt tensioner next to the stock Quick drive so you see the different components and wight differences. The stock is simply an upper and lower gears with a fixed tension belt that retails at ($239.99 just for the belt) here: https://snowmobiles.polaris.com/en-us/shop/maintenance/belts/2206046/ or you can get a spare TKI carbon fiber belt for only $80!! Yikes! The TKI belt is a way better deal!
I want you to note something here. The TKI drive is about 1lb heavier as a kit, but it's gears are actually lighter than stock for less rotating mass. When you pick up the gears themselves you can really feel the difference. IMG_7200.jpgIMG_7201.jpgIMG_7202.jpgIMG_7204.jpg
 
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Prayn4snow

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To mount the bracket for the belt tensioner you will need to remove a couple of the stock bolts that have some glue on them. It is strongly recommend that you heat these two up with a torch or heat gun to keep from stripping them. We soaked an old rag in water to keep the belly pan cool. Once those are out you can mock up the new tensioner bracket with the supplied bolts. IMG_7207.jpgIMG_7208.jpg
 

Prayn4snow

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Tom (owner of TKI) has some great instructions on each of his kits and if you have questions he is great to talk to. You can tell he loves what he does and if you ever see his shop, its pretty amazing. His wife Jen does and excellent job of keeping Tom inline running the CNC machines and keeping 3 yellow labs happy all while taking orders and answering my dumb questions over the phone lol. Did I mention made in the USA?!
Pics show gears mocked up. Note: If you run a stock can, you will need to shorten the tensioner bolt about 1". Call Tom if you want different gear ratios. IMG_7213.jpgIMG_7217.jpgIMG_7218.jpg
 
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