Avalanche air bags

Powderboy said:

I'm sure I could do a search on this question but since technology changes so fast I wanted to get some up to date opinions on the best ABS back packs out right now and how much I would expect to pay. Also avalung type packs?? Anybody using them instead of ABS?

Thanks

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Go to www.snowbigdeal.com and you'll see all the current options and get the info u need. Snowmobilers shouldnt rely on an avalung.....go with an avy pack or avy vest. The avalung doesnt work well with the helmets we wear

after 3 years of speculation, checking out abs, snowpulse, and bca i believe that the snowpulse is without a doubt much better than the other 2. offers trauma protection and uses oxygen no need to send off bag to get nitrogen refill.

BCA can be filled at any dive shop or fire station

Tried and true ABS user here.

Air Bags

I did alot of reading before I got myslef and my wife a pair of avy bags. The following infomation I hope ,will help you make the right choice for you . First any air bag system is better than not having one at all , but there are some very distinct difference's . Alot of people think Abs are filled with nitrogen, they are not. 70% of the air in the bag is from outside. The nitrogen cylinder is used to make a ventury along with the black valves that are on both of the air bags ,this pulls in outside air in to help fill the bag. Most of the dealers that are selling the bags have cylinders and triggers on hand for around 29.95 US. The down side to the freeride 4liter is that it has limited space to carry your stuff, the only reason I use the the 4 liter is it seems to be the most popular bag and I own two of them myself .
I called snowpluse and got a lot of good information from them, they went on to say that the snowpluse bag used compressed air to inflate the bag which is fine. I would think that your local scuba shop will charge you from 10.00 to 20.00 bucks to refill the cylinder . They emphasized alot about the snowpluse unit tends to leave the victim head up-vertical and close to the surface,where the abs unit tends to leave the victim face down -horizontal and close to the surface . Well if the average rider is 5'10 and they are under the surface 1 foot ,that means you have to dig over 6 foot before the rider can be rescued . On the other hand the abs system tends to leave the victim close to the surface laying flat you only have to remove 1 foot of snow before the victim is out . The snowpluse offers alot of protection around the head from trama which abs does not .
I recently looked at the new bca system it looked like a well made bag the price was alot better than abs or snowpluse but i heard by the way of hear say i have no facts or eyewitness accounts to back this up but i was told that on more than one occasion the bca bags have failed to inflate when tested . I think if thier is a problem with the bca system it will be fixed and at that price they will own the market share for avy bags .

In closing the abs to my knowledge has never failed to inflate ,they have the longest track record which for me carries alot of weight . I hope i have brought good information on this subject for you, but remember buy what you feel is the best for you and KNOW HOW TO USE IT .

I bought me and my wife a couple BCA packs for X-Mas. It looks like a very nice pack. Good capartments, water proof zippers, high quality construction. I haven't had any time with them on the snow yet but will soon. We blew them off about 6 times last night for fun. I just used my scuba cylinders and a paintball adapter to refill them. They have an instructional video on their site how to do it. Super easy. Considering you should test the bag every year it's nice to have a low cost and convenient refill option. The only slight concern I have is the amount of force to pull the trigger. With a sharp tug I can do it with out any problem, but it takes my wife two hands to get it to inflate. Maybe that would account for the rumored malfunction mentioned above.

I was sold on BCA for the easy refill and lower cost. I haven't had my hands on any of the other brands

roughrider99 said:

after 3 years of speculation, checking out abs, snowpulse, and bca i believe that the snowpulse is without a doubt much better than the other 2. offers trauma protection and uses oxygen no need to send off bag to get nitrogen refill.

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ABS does not have to be sent off. You just need a new nitrogen cannister which are very easy to get and cost 25 bucks. I like ABS, i have been using them for 6 years. I also like the fact there is two bags instead of one. I'll take the nitrogen over the air any day. JMO of course. I didn't like the first snowpulses because they were too long in the torso which has since been changed by the looks of the newest bags.

Just buy any of the 3 and you will be better off gear wise. Everyone should have a bag, beacon, shovel, probe ! No excuses !

i stand corrected by summitboy. would also like to mention that the snowpulse uses the venturi effect to fill the bag. my group has bca and snowpulse cause we will be having a scuba tank at the cabin setup so we can test,refill at any time. big seller for me was how the snowpulse bag shape makes it east to create a huge air pocket around your head.

I have the new BCA float 30 that I have been second guessing until yesterday.

When I got the unit, the tank was empty. Since everyone that I talked to said that the tank should have been received full I immediately thought there was a problem.

I contacted BCA and was told to have the unit filled at a scuba shop.

After fill, I test fired and had it filled again.

The tank sat for a week, and I rode 2 times with it. I decided to check the air gauge and the air can was empty.

Immediately I contacted BCA and was told that I need to re-install the o-ring and grease (I did this originally after I test fired) so I did as instructed.

Tank sat for 1 day and I checked it and saw full pressure on the gauge. I rode the next day and as chance would have it, I was involved in an Avalanche. I set the slide while doing a powercarve on a smaller bowl and the slide came down about 3' deep and 300' long. I was on the very edge and able to ride across the mountain with the edge of the avi pushing my sled that direction, needless to say it was frightening and the bca ripcord was the first thing on my mind but I did not pull.

When I got home, I checked the airbag tank pressure again, and it is down to half of what it should be. 2 days later (today) it is empty.

The tank is leaking air out of the male adapter, and when under water it shows 1 small bubble per second. I called BCA on Friday but never got a phone call back. (must have been having their Holiday party).

V-MAN If your wife needs 2 hands to pull the ripcord, there is something wrong with the pack. I would contact BCA as mine fired with a short firm tug when tested.

dmkhnr said:

When I got the unit, the tank was empty. Since everyone that I talked to said that the tank should have been received full I immediately thought there was a problem.

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Both of mine came empty too. I ordered them from Mountaingear.com. I thought maybe it had something to do with shipping via air. They've been holding air perfectly.

dmkhnr said:

The tank is leaking air out of the male adapter, and when under water it shows 1 small bubble per second. I called BCA on Friday but never got a phone call back. (must have been having their Holiday party).

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I don't think BCA would advise you to do this, but if I were you I'd just unscrew that fitting, put on some fresh thread tape, and tighten her back up. A quick one minute fix (provided it was the threads leaking) instead of dealing with shipping it back etc.

dmkhnr said:

V-MAN If your wife needs 2 hands to pull the ripcord, there is something wrong with the pack. I would contact BCA as mine fired with a short firm tug when tested.

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I had no problem firing either of our packs. They both take about the same amount of pull. Just like you said, short firm tug. Thinking something may have been wrong with one of them I had her try the other one too. She has the same issue with both , takes two hands. My wife isn't exactly wimpy either. I'm guessing they errored on the side of less false deployments and made it tough, too tough for the ladies.

dmkhnr said:

I have the new BCA float 30 that I have been second guessing until yesterday.

When I got the unit, the tank was empty. Since everyone that I talked to said that the tank should have been received full I immediately thought there was a problem.

I contacted BCA and was told to have the unit filled at a scuba shop.

After fill, I test fired and had it filled again.

The tank sat for a week, and I rode 2 times with it. I decided to check the air gauge and the air can was empty.

Immediately I contacted BCA and was told that I need to re-install the o-ring and grease (I did this originally after I test fired) so I did as instructed.

Tank sat for 1 day and I checked it and saw full pressure on the gauge. I rode the next day and as chance would have it, I was involved in an Avalanche. I set the slide while doing a powercarve on a smaller bowl and the slide came down about 3' deep and 300' long. I was on the very edge and able to ride across the mountain with the edge of the avi pushing my sled that direction, needless to say it was frightening and the bca ripcord was the first thing on my mind but I did not pull.

When I got home, I checked the airbag tank pressure again, and it is down to half of what it should be. 2 days later (today) it is empty.

The tank is leaking air out of the male adapter, and when under water it shows 1 small bubble per second. I called BCA on Friday but never got a phone call back. (must have been having their Holiday party).

V-MAN If your wife needs 2 hands to pull the ripcord, there is something wrong with the pack. I would contact BCA as mine fired with a short firm tug when tested.

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Mine leaked also.

Since I live close to BCA, I called them and they told me to bring it in for a refill and check. When I got there they exchanged for the new style no questions asked and commented there were a few canisters out there which leak.

Mine was last years pack, everyone with that style needs to really watch the pressure (as you should anyways).

Float 30 packs are the cheapest on the market for a reason. You get what you pay for.

http://www.snowestonline.com/forum/showthread.php?t=239463

Avalanche Safety Solutions

Powderboy said:

I'm sure I could do a search on this question but since technology changes so fast I wanted to get some up to date opinions on the best ABS back packs out right now and how much I would expect to pay. Also avalung type packs?? Anybody using them instead of ABS?

Thanks

Click to expand...

www.avalanchesafety.ca Has all the different brands as well. With some really nice information and how-to videos.

A few factors I came to realize after being caught in a slide a few weeks ago.

#1: The face down thing FREAKED me out at first. I thought it was a negative & didn't like the idea of my face being in the snow.
That said, in reality I was under till I pulled the cord & then moved to the top (face down), when I stopped my head was under a little bit of snow. Had I been face up, that snow would have been in my mouth & nose, being face down allowed gravity to pull the snow down instead of dropping it in my mouth.

#2: TWO BAGS. After being drug along rocks under the slide (tore me up a bit) I realize that the chance of the bags being popped is relatively significant. I'm very happy that I have two of them with that in mind.

#3: What saved my life was the ability to swim. Had I been sitting face up on my back I feel that I would not have been able to effect my own rescue like I did. I also am not sure that with a snowpulse I would be able to swim in the manner that I did. The manner in which the snowpulse deploys, seems to m,e would make it tough to swim, even if you were in an ideal position to swim. I also just barely caught sight of the bush I swam toward, and feel that visibility is pretty key.

As a kayaker, I think of a slide somewhat being like whitewater. Being on top is good, but you need to get your AZZ moving toward self rescue. There are rocks & trees all over the place, even if you're on top... you NEED to avoid the oncoming trauma that these items can bring.

Two days after my incident, snowbigdeal had a new canister & trigger at my door... pretty easy & pretty darn cheap. If it costing $20 less to be in a slide is a big factor for you... you should really cut back a bit!

Based on my experience, my choice would be ABS, BCA, AVI-VEST, then snowpulse. I like the snowpulse bag, but do not at ALL like how it works. This order was pretty different before the slide, and instead of having some vague ideas of how things would work & figuring that any of them would BASICALLY do the same thing... now I'm much more opinionated about WHY I prefer the ABS.

Kaleb


edit:

Hey, one thing I should mention... I wear a Leatt (neck) brace, so I don't need(as much anyhow) the head protection offered by the snowpulse. IF you ride without a helmet... I think the snowpulse is a totally different story.

Glad you are alright.
I to use the ABS packer these reasons: Track record, reliable, proven, comfortable, many models to choose, from and support from dealers like SnowbigDeal and many others.
Note:I would freak out if the tank would self empty, where is the QC.

I talked to bca today and they are sending me a new canister.

I thought about taking the threaded nipple off for inspection, but didn't want to give reason to question the warranty.

Never-the-less, I filled the canister again this morning and rode with it today. I should have my new canister Wed.

backcountryislife said:

As a kayaker, I think of a slide somewhat being like whitewater. Being on top is good, but you need to get your AZZ moving toward self rescue. There are rocks & trees all over the place, even if you're on top... you NEED to avoid the oncoming trauma that these items can bring.

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The Snowpulse system actually acts very much like a lifejacket in whitewater. You should put yourself into a "defensive swimming" position, just like you would if you bailed out of your kayak during a nasty stretch of rapids. Laying on your back, with your feet out in front of you and your eyes on what's coming at you. You still have your arms and your feet with which you can attempt to maneuver yourself laterally or help to absorb impacts.

abs all the way

EinarHanson said:

The Snowpulse system actually acts very much like a lifejacket in whitewater. You should put yourself into a "defensive swimming" position, just like you would if you bailed out of your kayak during a nasty stretch of rapids. Laying on your back, with your feet out in front of you and your eyes on what's coming at you. You still have your arms and your feet with which you can attempt to maneuver yourself laterally or help to absorb impacts.

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The whitewater float position is GREAT for class II & III... above that... you better flip yer butt over & SWIM.

Being in a slide is more like class V. If you ever want to see how effective the WW float position is in class V... give me a call. I'm the photographer on the hardest commercially rafted section in the country, and the float position is the last place you want to be in if you expect to actually get out of the river.

I do see that you would have SOME ability to control your float, but not nearly as much as I'd want. I can't say this strong enough... I am rather positive I would be dead right now if I was wearing a snowpulse bag two weeks ago.