Belt drives c3 vs tki vs mvm

[badaltitude]

Tom at Tki is a top notch guy. You will not find better customer service. The parts are also top notch. Ran his kit on my 12 m8 bd turbo and now on my 16 ltd 162. Works flawless and could really tell a difference in response and track speed on my 16

 

[marvelous]

Belt Drive

MORE THE SAME; all the guys producing belt drives are great,The comments here sounds like a political campaign! I'm glad everyone is happy with there purchase, Now how about the weight savings VS cost, For those of us not in love with any one manufacture.

 

[snopro_56]

Chain Case:
3lbs 7 oz Rotating (Chain, Top gear/Bottom Gear)
9lbs 9 oz Total (Bolts, bearings, Rotating, tensioner, Cover)

I screwed up when I weighed the new parts... I did the pulley and bearing together. Even with the bearing you save 1lb rotating but I would guess closer to 1.5 lbs or so of saving. Total weight is close to 4lbs. Attached is a spread sheet that was sent to me from Dean at MVM.

 

[TKILLC]

These are a few of my observations from a TKI for sale post that had very high quality close ups of the sprockets.

http://www.snowest.com/forum/showthread.php?t=409014

I noticed the round root of the tooth profile and when I compared it to the Gates and Mitsuboshi Carbon belt and my C3 sprockets I noticed that the TKI is indeed running the wrong tooth profile for the Gates or Mitsuboshi Carbon belts. FWIW

Glad I went with the higher quality lighter weight originator (C3) for my sleds. The correct tooth profile closely resembles a true involute tooth form. Flat top and bottom with a constantly changing arc connecting them. The Gates tooth profile slightly more pronounced than the Mitsuboshi.

The TKI tooth profile can and does work, just less efficiently than the true / correct tooth profile. The rounded tooth does not engage the whole belt tooth, it point loads it at the top near the carbon tension / tensile members which could cause accelerated belt wear and lead to belt tooth stripping if the correct conditions were to present themselves.

I can not speak to MVM. I'm a Polaris guy and been dealing with C3 since before TKI was even making sled parts. FWIW

Loudhandle

I have no idea what you have against me, I have never spoken to you or even met you. I bought the tooth profile from gates over 5 years ago. So if it is wrong just like all the other threads you have attacked me in call gates. I am not a engineer, that's why I used to gates for the tooth profile and other questions I had.

If you would like to call me and talk to me, my phone number is 406-850-8091. I am always at the shop except for Sundays, so if you have a problem with me call and let me know!!!!!!!

 

[RACINSTATION]

Loudhandle: I have to step in here and get TKI's back on this. We have been using and selling various TKI products for years. We deal with LOTS of vendor and suppliers. TKI is one of, if not the best to work with. Top notch parts and quality of build. These type of guys don't need to put up with this kind of crap, they continue to further research and improve products for an industry that we all love. If you have had a bad experience with a PRODUCT that they build and have some constructive criticism to offer, then let 'er rip. If not..............then don't.

 

[snopro_56]

Price on MVM is $1020 according to their website. I believe I saved just under 4lbs total and 2lbs rotating mass. Is this the best bang for your buck in weight loss? No. I did notice a 3 sled length gain on average over the identical sled stock compared to before the belt drive. I have a TI can that lost more weight than I would have ever dreamed. No performance gain but a lot less weight. Yes I did go with MVM however I did talk with Tom from TKI before I bought one and he was more than helpful on the phone. The one thing that I didnt like about his kit was the idea of drilling and tapping my jackshaft. I would have no hesitation about buying from him. I believe that both Tom and MVM have a great product. In the terms of telling a difference between stock and a belt drive system I feel the belt drive is smoother. Yes I carry a spare belt but for $90 and a torx wrench in the seat why wouldn't I? I will never own a sled without a belt drive.

 

[Frostbite]

I am much more interested in the differences between the kits and the differences in the ease of installation than getting into petty stuff.

However, this statement really made me think about the stuff we don't seem to be talking about regarding the various belt drive kits.

"The one thing that I didn't like about his kit (TKI) was the idea of drilling and tapping my jackshaft.

Frankly, I am not a big fan of drilling my jackshaft either but, if it's the best kit for me it's not a deal breaker.

 

[0neoldfart]

You have a winner...

I doubt you'll find much difference (if any) in how the different kits perform on the snow. Some kits cost more then others, but some kits have varying components as well. Some are easier to install, too. Pick your flavor and be happy, all are an improvement over the traditional chain case. To be perfectly honest, I chose C3 at the time of purchase because that's all that was available at the time. This doesn't mean that the other kits are inferior, or that C3's is superior in any way - I believe all of the current vendors that offer a belt drive have done their homework, with the exception of Polaris and the 2013 QD offering...but the newer models are holding up based on forum postings...

 

[LoudHandle]

Loudhandle

I have no idea what you have against me, I have never spoken to you or even met you. I bought the tooth profile from gates over 5 years ago. So if it is wrong just like all the other threads you have attacked me in call gates. I am not a engineer, that's why I used to gates for the tooth profile and other questions I had.

If you would like to call me and talk to me, my phone number is 406-850-8091. I am always at the shop except for Sundays, so if you have a problem with me call and let me know!!!!!!!

I have nothing against you or your company, I'm sure you are a nice enough, stand up guy that backs his products. I just made an observation and thought I'd send a little constructive criticism to you and add a bit of information for those reading and trying to chose wisely which belt drive is best for them.

I never said that your tooth profile does not work or that you are not using a "Gates" tooth form. I'm sure you are (using a Gates tooth form), but to me it looks like the HTD tooth form which does indeed work (BDS; Blower Drive Services, for nearly thirty years (and may still) only made HTD profile sprockets and sold them with every kind of belt they sold). I'm just saying the correct tooth profile supports the tooth better, is more efficient and less likely to strip the teeth off the tension cord portion of the belt.

I'm not here to speculate about what Gates told you or why they sent the incorrect gear hobbs to you. You will need to figure that out, if you chose to do so.

My goal is to inform / educate other consumers like myself with the knowledge I have accumulated in my 30 plus years of researching snowmobile chassis and drivetrain development (as well as correct material choice / usage and other passions of mine). So they can form their own opinion of the product.

My goal is not to hurt your sales, but that may well be an unintended side effect if what you're selling is not as it should be. Ultimately the choice is yours as the proprietor. Best Wishes and Good Luck!

 

[Chewy22]

I have nothing against you or your company, I'm sure you are a nice enough, stand up guy that backs his products. I just made an observation and thought I'd send a little constructive criticism to you and add a bit of information for those reading and trying to chose wisely which belt drive is best for them.

I never said that your tooth profile does not work or that you are not using a "Gates" tooth form. I'm sure you are (using a Gates tooth form), but to me it looks like the HTD tooth form which does indeed work (BDS; Blower Drive Services, for nearly thirty years (and may still) only made HTD profile sprockets and sold them with every kind of belt they sold). I'm just saying the correct tooth profile supports the tooth better, is more efficient and less likely to strip the teeth off the tension cord portion of the belt.

I'm not here to speculate about what Gates told you or why they sent the incorrect gear hobbs to you. You will need to figure that out, if you chose to do so.

My goal is to inform / educate other consumers like myself with the knowledge I have accumulated in my 30 plus years of researching snowmobile chassis and drivetrain development (as well as correct material choice / usage and other passions of mine). So they can form their own opinion of the product.

My goal is not to hurt your sales, but that may well be an unintended side effect if what you're selling is not as it should be. Ultimately the choice is yours as the proprietor. Best Wishes and Good Luck!

I think your comments are careless because you have not physically inspected one of the TKI belt drives. Your comments are based off a PHOTO!!!. Do you understand how naïve that is? Until you have physically seen the kit, your comments are baseless. Its pretty sad you come on here and bash (call it what you want, at the end of the day it's bashing) a company that you have zero experience with or knowledge of.

 

[Vertical-Extreme]

I think your comments are careless because you have not physically inspected one of the TKI belt drives. Your comments are based off a PHOTO!!!. Do you understand how naïve that is? Until you have physically seen the kit, your comments are baseless. Its pretty sad you come on here and bash (call it what you want, at the end of the day it's bashing) a company that you have zero experience with or knowledge of.

Come on, give the guy a break he's been "researching" sled parts for 30 years lol ....like I've researched all the Chris Burandt videos so I can easily tell him what he's doing wrong....right :face-icon-small-hap

 

[hughesfoundation]

From my point of view, this could have been a great private discussion. No, make that should have been private. Questions and answers back and forth then maybe a public statement.

 

[Matte Murder]

I am running the C3 belt drive kits on an XM, a Cat Pro Lite 900 with a 174x3" track and an 1100T with 320HP Super Chute and 163x3" track. Not one issue ever. That belt in the 1100T has got to be under a STRAIN in deep snow at full throttle. If that beast won't break on your lighter weight 2 strokes should be fine.

 

[compound 1300]

FWIW

These are a few of my observations from a TKI for sale post that had very high quality close ups of the sprockets.

http://www.snowest.com/forum/showthread.php?t=409014

I noticed the round root of the tooth profile and when I compared it to the Gates and Mitsuboshi Carbon belt and my C3 sprockets I noticed that the TKI is indeed running the wrong tooth profile for the Gates or Mitsuboshi Carbon belts. FWIW

Glad I went with the higher quality lighter weight originator (C3) for my sleds. The correct tooth profile closely resembles a true involute tooth form. Flat top and bottom with a constantly changing arc connecting them. TFWWhe Gates tooth profile slightly more pronounced than the Mitsuboshi.

The TKI tooth profile can and does work, just less efficiently than the true / correct tooth profile. The rounded tooth does not engage the whole belt tooth, it point loads it at the top near the carbon tension / tensile members which could cause accelerated belt wear and lead to belt tooth stripping if the correct conditions were to present themselves.

I can not speak to MVM. I'm a Polaris guy and been dealing with C3 since before TKI was even making sled parts. FWIW

I sure hope all your R & D is passed on to Gates so they can fix what you think is wrong. After all you have so many sled parts on the market.

 

[BlueDevil]

Loud handle I think it's time to get your hands on a TKI belt drive and then give us your opinion. Buuuuttt until then I suggest you read and not post useless info.

 

[fredw]

grabed a few tki belt drives for my turbo kits last month, one for a t3 174 impulse kit and the other a redline HO 175 g4 kit.. in the past i have run c3 on a 880xp and aerocharger xm.. i did have a few belts break on the aero charger thou, both of the Mitsubishi and gates.. feel the biggest problem with that was my 9 tooth drivers allowing to much load on the belts

i see they tki and c3 are using same belts.. i do remember calling mitsubishi years back and after giving all my info on gearing, rpm, load requirements..ect.. it was determined that there belt was not desirable for this application and a total max of 60hp was allowed..

many over the years are doing over thee times that and not having problems, but shockload with a three track can be its worse nightmare i found

seen a tki kit run this spring with almost 300hp on sled and ran fine for the weekend what sold me to try it on mine.. hope it stands out and leaves me not regretting this move..

any others running them on big boost systems