Gearing down 163" x 3" Chaincase

[HECKS]

I had seen you were running the Jaws pipe as well.
I'm just running Indy Dans adjustable weights and a 125/310 green spring. I have the Jaws Pipe and can running in non-eth mode at 4000-7000 ft.
I'm on a new primary clutch this season and the secondary is stock setup at the moment.

 

[HECKS]

Just went for a rip at home (2800 ft) to test the gearing out before heading out west. Weighted up the clutch to 68.6g & 125/310 spring w/ stock secondary.
Seat of the pants felt great and smooth engagement on the bottom end.
Had 3 passes in a field and seen 108 km/h ( 67 mph) at 8400rpm - so less 10.5% due to my gearing change, I should be at 97 km/h (60 mph) and clutches were fully shifted out.
Speed Calculator showed at speed of 99.3 km/h - so pretty bang on !
Belt cleaned off my felt markings. Will see tomorrow how it climbs in some fresh Revy snow.

 

[revrider07]

Well how did those gears work out?

 

[HECKS]

I'm still on fence about it. Bottom end pulled the skis great with good torque and got to speed quick on short in runs.
Ran 17/46 gears with stock secondary spring and helix all trip. Wish I would have tried a helix change but the snow was deeeeeep and was having to much fun I guess.

Primary started out with 68g and 125/310 spring. Belt to Sheave is 0.03" on new belt.
Last Thursday did a 1/2 day at Quartz in Golden to test with 2 ft of fresh snow, had 68 g weights and had to lighten up a few times and end up with 64g and switch to a 120/340 spring and only pulling 8050 - 8150. Weather was crisp at -15C (7 F) and speedo was hitting 78-80 km on a very steep climb.
With the gear down of 17/46 that is a 16.84% increase from stock. So my actual max track speed should have been 67 km ( 42 mph ).

Fridays ride just west of Revy was 3 ft deep, snowing all day, and high humidity at -5C (23 F). We broke trail all day in waist deep snow and tough to read the speedo. Intakes were constantly covered. Left primary alone at 64g & 120/340 spring, and was still around 8100 - 8200 rpm when brushing snow off the dash. Rode 60 miles and belt heat was decent, hot....but could hold a hand on it. Secondary felt a bit warmer.

Saturday clocked another 60 mile day south of Revy, and broke trail all day again. Dryer air but same temps -5C. Waist deep snow again with more of a base to it. Didn't make it up into the alpine due to the snow levels, so elevation was around 4000 - 5000 ft. Primary started the day untouched, sled was hitting 8600 breaking trail. Went back to the lighter spring 125/310 and added 3g = 67g. All day was at 8400 - 8500 rpm and pulled real good when on the Jaws pipe, but lots of times I was 10 mintues pinned and was getting into heat fade lots breaking trail.

Primary clutch was 5/8" from top and secondary looked like it was up shifted fairly well. Belt was glazing slightly and emery clothed it after day 2.
Thinking of trying the stock pipe with this setup next trip, and try out my MTN #1 progressive helix.
Sled now has 4900 km ( 3045 miles ) on stock pistons. Leaking down was just at 2% and Compression was at 120/125 psi at 3000ft.
Any advice is appreciated - my Aaen book is getting a work out again
Pictures are in order of this long ass story

 

[revrider07]

Looking at the primary with those gears you are not getting full shift out. I would start by trying more weight or less spring. Should have at most 1/4 in of primary not used.

 

[Ultrasauras]

I'm still on fence about it. Bottom end pulled the skis great with good torque and got to speed quick on short in runs.
Ran 17/46 gears with stock secondary spring and helix all trip. Wish I would have tried a helix change but the snow was deeeeeep and was having to much fun I guess.

Primary started out with 68g and 125/310 spring. Belt to Sheave is 0.03" on new belt.
Last Thursday did a 1/2 day at Quartz in Golden to test with 2 ft of fresh snow, had 68 g weights and had to lighten up a few times and end up with 64g and switch to a 120/340 spring and only pulling 8050 - 8150. Weather was crisp at -15C (7 F) and speedo was hitting 78-80 km on a very steep climb.
With the gear down of 17/46 that is a 16.84% increase from stock. So my actual max track speed should have been 67 km ( 42 mph ).

Fridays ride just west of Revy was 3 ft deep, snowing all day, and high humidity at -5C (23 F). We broke trail all day in waist deep snow and tough to read the speedo. Intakes were constantly covered. Left primary alone at 64g & 120/340 spring, and was still around 8100 - 8200 rpm when brushing snow off the dash. Rode 60 miles and belt heat was decent, hot....but could hold a hand on it. Secondary felt a bit warmer.

Saturday clocked another 60 mile day south of Revy, and broke trail all day again. Dryer air but same temps -5C. Waist deep snow again with more of a base to it. Didn't make it up into the alpine due to the snow levels, so elevation was around 4000 - 5000 ft. Primary started the day untouched, sled was hitting 8600 breaking trail. Went back to the lighter spring 125/310 and added 3g = 67g. All day was at 8400 - 8500 rpm and pulled real good when on the Jaws pipe, but lots of times I was 10 mintues pinned and was getting into heat fade lots breaking trail.

Primary clutch was 5/8" from top and secondary looked like it was up shifted fairly well. Belt was glazing slightly and emery clothed it after day 2.
Thinking of trying the stock pipe with this setup next trip, and try out my MTN #1 progressive helix.
Sled now has 4900 km ( 3045 miles ) on stock pistons. Leaking down was just at 2% and Compression was at 120/125 psi at 3000ft.
Any advice is appreciated - my Aaen book is getting a work out again
Pictures are in order of this long ass story
View attachment 337535

what were your engine temps ?

 

[HECKS]

Looking at the primary with those gears you are not getting full shift out. I would start by trying more weight or less spring. Should have at most 1/4 in of primary not used.

Thanks.
I'm running Indy Dan adj weights. Trying to hit my 8350-8450 I had to lighten up and ran a stiffer spring to gain rpm.
The 68.6g I started with was hitting 7900-8050 on the first day out in steep climb. Ran the same hill everytime in fresh tracks to have a good comparison. 2-3 pulls per adjustment. Tried 5 seperate weight changes with 1 spring change.
Been moutain riding for 21 years now, and finally trying hard to understand/learn clutching.

 

[HECKS]

Engine temps are always around 52C (126F) in the alpine.

 

[revrider07]

Its hard to get the primary and secondary clutch to work together but when you do. OH BABY look out. By the info you tried i would be looking into the secondary. I try and run as light of spring i can get by without slipping the belt. On some hard landings my belt will tend to pull in to easily and upshift unwarranted. I just live with that. Its a fine line with varing snow conditions each time were out the paddle tracks have made clutching harder. Imo beacause of traction or no traction.

 

[HECKS]

^^^ I agree on the traction. My 3" powder claw grabs harder and loads more then the others in my group with the stock Polaris 3", which I can't run their same setup I find. Out of curiosty, do you mind disclosing your driven setup ? (or PM)
So my understanding is pick your poison on the secondary first, then adjust primary as needed. I will try my Indy Dan MTN #1 helix next trip with his 140/200 spring in it again.
And fine tune the primary from there. Now back to read my Aaen book again.

 

[Ultrasauras]

Engine temps are always around 52C (126F) in the alpine.

I have the same sled as you only made one trip this year first time on this sled all stock would only rev to 8000-8050 my temps were 130 in the alpine. On my Pro i installed a ski doo thermostat brought temps down from the 130F to 105 all the time in the alpine. The pro would pull timing when the temp got over 120 and i would lose rpm. I believe the same thing is happening on the 16-17 800 axys i have removed the thermostat and plugged the bypass circuit i hope to get out next weekend to try it out. Mine 2017 also had bad motor mounts and the clutches were out of alignment i will let you know.

 

[HECKS]

I believe the t-stats starts to open up at 122F - Fully opened at 145F and closes at 113F on the 16 & 17's.
Last year we had a stuck t-stat on a 17 Axys, and pulled it and ran up the trail. It would not get close to running temp with out the t-stat.

 

[Ultrasauras]

i better try it at home first if that is the case i know the 18 s and up run 95-100 f that is what i am shooting for.

 

[HECKS]

Test run would be good.
Here's a document I had from a couple years back on ECU retarding timing on dyno testing on pipes:

 

[Ultrasauras]

interesting read notice how they never took the engine temps over 120

 

[J270wsm]

Looking for opinions on the remaining lines.........
Stock 19/44 gearing.
Which gear should I change first, top or bottom? Or should I just do both?
Mostly ride the trees.

 

[klarkkentster]

I also have a 163 3" - curious for a 19' what the stock gearing is? Going to order a TKI and want a little lower gearing

 

[Sheetmetalfab]

I also have a 163 3" - curious for a 19' what the stock gearing is? Going to order a TKI and want a little lower gearing

stock 3” chaincase sleds are all 19-44. (2.31)

 

[klarkkentster]

stock 3” chaincase sleds are all 19-44. (2.31)

Thank you. After I posted this I checked my manual - it states 22:43. (1:95) TKI is suggesting 2.32 on their belt drive and Kurts polaris gear down kit for QD is 2.37 . I've seen multiple postings of varying stock gear ratios for the 3" chain case models just trying to narrow down which way to go before ordering my kit.

 

[Teth-Air]

The manual is wrong