TIG welder advice

Mafesto · Jul 8, 2012

Looking to buy.
Kinda have mind set on Lincoln.
Would mostly be used on .080 Alum

I've done a very limited amount of TIG welding, so looking to take advantage of the experience of those willing to share.

Trashy · Jul 8, 2012

I have a Lincoln Precision 185, bought it about 7 years ago I think... have been pretty happy with it. I was mostly doing race car fab stuff back then, lots of chromoly (cages etc) and some smaller projects like oil pans etc... It did an exceptional job on those types of projects. A couple years ago I took on a large project building a bunch of racks out of aluminum; that left me wishing I really had a liquid cooled torch but even with the bigger 1/4" thick pieces the 185 got it done. I just had a look on the Lincoln website and the smallest comparable machine they offer now is a 225, I bet you would be super happy with that model!!!

LoudHandle · Jul 8, 2012

Being a Welder by trade the only Lincoln I would personally consider is a engine driven Pipe liner. I have used both brands of shop machines and the Miller's will outlive the Lincoln's three to one for same size, same use, situations. I personally own a Syncrowave 250 (about 20 years of use and abuse). At work my favorite is the Dynasty 700 and have used every available Amp on numerous occasions.

Parting advice, Miller is better! Define what you want to be able to do, buy a machine that will do that, plus leave you some room to expand your capabilities.

Himark · Jul 9, 2012

I have done miles of Mig welding and never Tig. I bought a Miller Syncro 200 new for 1900 bux a couple years aga and have made some decent welds.

But, dont think its easy there is a big learning curv and it takes a while. Unless you have enough to make it worth while I would consider hiring it out. I did several big projects and now my welder just sits there..

milehighassassin · Jul 10, 2012

Nice advice but lets remember that this is for personal use. I am kinda in the same boat as the OP. Sure the Miller might outlive the Lincoln but for someone that is teaching themselves/learning and using it for personal/non business/commercial use; will I ever run down the Lincoln? Doubtful.

Cost certainly has to be factored in.

How much harder is it to learn TIG than MIG? I taught myself how to MIG weld, the hardest part was learning heat and feed settings. Have welded steel and Stainless. Stainless was much harder but not bad once I figured the heat thing out. I used a Lincoln 255C which I have loved.

Trashy · Jul 10, 2012

milehighassassin said:
Nice advice but lets remember that this is for personal use. I am kinda in the same boat as the OP. Sure the Miller might outlive the Lincoln but for someone that is teaching themselves/learning and using it for personal/non business/commercial use; will I ever run down the Lincoln? Doubtful.

Cost certainly has to be factored in.

How much harder is it to learn TIG than MIG? I taught myself how to MIG weld, the hardest part was learning heat and feed settings. Have welded steel and Stainless. Stainless was much harder but not bad once I figured the heat thing out. I used a Lincoln 255C which I have loved.

I would agree with that... I'm pretty sure I use my Lincoln TIG way more than the average hobby user and have had no issues.

As far as learning goes, TIG is a little trickier to pick up than MIG, you are always using both hands (one to hold the torch and the other to feed your filler rod) as well as one foot for the foot control. Working inside a car upside down can get kinda interesting at times, you really need to get creative on how to operate the foot pedal at times! :face-icon-small-sho It can certainly help to get some pointers from an experienced welder, and from there it's practice practice and more practice. I would suggest starting with mild steel, and learn to just fuse 2 pieces together; this will get you familiar with the current requirements and keeping the tungsten an appropriate distance from the material being welded. If you ground the tungsten it will instantly be contaminated and you will have to re-grind the tip or switch to a fresh clean tungsten. I always prep about a dozen (on the grinder with a cordles drill; wear a respirator because thoriated tungsten is mildly radioactive) pieces of tungsten at once so I don't have to do it again for a while. Once you have the fusing technique mastered you can start adding some filler rod to the equation for a proper weld. Keep in mind if you are working with stainless you need to use a shielding gas to the backside of the weld as well. After you have paid your dues on welding steel you can think about trying aluminum, which is a whole new ball game.... but I just LOVE the look of a quality weld on aluminum! :face-icon-small-hap:face-icon-small-hap I won't get into that unless someone asks tho.

mike_s · Jul 10, 2012

We have a lincon square wave 175. In my opinion, the square wave is the only way to go. Had a big azz miller and a high freq. Box and that damn thing wouldnt weld for $#!|. Couldnt even make a half decent chicken track with an aluminum spool gun. this square wave we have now will weld soda cans together if you have small enough tungsten and filler, and a damn steady hand. :face-icon-small-coo

Wheel House Motorsports · Jul 10, 2012

miller diversion 165 or 180. been running the 165 my buddy has hard, build probanly 7 or 8 turbo kits and 5 chromoly chassis with it and going strong. amaing setup and you can get a foot pedal but stock it has a wheel on the torch which is VERY nice for off angle welding stuff where foot operation is not an option.

milehighassassin · Jul 10, 2012

TrashCat said:
I would agree with that... I'm pretty sure I use my Lincoln TIG way more than the average hobby user and have had no issues.

As far as learning goes, TIG is a little trickier to pick up than MIG, you are always using both hands (one to hold the torch and the other to feed your filler rod) as well as one foot for the foot control. Working inside a car upside down can get kinda interesting at times, you really need to get creative on how to operate the foot pedal at times! :face-icon-small-sho It can certainly help to get some pointers from an experienced welder, and from there it's practice practice and more practice. I would suggest starting with mild steel, and learn to just fuse 2 pieces together; this will get you familiar with the current requirements and keeping the tungsten an appropriate distance from the material being welded. If you ground the tungsten it will instantly be contaminated and you will have to re-grind the tip or switch to a fresh clean tungsten. I always prep about a dozen (on the grinder with a cordles drill; wear a respirator because thoriated tungsten is mildly radioactive) pieces of tungsten at once so I don't have to do it again for a while. Once you have the fusing technique mastered you can start adding some filler rod to the equation for a proper weld. Keep in mind if you are working with stainless you need to use a shielding gas to the backside of the weld as well. After you have paid your dues on welding steel you can think about trying aluminum, which is a whole new ball game.... but I just LOVE the look of a quality weld on aluminum! :face-icon-small-hap:face-icon-small-hap I won't get into that unless someone asks tho.

Yeah, I know about has shielding. When I mug welded stainless I use a tri blend I believe. Can't remember now. But I set up a tee so I could purge the gas into the tube I was welding. (exhaust).

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Mafesto · Jul 10, 2012

mike_s said:
We have a lincon square wave 175. In my opinion, the square wave is the only way to go. Had a big azz miller and a high freq. Box and that damn thing wouldnt weld for $#!|. Couldnt even make a half decent chicken track with an aluminum spool gun. this square wave we have now will weld soda cans together if you have small enough tungsten and filler, and a damn steady hand. :face-icon-small-coo

That's what I'm leaning towards, the 175 is priced reasonable.
AC/DC good for alum or SS
A little bulky, but a cart with some pneumatic tires would make it easy to roll into trailer for portability.

zr600 · Jul 30, 2012

I don't know what to tell you for machines. But im a boilermaker by trade so i have done some tig welding. Practice and patience, hold the torch lightly with your fingers allows good movement and doesnt tire out your hand same thing with your filler wire. Make sure you get a molten puddle before adding wire. If you see sparks something isn't right, or pin holes also then you have to grind it all out and try again. If you are using any metal that has mill scale, oil from cutting it, or rust on it take a grinder and buff it up so it is shiny tig likes to be clean. ALuminum is really tricky it needs to be extremely clean use a stainless steel wire brush on a grinder that has never been used on any other metal to clean it. Have you ever soldered or brazed almost the same idea. Oh ya before you fire up the torch don't forget to turn on the gas lol have done this a 100 million times still do it from time to time. Good sharp tungsten helps also. Post some pictures of your first welds when you get some.

LoudHandle · Jul 30, 2012

Buy whatever machine you want, but my hard earned money will never go to a Lincoln! They are buying up small companies like ESAB did ten years ago and the quality of everything went in the toilet. A co-worker ordered a ESAB plasma unit and after trying to power up four brand new units (had the electricians put the power cord on and it would sh-t itself, we sent it back three times for another new one) we threw it in the trash, and bought a Hypertherm. In my opinion Lincoln was already a second choice. Miller is just built for the long haul, will the Lincoln get you by? probably if it just a hobby welder. In my 30 year carrier as a welder I've seen three Lincoln's expire from under my hood. I have yet to extinguish a single Miller and I've used them all very hard. You will get what you pay for. Lincoln's are cheaper for a reason!

M5- · Jul 31, 2012

For light welding up to say 3/16" the Miller Diversion is a pretty good little machine. Sure it is somewhat limited in adjustments but the baseline programming is pretty well dead on for most things. For the average home guy its hard to beat for the price. The only real advantage of the 180 over the 165 is the dual voltage thing so you can run it on 120 or 240.

M5

joshkoltes · Aug 4, 2012

I'm saving up for a miller xmt 350 mpa. Does everything.

LoudHandle · Aug 4, 2012

joshkoltes said:
I'm saving up for a miller xmt 350 mpa. Does everything.

Josh, The XMT is a good top of the line inverter, if your primary welding needs are powering a squirt gun. However if you're going to TIG much at all you will be much happier with the Dynasty 350 which will leave you a couple grand in your pocket. I use the sh_t out of my Dynasty 700 at work and as soon as save enough coin, I will be upgrading my Syncrowave 250 at the house.

If you did not catch my tone above, I'm not a propenent of the squirt gun and will never condone the use of a squirt gun weld as a replacement for a real weld!

To each their own, if you don't have enough skill to lay a good bead with another process you probably don't have the skill or know how to run a good bead with the squirt gun!

The boss also bought a XMT 350 and all the bells and whistles for squirting aluminum with a XR push pull feeder and the Lincoln (model?) suitcase feeder for steel. It all just sits in the corner collecting dust except when the boss needs out of the office and decides to play.

Hope that helps in your decision.

mike_s · Aug 4, 2012

LoudHandle said:
Josh, The XMT is a good top of the line inverter, if your primary welding needs are powering a squirt gun. However if you're going to TIG much at all you will be much happier with the Dynasty 350 which will leave you a couple grand in your pocket. I use the sh_t out of my Dynasty 700 at work and as soon as save enough coin, I will be upgrading my Syncrowave 250 at the house.

If you did not catch my tone above, I'm not a propenent of the squirt gun and will never condone the use of a squirt gun weld as a replacement for a real weld!

To each their own, if you don't have enough skill to lay a good bead with another process you probably don't have the skill or know how to run a good bead with the squirt gun!

The boss also bought a XMT 350 and all the bells and whistles for squirting aluminum with a XR push pull feeder and the Lincoln (model?) suitcase feeder for steel. It all just sits in the corner collecting dust except when the boss needs out of the office and decides to play.

Hope that helps in your decision.

So, high frequency MIG, or spray-ark are inferior in your oppinion? Dont mean to disrespect, because there are instances that good old fasioned SMAW is the only way to go, however, to say that it is THE only way to go is kind of misleading. There are also times that contractors will not accept SMAW because the contaminent level is too high, and the strengts of spray-ark will be higher. Only reason for SMAW over spray-ark is position.

LoudHandle · Aug 4, 2012

mike_s said:
So, high frequency MIG, or spray-ark are inferior in your oppinion? Dont mean to disrespect, because there are instances that good old fasioned SMAW is the only way to go, however, to say that it is THE only way to go is kind of misleading. There are also times that contractors will not accept SMAW because the contaminent level is too high, and the strengts of spray-ark will be higher. Only reason for SMAW over spray-ark is position.

I knew a few of you would get bent by my opinion. I'm not saying it doesn't have it's place, it does. Just not in my shop nor anything I build. But I am ultra particular on my quality and if given the option I will / would GTAW / TIG everything. My forte is aluminum and exotics like titanium, Monel, inconel, duplex Stainless Steel, ect. Not your run of the mill job shop welder that is driven to produce quantity instead of quality. I'd rather do one weld a day that will last forever, than do a thousand that will fail in the next few years. And to say SMAW is too dirty for some codes is bull, a skilled welder can do a cleaner weld than a squirt gun. Most of the issues I see is inadequate preperation and improper setup and technique.

Sorry for my rant but fabrication is my carrier as well as my passion; in case you couldn't tell.

mike_s · Aug 4, 2012

LoudHandle said:
I knew a few of you would get bent by my opinion. I'm not saying it doesn't have it's place, it does. Just not in my shop nor anything I build. But I am ultra particular on my quality and if given the option I will / would GTAW / TIG everything. My forte is aluminum and exotics like titanium, Monel, inconel, duplex Stainless Steel, ect. Not your run of the mill job shop welder that is driven to produce quantity instead of quality. I'd rather do one weld a day that will last forever, than do a thousand that will fail in the next few years. And to say SMAW is too dirty for some codes is bull, a skilled welder can do a cleaner weld than a squirt gun. Most of the issues I see is inadequate preperation and improper setup and technique.

Sorry for my rant but fabrication is my carrier as well as my passion; in case you couldn't tell.

No hurt feelers here, man. Its all good. Wasnt my intention to start a fight or anything like that. I agree that traditional wire feed isnt really a better option for alot of things, save for sheet metal work in a body shop.

I dissagree that any welder can create a cleaner weld with SMAW than with spray-ark. There is simply nothing there ti contaminate the weld given the surface was preped right, whereas the coating on the rod itself can actually become a contaminant. Of course, a skilled welder can usually negate that possibility, but people make mistakes. Even the most skilled welder.

All of that being said, i actually prefer TIG for everything i can possibly use it on. I like having the control. And contrary to everyone elses usual expirience, i actually have an easier time welding aluminum than anything else...

LoudHandle · Aug 5, 2012

mike_s said:
No hurt feelers here, man. Its all good. Wasnt my intention to start a fight or anything like that. I agree that traditional wire feed isnt really a better option for alot of things, save for sheet metal work in a body shop.

I dissagree that any welder can create a cleaner weld with SMAW than with spray-ark. There is simply nothing there ti contaminate the weld given the surface was preped right, whereas the coating on the rod itself can actually become a contaminant. Of course, a skilled welder can usually negate that possibility, but people make mistakes. Even the most skilled welder.

All of that being said, i actually prefer TIG for everything i can possibly use it on. I like having the control. And contrary to everyone elses usual expirience, i actually have an easier time welding aluminum than anything else...

I never said any welder, I said skilled welder. Not just anybody can
Pick up a squirt gun,set it up, and run a weld that will stand the test of time either. But it looks like we agree on more than one might have thought from our first few exchanges. Sorry for the hijack but it has been informative to those who may be considering their options, back to OP's questions.

joshkoltes · Aug 5, 2012

350

So you tried to tig with the xmt and it didn't work loud handle? I haven't run that model but it looks like a great machine being it can do everything. Where as with the dynasty i would need to buy another power source for other applications. Then I have a lot of stuff to move. Was also thinking maby a trailblazer but I don't have an arm or leg to spare.
http://www.millerwelds.com/products/multiprocess/

TIG welder advice

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