Another camoplast question?

Vfrtrader · May 24, 2011

I have an 08 d8 163 and it's a trenching fool in the deep stuff. Keeping costs to a minimum, thus not doing the drivers or drop and roll. The extreme 2.5", just not enough room. A 15x163x2.313 2.86p would be perfect, if it existed. However, a 16x163x2.313 2.86p does. So, the question is, has anyone looked into trying to put a 16" in a dragon?

richracer1 · May 24, 2011

I believe the tunnel will not take a 16" track. I've heard of people having them cut to 15" though. One more thing, the 2.5" track will fit, the D&R just gives more clearance. I plan on the 155" CE for my 09 RMK w/o the D&R if I have enough money left after the engine rebuild this summer.

Vfrtrader · May 24, 2011

it might fit, but it will have very little clearence. So, the question is, will that hurt performance? All the air and snow trying to get past that small area. What are you doing to your engine? What pistons are you going to use?

richracer1 · May 24, 2011

SLP 777 kit - don't know who makes pistons for them. As for the clearance, .1" isn't that much of an increase, so I'm not going to worry about it as others have. I just don't it will take away that much if any. Just my opinion.

rmkboxer · May 24, 2011

Vfrtrader said:
it might fit, but it will have very little clearence. So, the question is, will that hurt performance? All the air and snow trying to get past that small area. What are you doing to your engine? What pistons are you going to use?

no it doesn't, if you figure 2.4-2.5 that is not much of a difference, I put the camo extreme on my 09 stock dragon and it was like adding 20hp. I am putting one on my 08 turbo dragon this summer. the drop and roll is more for aproach angle and the clearance is just a bonus. Unless you are running big hp which we are not you will be fine.

theshadowrider · May 24, 2011

rmkboxer said:
no it doesn't, if you figure 2.4-2.5 that is not much of a difference, I put the camo extreme on my 09 stock dragon and it was like adding 20hp. I am putting one on my 08 turbo dragon this summer. the drop and roll is more for aproach angle and the clearance is just a bonus. Unless you are running big hp which we are not you will be fine.

Trying to follow you? No it doesn't what?

So do you think with big hp you should not run a camo ex?

AKSNOWRIDER · May 24, 2011

I did the 2.5 extreme on my 08 dragon163, only change was track and fastrax drop and roll..up against my buddies sled with track and no drop and roll...in any powder snow over 2 ft deep the difference was noticable....his was trenching/getting stuck on flat ground..mine was going everywhere with no issue..in all shallower snow conditions you could see no noticable differences..just in the deep.....but the clearence is an issue in deep snow..the D&R kits arnt that much money, nor are they that hard to install, and they are worth doing..as for the extreme..best track I have ever used......

Hawkster · May 25, 2011

Vfrtrader said:
I have an 08 d8 163 and it's a trenching fool in the deep stuff. Keeping costs to a minimum, thus not doing the drivers or drop and roll. The extreme 2.5", just not enough room. A 15x163x2.313 2.86p would be perfect, if it existed. However, a 16x163x2.313 2.86p does. So, the question is, has anyone looked into trying to put a 16" in a dragon?

The 16" will get stuck between the brackets on the rear idler wheels on the tunnel , that is part of the reason that is causing the fraying on the tracks that they come with . There is more side to side room for the track to move on the hyfax than there is for the track to move side to side in the tunnel . I guess the Poo think tank didn't see that one ?

rmkboxer · May 25, 2011

theshadowrider said:
Trying to follow you? No it doesn't what?

So do you think with big hp you should not run a camo ex?

no it doesn't hurt the performance, I am not sure on the hp on my turbo dragon but I was told it should be around 230hp. I am putting it on it w/o even thinking twice about it. the track is great for big hp sleds but on the dragon and your turning 300hp you would probably want more clearance because you are moving alot more snow

rmkboxer · May 25, 2011

AKSNOWRIDER said:
I did the 2.5 extreme on my 08 dragon163, only change was track and fastrax drop and roll..up against my buddies sled with track and no drop and roll...in any powder snow over 2 ft deep the difference was noticable....his was trenching/getting stuck on flat ground..mine was going everywhere with no issue..in all shallower snow conditions you could see no noticable differences..just in the deep.....but the clearence is an issue in deep snow..the D&R kits arnt that much money, nor are they that hard to install, and they are worth doing..as for the extreme..best track I have ever used......

so your buddy put a camo extreme on his and can't go anywhere in 2ft of snow? sounds like rider ability there. I don't have that problem with mine

AKSNOWRIDER · May 25, 2011

rmkboxer said:
so your buddy put a camo extreme on his and can't go anywhere in 2ft of snow? sounds like rider ability there. I don't have that problem with mine

not that it wont go..just trenched badly....I know alot of guys who have just thrown the track on and been very happy with the results..but on that deep day in that snow..the difference was very noticable......

TRS · May 26, 2011

We made a jig to trim .200 off the lug height on the camo extreme. It works great with the extra clearance. Lay your front shock down. (Front track shock to lower hole on torque arm) Put a .100 thick washer on each side of the suspension where it mounts to the rear mounting bracket. (stops the track from rubbing the side of the tunnel in the rear)

Vfrtrader · May 26, 2011

Laying the shock down takes pressure off the front of the track for a better angle, thus less trenching?

Vfrtrader · May 26, 2011

If you cut the tips off the track, would the lugs be too stiff, like an assault track? Therefore, it would dig, not float and then trench. I did that to my 5.1, is that my trenching problem or is it just the track? The position of the lugs of the 5.1? Or is it set up? front shock positions? approach angle (raise the bolt hole on the tunnel)?

This is a good discission, thanks for the input

trench · May 30, 2011

AKSNOWRIDER said:
I did the 2.5 extreme on my 08 dragon163, only change was track and fastrax drop and roll..up against my buddies sled with track and no drop and roll...in any powder snow over 2 ft deep the difference was noticable....his was trenching/getting stuck on flat ground..mine was going everywhere with no issue..in all shallower snow conditions you could see no noticable differences..just in the deep.....but the clearence is an issue in deep snow..the D&R kits arnt that much money, nor are they that hard to install, and they are worth doing..as for the extreme..best track I have ever used......

AK. are you saying your buddy did the ce. 2.5 on a 163 like your's .....but did not do the drop and roll ?
How about in climbing in the deep ? did your's always out climb him ?

I know you give very reliable opinions.

Thanks.

richracer1 · May 30, 2011

What about the D&R kits that just drop the drive/jack shafts 5/8"? I'm putting a Mtn Tamer on my sled so moving the skid back is a big problem. I know it can be done, but I don't want to deal with that headache. I've found the above drop kits.

AKSNOWRIDER · May 30, 2011

trench said:
AK. are you saying your buddy did the ce. 2.5 on a 163 like your's .....but did not do the drop and roll ?
How about in climbing in the deep ? did your's always out climb him ?

I know you give very reliable opinions.

Thanks.

trench, I used to ride with 5 dragon rmk's, 2(mine and another) with the 2.5 extreme and fastrax drop and roll, 1 with just the extreme, and 2 with the stock 5.1....in anything less then 3 ft. of fresh pow the extremes were noticably better regardless of drop and roll, on the fresh deep days, the extremes with the drop and roll performed best, followed by the stockers with either the extreme or the 5.1(the extreme did trench more on the stocker(no D&R))...as I said before , you can run the extreme without the D&R, but it will trench more then one with a D&R...and we tryed every combo of suspension adjustments to try to help the trenching issues....(lower frt shock mount, softer shock, tighter limiter all helped, but not nearly as good as the D&R extremes......my buddy with the same extreme and D&R, ran stock skid, I ran the holz skid with float-2's, mine performed slightly better on the deep days as far as keeping the tunnel up and the sled going, but it wasnt enough difference to warrant the 1500 price tag i dont think...(the holz alpha skid does perform much better though)....

AKSNOWRIDER · May 30, 2011

Vfrtrader said:
If you cut the tips off the track, would the lugs be too stiff, like an assault track? Therefore, it would dig, not float and then trench. I did that to my 5.1, is that my trenching problem or is it just the track? The position of the lugs of the 5.1? Or is it set up? front shock positions? approach angle (raise the bolt hole on the tunnel)?

This is a good discission, thanks for the input

I think cutting the extreme is going to hurt its soft powder abilities, it is already quite a bit stiffer then the 5.1 to begin with and I would think end up making it really trench...(just my opinion though)

richracer1 said:
What about the D&R kits that just drop the drive/jack shafts 5/8"? I'm putting a Mtn Tamer on my sled so moving the skid back is a big problem. I know it can be done, but I don't want to deal with that headache. I've found the above drop kits.

I have heard nothing but good about the holz drop kit, but havent used one, there is plenty of clearence up frt on a dragon(with no frt cooler), the tight spot is on top right at the end of the tunnel coolers... when I did kurt's(fastrax) drop and roll I ended up with plenty of room to run the 3" extreme if I wanted... I will say this, kurts suspension mods(part of the D&R kit installation) do make the sled ride/handle better then it did stock....I already had my skid setup to limit ski lift before the D&R, and I ended up having to undo all those changes after the install because it kept the ski's planted to good...I am hoping Ak rev rider will check in here, jim runs the powerclaw with I think the holz kit so he might be able to enlighten us about it and how it does for him....

rmkboxer · May 30, 2011

the drop and roll kit is going to make a diffence whether you have a stock track or a camo extreme. the ftx d/r will give you a better aproach angle. If you want to spend the money and have the time and knowlege do it for sure. But if you don't want to do it and want the camo extreme do it it works great. this is how I made my decision. I just can't see dumping anymore money in these things so I can sell them for $5000.

akrevrider · Jun 1, 2011

FTX Drop & Roll/Mtn Tamer w/PC Track

AKSNOWRIDER said:
I think cutting the extreme is going to hurt its soft powder abilities, it is already quite a bit stiffer then the 5.1 to begin with and I would think end up making it really trench...(just my opinion though)

I have heard nothing but good about the holz drop kit, but havent used one, there is plenty of clearence up frt on a dragon(with no frt cooler), the tight spot is on top right at the end of the tunnel coolers... when I did kurt's(fastrax) drop and roll I ended up with plenty of room to run the 3" extreme if I wanted... I will say this, kurts suspension mods(part of the D&R kit installation) do make the sled ride/handle better then it did stock....I already had my skid setup to limit ski lift before the D&R, and I ended up having to undo all those changes after the install because it kept the ski's planted to good...I am hoping Ak rev rider will check in here, jim runs the powerclaw with I think the holz kit so he might be able to enlighten us about it and how it does for him....

I installed the FTX D&R kit on my 09 Dragon with a Timbersled Mountain Tamer and a 153" PowerClaw (80 duro). This combo worked very well and I would recommend it to anybody runnning the PC or CE track on the IQ.

A couple of riders here on the forums that have done this install is jkinzer and iowarmk. Kinzer lives out West and iowarmk has made a couple of trips out West and both of their setups run great.

Two major things to keep in mind is to use the same "center to center" measurements on the rear suspension and using a drop bracket on the rear suspension mounting bracket. Timbersled makes a drop bracket and iowarmk made a couple of custom brackets that I used.

Pretty sure iowarmk posted a couple of pics in one of the IQ threads if you do a search on his posts. I have his detailed instructions that I can send to you if for the Timbersled & FTX D&R route.

akrevider

Another camoplast question?

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