electrical gremlin

kidwoo

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I just changed out the entire harness, put a different voltage regulator in and new spark plugs.


So yeah the main harness ground has been checked. :face-icon-small-hap

We're getting dumped on again so I'll have it out soon. If that doesn't fix it I'm just going to go back to curling up in a ball and crying.


Don't know about a pickup filter. You have any pics? I'm having a hard time visualizing what you're describing. I don't see anything like that on the parts diagrams.
 

nosajlleb

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Went thru somewhat of the same situation as you are. I see you changed your wiring harness, that's what ended up solving my issues. Tore the old harness apart and never found a bad wire, but it runs flawless now.
 
Feb 19, 2017
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I just changed out the entire harness, put a different voltage regulator in and new spark plugs.


So yeah the main harness ground has been checked. :face-icon-small-hap

We're getting dumped on again so I'll have it out soon. If that doesn't fix it I'm just going to go back to curling up in a ball and crying.


Don't know about a pickup filter. You have any pics? I'm having a hard time visualizing what you're describing. I don't see anything like that on the parts diagrams.
If you go to the parts diagram and look at the fuel pump assembly you should see the 3 “pick up” spots in the diagram. My guess would be that there is a filter on each one of those or it has one filter in the fuel pump. Also, have you checked your ignition coils? Tried ohming them out to make sure they are all the same ? Also, have you checked your fuel injectors or fuel pressure? You could always ohm out your fuel injectors and see what they are like. Have you checked to make sure your tank is venting properly?
 
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kidwoo

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It's something intermittent. So unless it's changing with heat, I don't think it's the coils. I do have another set that shipped with the harness if so. All 4 or even both on a side would result in some weird running. It either runs or it doesn't. It is most definitely not tank venting. That's the first thing I've checked every time it doesn't start.

I did check the function of the injectors but not resistance. Let me hope for the next few days before I get it out on snow. :face-icon-small-ton
 
Feb 19, 2017
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It's something intermittent. So unless it's changing with heat, I don't think it's the coils. I do have another set that shipped with the harness if so. All 4 or even both on a side would result in some weird running. It either runs or it doesn't. It is most definitely not tank venting. That's the first thing I've checked every time it doesn't start.

I did check the function of the injectors but not resistance. Let me hope for the next few days before I get it out on snow. :face-icon-small-ton
It could be your intake air temp sensor is getting heat soaked.
This thread may help you. https://www.snowest.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-408011.html
 

kidwoo

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Unfortunately that doesn't explain it it not starting after sitting out in the woods overnight. Or the newer problem of cutting out while running.
 
Feb 19, 2017
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Unfortunately that doesn't explain it it not starting after sitting out in the woods overnight. Or the newer problem of cutting out while running.
Alright, yeah that makes sense. So, what all has been replaced on the sled so far? You are not getting any codes either correct?
 
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kidwoo

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Alright, yeah that makes sense. So, what all has been replaced on the sled so far? You are not getting any codes either correct?
I just did the harness and regulator sunday night. Not getting any codes starting up at idling. I haven't had a chance to get it out yet. I'm not taking it out in blizzards for obvious reasons until I know it's fixed.

So far: stator, fuel pump, main harness, regulator

Plus a gage reflash to monitor voltage, and lots of vents to prevent heat soaking, plus a coolant temp bypass switch from a cutler turbo kit to get it started when it does heat soak....

It's been a real joy.

All I really have left is pipe and intake sensors, and coils.
 

Frisco

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Have you checked wires to injectors. I had similar issue. Was a a bad connection from wire to crimped on injector plugs. Was intermittent
 

kidwoo

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Have you checked wires to injectors. I had similar issue. Was a a bad connection from wire to crimped on injector plugs. Was intermittent
Yep. Didn't see anything weird but since that's from the main harness, I've got different wires now. That sounds like Frostbite's issue as well.
 
Feb 19, 2017
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I just did the harness and regulator sunday night. Not getting any codes starting up at idling. I haven't had a chance to get it out yet. I'm not taking it out in blizzards for obvious reasons until I know it's fixed.

So far: stator, fuel pump, main harness, regulator

Plus a gage reflash to monitor voltage, and lots of vents to prevent heat soaking, plus a coolant temp bypass switch from a cutler turbo kit to get it started when it does heat soak....

It's been a real joy.

All I really have left is pipe and intake sensors, and coils.
You could check the resistance on each coil to see if they are the same. I have seen them ohm out good while cold and warm but still be bad. You can reference your new coils and see if the ohms are the Same as the ones currently on the sled.Check your can to see if maybe something in there is loose and then obstructing the flow. Doesn’t really explain the intermittent part of it but it could just be bouncing around in there causing it to be intermittent. You can back probe the wires on TPS and watch the voltage change when you move the throttle while the engine is running.
 
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kidwoo

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Got a few good days out with no issues then it did it again yesterday.

Symptoms: runs great for an hour or two of real run time. Sits for about 30+min, then it won't start. It half ass started and garbled a bunch and then went dead. I dropped some fuel into a plug hole and it started. The engine was well cooled off by the time I tried to start it again. I'm starting to think the placement of the fuel line and those weird clicky connections are letting fuel vaporize off and make a bubble in the line or the rail. Once I got it started, it ran like a champ with nothing weird. It's running way better and not dying mid-ride since replacing a bunch of stuff so I may be dealing with two different issues here that both cause non-starts.

Things replaced:
Main Harness
Fuel Pump
Stator/timing sensor
Voltage Regulator

What's left:
Coils
TPS
Injectors
temp sensors
 

Allseasons

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Think if it were mine it would’ve caught on fire by now. Injectors sticking open? To dump fuel in the cyclone era and it fired and ran good, really leads me to believe fuel system problem. Very frustrating no doubt
 

Frostbite

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I have had similar incidents and finally wrapped my fuel lines in several layers of the aluminum heat ducting tape tape and routed them as far away from the heat sources as possible. It hasn't completely eliminated the not wanting to start issue but, it has helped.
 

kidwoo

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I have had similar incidents and finally wrapped my fuel lines in several layers of the aluminum heat ducting tape tape and routed them as far away from the heat sources as possible. It hasn't completely eliminated the not wanting to start issue but, it has helped.
I was looking at the routing when I got home yesterday and there's a dip right before it goes into the fuel rail. I might try to eliminate that.

But priming fuel pumps and dumping a drop of gas into a cylinder to get a proclimb started has popped up for years on this forum. So I do think there's kind of a design flaw there. The one plug I pulled looked fine.

Where did you route yours? Got any pics?
 
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killergiller

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I just changed out the entire harness, put a different voltage regulator in and new spark plugs.


So yeah the main harness ground has been checked. :face-icon-small-hap

We're getting dumped on again so I'll have it out soon. If that doesn't fix it I'm just going to go back to curling up in a ball and crying.


Don't know about a pickup filter. You have any pics? I'm having a hard time visualizing what you're describing. I don't see anything like that on the parts diagrams.
I have a 17 M/C with the exact issue. Has done it since brand new. I have now changed the Stator, VR, the TPS via a new wire harness and it still does it. It will generally start after about 15 mins of sitting (or being towed).
I have been in curled in that ball for 3 seasons now...so frustrating as you said when your buddies are all ready to go and you cant. It did it yesterday 3 different times and I pull it 3 times with WOT and on the 4th it starts. Really odd.
Also, FWIW same Sierra riding same elevations...dunno where to go with it.
 

kidwoo

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I have a 17 M/C with the exact issue. Has done it since brand new. I have now changed the Stator, VR, the TPS via a new wire harness and it still does it. It will generally start after about 15 mins of sitting (or being towed).
I have been in curled in that ball for 3 seasons now...so frustrating as you said when your buddies are all ready to go and you cant. It did it yesterday 3 different times and I pull it 3 times with WOT and on the 4th it starts. Really odd.
Also, FWIW same Sierra riding same elevations...dunno where to go with it.
Thanks for chiming in. Yeah this was saturday sitting in the sun on top of Castle Peak, so pretty warm on top of just normal running temps. I think it's probably a little worse for us in warmer climates....which again points to a possible fuel feed problem.

I'm going to redo the fuel line to get rid of those goofy connectors that break when you try to separate them, and wrap it in tape. There are a lot of spots where the exhaust gets close to fuel components so it may be vaporizing/pressurizing/causing line bubbles. I'll definitely update this because it does seem like a layout/design issue that might be the problem...with some worse than others obviously.
 

Frostbite

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One other thing I have heard but not tried is the coolant temp sensor. I read somewhere that if you add a spacer to keep it further away from the source it draws its temperature from that it helps a lot as well.

I also read that unhooking the heat sensor wire and starting the sled works.

Again, I can't verify it but, it does sound plausible.

Good luck
 
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Similar issue a couple seasons ago with 2013 Proclimb. Would run great, then not start after a short break. Noticed that if air temp sensor was disconnected it would start, so put a switch in-line to disable temp switch if needed.
Good luck, electrical issues are tough.
 

kidwoo

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I've already got a bypass on the coolant sensor. Didn't work this past weekend (but it has in the past). Maybe I'll try another one on the air intake sensor. This is getting ridiculous.
 
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