PCV Map ?

KrazyKen · Dec 29, 2014

Just installed the PCV on my backup / sons sled. '09 800, MTN TEK Fix, stock pipe w/ Skins can. otherwise pretty much stock.
Sled has always had a low end (crack of the throttle) bog and lays down on WOT.

i was given a map to try from a friend but was wondering whos map others are using.

The one I have is titled: "DTRD810StockStoutnerJan157hpWOT.pvm" if anyone recognizes.

Thanks, Ken

jim9006 · Dec 29, 2014

Ken,

I use a PC5 w/modified SLP map, MTK fix kit, SLP Y header, pipe and can with ethanol wires plugged in and use non-ethanol gas. Sled runs like a champ.

The "Stoutner" map was popular back in the day before the fix kit. I suspect it would be way to rich now (fix kit installed).

Try running all "0's" on a test map (basically unplugging the PC5) for a test. If it runs better your to rich.

Also you should know MTK recommends the stock original '08/09 map for best results.

KrazyKen · Dec 29, 2014

Thanks for the info. i also run wires plugged in and non-E fuel. I tried both plugged and unplugged and found it ran better plugged, always non-E.

i will try the back to back test.

My sled has the original 09 Polaris map.

Thanks

jim9006 · Dec 29, 2014

KrazyKen said:
Thanks for the info. i also run wires plugged in and non-E fuel. I tried both plugged and unplugged and found it ran better plugged, always non-E.

Yup... that's cause the non E mode is leaner.

i will try the back to back test.

My sled has the original 09 Polaris map.

The original '09 or the original '09 update? there is a difference.
Thanks

Let me know if you need to know how to find out what map you have loaded on the ECU.

KrazyKen · Dec 29, 2014

I swear I was told original 09 but can't confirm. How can I find out?
Thanks.

jim9006 · Dec 29, 2014

The only way to be sure is to have the dealer run a report from the Polaris digital wrench program. Also if you have the dual ring pistons it meens the "update" has been done and you have what is known as the 2010 update map and lower compression head. Just so you know. The 2010 update was actually a step backwards for these sleds.

Repost from an earlier thread:

The 800 has 3 injector colors (dots located on body of each injector) - Blue, red, Yellow. All injectors should be of the same color.

The 04-15-10 flash number = Blue 4013135 , Red 4013134 , Yellow 4013136

The 01-11-10 flash number = Blue 4013066 , Red 4013065 , Yellow 4013067

Original 2010 update flash = Blue 4012959 , Red 4012958 , Yellow 4012960

You can have your dealer run a "Service Report" and it will list the "Software part #". That will tell you what you have loaded.

ok looks like I can access the map database on my version.. As far as I can tell here are the orignal 2008/2009 ecu software numbers.

red = 4012705
blue = 4012706
yellow = 4012707

UPDATE: Looks like I do have the correct numbers for the 2008 D8 - They are the same as the original 2009. there were no updates from 2008 to early 2009.

FYI: Here the numbers for the NON US/CANADA editions (says here 08/09):

red= 4012730
blue= 4012731
yellow= 4012732

KrazyKen · Dec 29, 2014

I want to double check, but what i do remember is when i bought this sled (used) it had just been in for repairs for what i think was the second round. I bought it from the dealer with the intent to take it straight home and rip it apart to do the Fix kit, which is what i did. at that time I asked which map was loaded since i knew what MTN TEK was recomending. I'm almost possitive they told me it was back to the original 2009 map, so i did nothing to it.

when i get a chance i will have them check. So they have to hook up to the sled to read it correct? Not necessarily on "File" at the dealership.

I'm not real clear on the whole color dot/code deal in your last message. Where do i get these numbers to indicate which flash?

Thanks

jim9006 · Dec 29, 2014

Hello Ken,

The dealer might have it on file. If not you'll have to plug it in. I noticed I'm just up the road from you. If you happen to be up this way with the sled in tow I'd be happy to check it for you. Yes, as it so happens I have a laptop with digital wrench loaded.
To check which color you have look at any injector you can get to. there should be a colored dot on the side. Red Blue or Yellow. Some sleds have the color listed near the VR/ECU on a tag.

Each color has it's own specific map part number. I listed all the possible combinations.

IMO: if you have the dual ring pistons and it did not already come with the fix kit installed I'd bet you have the 2010 update map installed. That actually came out sometime in Sept/Oct of 2009 as part of the Polaris recall so lots of people think it was the original 2009 map.

diamonddave · Dec 29, 2014

KrazyKen said:
Just installed the PCV on my backup / sons sled. '09 800, MTN TEK Fix, stock pipe w/ Skins can. otherwise pretty much stock.
Sled has always had a low end (crack of the throttle) bog and lays down on WOT.

i was given a map to try from a friend but was wondering whos map others are using.

The one I have is titled: "DTRD810StockStoutnerJan157hpWOT.pvm" if anyone recognizes.

Thanks, Ken

When you replaced the pistons, were they single ring or dual ring?

My 09 without the PCV always had throttle tip in bog's, etc. None of the Polaris maps helped. The PCV fixed this.

The stoutner 157 map that you have loaded is a good map if you are running the 2010 maps with a Fix Kit. There are 3 of those. With the Stoutner map and a Fix kit, I prefer the original 2010 update map.

The 2008-2009 maps are essentially the same. The 09 map is better for det issues. But they are much richer/higher timing than the 2010 maps. This is because of the head changes made for the 2010 map.

Running the Stoutner map in the PCV with 08-09 mapping will most likely be to rich.

MTNTK prefers the 2008-2009 map without a PCV however, they ride much higher altitudes and I found way better runnability with a Fix kit, 2010 original map and the Stoutner map loaded in the PCV. If you can find a true 08-09 head, you will have a screamer.

So you did the right thing installing the Fix Kit. Unless somebody has written the map number on a little Polaris sticker on the ECU, then the only way to know for sure which map is loaded into the ECU is to hook up the sled to the Digital Wrench.

Jim offering to do this for you is awesome and if you are having runnability issues, then I would recommend doing this.

KrazyKen · Dec 29, 2014

jim9006 said:
Hello Ken,

The dealer might have it on file. If not you'll have to plug it in. I noticed I'm just up the road from you. If you happen to be up this way with the sled in tow I'd be happy to check it for you. Yes, as it so happens I have a laptop with digital wrench loaded.
To check which color you have look at any injector you can get to. there should be a colored dot on the side. Red Blue or Yellow. Some sleds have the color listed near the VR/ECU on a tag.

Each color has it's own specific map part number. I listed all the possible combinations.

IMO: if you have the dual ring pistons and it did not already come with the fix kit installed I'd bet you have the 2010 update map installed. That actually came out sometime in Sept/Oct of 2009 as part of the Polaris recall so lots of people think it was the original 2009 map.

I just went and checked and I cant see a colored dot anywhere on the top 2 injectors. I looked with a scope light and dental mirror and cant see anything. not that it's not there but I cant see anything.
I cant find anything as far as the pistons go. its been too long since I pulled them. apparently I tossed them out and I do recall taking pics of them to show how quickly they scared but cant find those either. BUT, if I had to guess I would say they were 2 ring. I know when I went to do the fix kit I asked about the map and thought it was what MTN TEK recommended. but that info could easily been false. I never had the ECU checked. Not sure why they would have, but I'm quite certain they told me they reprogramed it with the original 09 map. who knows for sure now.
we're talking about heading up to Salman La Sac soon, maybe even this Friday. If I don't get it figured out i'll try and get in touch with you, Thanks.

KrazyKen · Dec 29, 2014

diamonddave said:
When you replaced the pistons, were they single ring or dual ring?

My 09 without the PCV always had throttle tip in bog's, etc. None of the Polaris maps helped. The PCV fixed this.

The stoutner 157 map that you have loaded is a good map if you are running the 2010 maps with a Fix Kit. There are 3 of those. With the Stoutner map and a Fix kit, I prefer the original 2010 update map.

The 2008-2009 maps are essentially the same. The 09 map is better for det issues. But they are much richer/higher timing than the 2010 maps. This is because of the head changes made for the 2010 map.

Running the Stoutner map in the PCV with 08-09 mapping will most likely be to rich.

MTNTK prefers the 2008-2009 map without a PCV however, they ride much higher altitudes and I found way better runnability with a Fix kit, 2010 original map and the Stoutner map loaded in the PCV. If you can find a true 08-09 head, you will have a screamer.

So you did the right thing installing the Fix Kit. Unless somebody has written the map number on a little Polaris sticker on the ECU, then the only way to know for sure which map is loaded into the ECU is to hook up the sled to the Digital Wrench.

Jim offering to do this for you is awesome and if you are having runnability issues, then I would recommend doing this.

Thanks for the info.
I recall looking at he ECU for some kind of info and finding nothing, back when I did the Fix. honestly at this point I have no idea which map is in the ECU.
I know it was back to the dealer twice since it was new in 09 so it really makes no sense to me that it would have nothing other than the 2010 map but I was told different. I picked it up after the original owner traded it in in 2011 and I knew I wouldn't put it on the snow without the fix kit.

We are going for a ride tomorrow so we will see how it does with whatever combo I have. If for some reason its not a miracle and runs great, I will try and get it in for a Digital Wrench read.

thanks guys

KrazyKen · Dec 30, 2014

Well we gave it a try and in fact it was way too fat. I switched back and it ran cleaner and pulled harder. Although not perfect. Still rich low and drops rpm at wot long pulls. Now what? Anybody have a map for the PCV that will work with my ECU program or should I look at changing the ECU? Apparently I need to get a read on it to know for sure what I have.
Thanks

cascadesnowjunky · Dec 31, 2014

I would find out what flash is in your ECU before doing much. I know I had an 09 dragon that I put an SLP single on and ran a map from dynotech research and it was way fat everywhere. I called SLP and they e-mailed me there map and it was closer. I was able to fine tune from there to make it scream. If you have a laptop and basic tuning knowledge I would take a map and start adding or subtracting fuel where it is needed. I can tell you from experience all the stock flashes are way lean in the middle and pig rich on top. Even when I put slp's map in mine I still took 9% more fuel away on top.

KrazyKen · Jan 1, 2015

cascadesnowjunky said:
I would find out what flash is in your ECU before doing much. I know I had an 09 dragon that I put an SLP single on and ran a map from dynotech research and it was way fat everywhere. I called SLP and they e-mailed me there map and it was closer. I was able to fine tune from there to make it scream. If you have a laptop and basic tuning knowledge I would take a map and start adding or subtracting fuel where it is needed. I can tell you from experience all the stock flashes are way lean in the middle and pig rich on top. Even when I put slp's map in mine I still took 9% more fuel away on top.

Yesterday I took it it to the dealer and found out it had the 2009 update flash which is well known to be way too rich. We flashed it with the original 2009 base map as I had hoped it was originally. It has the original 2009 head as well.
I have 2 different PC maps to try as base Iines and work from there.

cascadesnowjunky · Jan 1, 2015

That is cool you know what flash is in it now so you have a better idea where to start with fueling. Just slowly start adding fuel in the midrange and taking away on top. I would start fairly drastic on top because they are very rich.

KrazyKen · Jan 2, 2015

cascadesnowjunky said:
That is cool you know what flash is in it now so you have a better idea where to start with fueling. Just slowly start adding fuel in the midrange and taking away on top. I would start fairly drastic on top because they are very rich.

this is where I'm ignorant, what do you consider "drastic"?

I've got 2 different maps here to start with. The Stoutner map, which was way too fat before (with the 2009 update base map of course) adds as much as +37 at one point in the midrange and -10 @7750 / 100%.
I see as little as "2".
Where can I get some good info to educate myself on programming a custom map?
Jim's map is less aggressive and looks to make more sense to me being that his transitions aren't so aggressive and he addresses each injector individually not to overload it with fuel in the midrange transition between injectors. At least I think I understand how this 4 injector system works to some point.

cascadesnowjunky · Jan 2, 2015

Ken I have some maps I still have saved if you want me to e-mail them to you to look at or try. The problem is they are all for a slp single pipe setup. I had an 09 dragon with the updated flash which was way rich on top. I know slp did a better job of improving the fueling than dtr did. The dtr map was so rich in the midrange it would hardly run. I think alot of the problem in those years was the inconsistency in manufacturing also. Some sleds ran better than others and some reacted to certain changes better. Let me know whether or not you want me to send those maps, you can pm me your e-mail.

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