2010 M8 PG Turbo

SledderX · Sep 9, 2009

Picking up my new 010 M8 162 Snopro in a couple weeks and doing a boondocker pump gas turbo. Have two questions. Have done a lot of reading on them over the last year but still getting mixed answers and opinions on some things. Have decided to go with the new 010 pump gas kit from boondocker. I ride 6-8000 ft. Going to run some race fuel with each tank mix of VPC111 and 92 octane. Want to run max boost possible (whatever stock injectors will allow). Question one is should I run the mini intercooler that boondocker offers? Or is it unneccessary. Question two, do I need to change the head off the 010 HO motor to a lower compression head for the turbo? Any help would be great.
Thanks

danf · Sep 9, 2009

According to Boondocker you do need to change to the 09 head. I ordered the same exact set up as you this year and will be taking the advice of the turbo experts and not adding an intercooler. Don't need it for the low boost.
They said you will have a bit more turbo lag and the added weight.

SledderX · Sep 9, 2009

Yeah that is what I have been hearing as well. So no mini intercooler. That is good the less leg and weight the better. Changing out the head is no big deal I have an 09 M8 LE as well. So will just swap heads on the two sleds. Only problem is on the 09 im running an SLP full exhaust and intake with no control box. Sled runs excellent and is the perfect back up sled. Just pull cord and ride. Will that high compression head put that sled over the edge where it will need a control box? Im thinking probaly so. Anybody know forsere?

kraftymike · Sep 10, 2009

Last year I rode with BD PG Dragon with a mini cooler. He would consistantly run 50-60 deg cooler charge temps than my M8 without the cooler. 50 deg. cooler intake air and race fuel should allow you an extra 2-3 pounds of boost without det. worries. The difference from 8lbs to 11lbs is huge!

rcaustin · Sep 10, 2009

I don't have anything to compare as far as charge temps go between intercooled and non intercooled... But if you are worried about turbo lag... I don't know bout anybody else but when I whack the throttle its not like it takes 3 seconds to spool... more like 1 second and I am at max boost... BD RG kit w/ intercooler. I was going to look into charge temp differences and see if the intercooler is actually doing anything and if the charge temps weren't that much different I was going to pull it off but 50 degrees is enough for me to keep it on. Just my .02 cents.

WyoBoy1000 · Sep 10, 2009

the biggest prob with the intercooler, is some times it cools and works great but on the days theres no air getting to it, such as big pow over the hood days, theres not as much cooling effect and could raise intake temp and cause it to run lean, then theres the icing up prob to. without the intercooler its straight forward always the same. seems to be a personal preference, but i've seen less hassle without one.

bigbull · Sep 10, 2009

wyoboy1000 said:
the biggest prob with the intercooler, is some times it cools and works great but on the days theres no air getting to it, such as big pow over the hood days, theres not as much cooling effect and could raise intake temp and cause it to run lean, then theres the icing up prob to. Without the intercooler its straight forward always the same. Seems to be a personal preference, but i've seen less hassle without one.

what he said^^^

Klimbing Kitty · Sep 10, 2009

SledderX said:
Question two, do I need to change the head off the 010 HO motor to a lower compression head for the turbo? Any help would be great.
Thanks

Probably have to change the head to 12:1 compression. Had 2 on my 2010 anyways.

Vertical-Extreme · Sep 10, 2009

kraftymike said:
Last year I rode with BD PG Dragon with a mini cooler. He would consistantly run 50-60 deg cooler charge temps than my M8 without the cooler. 50 deg. cooler intake air and race fuel should allow you an extra 2-3 pounds of boost without det. worries. The difference from 8lbs to 11lbs is huge!

JMO, but i don't think you could ever run 11 lbs on a premium / 111 mix at the elevations around here. maybe at 10,000ft but not 6-7. 10 lbs plus in revy or any where around here you will need straight vp111

rcaustin · Sep 10, 2009

LeftyM77 said:
JMO, but i don't think you could ever run 11 lbs on a premium / 111 mix at the elevations around here. maybe at 10,000ft but not 6-7. 10 lbs plus in revy or any where around here you will need straight vp111

I run 12-13 lbs on straight vp111 in revy, 10 lbs in revy and you might get away with it being mixed 70/30... tough to say tho. Probably want to be on the safe side and just run straight 111. last thing you want is to blow the engine and smoke ur turbo at the same time!

hatchers · Sep 10, 2009

WyoBoy1000 said:
the biggest prob with the intercooler, is some times it cools and works great but on the days theres no air getting to it, such as big pow over the hood days, theres not as much cooling effect and could raise intake temp and cause it to run lean, then theres the icing up prob to. without the intercooler its straight forward always the same. seems to be a personal preference, but i've seen less hassle without one.

very true, the intercooler is a horrid idea when boondocking at lower speeds, yes a fan will help, but the large amount of alum serves as a huge heat sink...

WyoBoy1000 · Sep 10, 2009

rcaustin said:
I run 12-13 lbs on straight vp111 in revy, 10 lbs in revy and you might get away with it being mixed 70/30... tough to say tho. Probably want to be on the safe side and just run straight 111. last thing you want is to blow the engine and smoke ur turbo at the same time!

wish there was a way to hook up a light to flash if the knock sensor went off then you would now if it was pinging or not. But then again if your buying rg just fill it up.

thumper450 · Sep 10, 2009

when is your sled due to arrive? Does boondocker even have any kits out yet?

Nubulin · Sep 10, 2009

I was on the fence as well on my hold over 09 that is getting a BD pump gas kit this fall. I figured it makes sense to run one, but everyone I talk to says don't run one on PG M series. I hear the dragons will run 13lbs on the stock fuel system, so you see guys with dragons using them more than M guys. Everyone says there is more lag with an IC, so not for me...

SSWIM · Sep 11, 2009

My 02 is that one needs to be honest with themselves. Like Hatcher said, for boondocking, an intercooler is not needed. It actually will inhibit, ie. a little more lag, the sleds ability to get in the throttle. This has been discussed at length in many threads. If loooong pulls are your forte, and you are doing this day in and day out, then intercooling is a plus. If looong pulls are a
small % of your riding though, say 10-20% of the day, I feel it is not as big a plus. There is a difference in the throttle response between the two systems. Don't let anyone tell you differently. Granted it may not be huge, but ride two sleds equipped with and without intercooler and there is a difference. In our group we have a TM8 and TM10. The TM8 is non intercooled and the TM10 is. After riding these sleds last Winter, the TM10 has had the intercooler deleted.

Sam

bigbull · Sep 11, 2009

Here is the deal. With the M7, no innercooler, long pulls went as follows: Everything starts out fine, wide open, no problem.......then as you climb a couple hundred yards she starts to spit and sputter a little, bu not enough to make a huge difference. Then as you started to creep past that amount, the charge temps were way up, and any snow you had inside the hood area as well as any on the vents above the motor, start to melt. Then you change the humidity in the air you are drawing in and it starts to change its air/fuel ratio. Watched it on the EGTs and the O2. Removing the stock and external extra fuel pump to a fuel pump that could keep up on the top end helped some people. I personally thought it made things worse. But overall boondocking, in on and off throttle situations, I would of left it the way it was. I have had other 2 stroke turbos with similar problems. I am building another one for myself personally this year and am going with no cooler.
BB

WyoBoy1000 · Sep 11, 2009

bigbull said:
Here is the deal. With the M7, no innercooler, long pulls went as follows: Everything starts out fine, wide open, no problem.......then as you climb a couple hundred yards she starts to spit and sputter a little, bu not enough to make a huge difference. Then as you started to creep past that amount, the charge temps were way up, and any snow you had inside the hood area as well as any on the vents above the motor, start to melt. Then you change the humidity in the air you are drawing in and it starts to change its air/fuel ratio. Watched it on the EGTs and the O2. Removing the stock and external extra fuel pump to a fuel pump that could keep up on the top end helped some people. I personally thought it made things worse. But overall boondocking, in on and off throttle situations, I would of left it the way it was. I have had other 2 stroke turbos with similar problems. I am building another one for myself personally this year and am going with no cooler.
BB

How much boost where you running?

bigbull · Sep 11, 2009

10lbs over 90% of the time. Only one day did I run 16 for about 3 hours til I melted a fuel pressure line
BB

SledderX · Sep 16, 2009

Picking up sled next Friday!!! New Boondocker kit wont be in till end of October. Give me lots of time to get chassis ready before kit comes and then turbo installed before first trip in november. Cant wait.

RACINSTATION · Sep 16, 2009

The 2010 head is tighter and has a higher compression ration. I would not run it on your 2009 with the pipe without extra fuel. It will add preformance, but you will need more fuel. The 2009 runs great with the SLP setup, but is on the border.....especially at lower elevations.

2010 M8 PG Turbo

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