Another Yamadoo

Turbo11T · Jun 25, 2010

Little background, last year I bought a yamaha vector turbo, redid the entire turbo system to a mid mount. I rode it this past winter and found that it is a man killer(have to man handle the sled). I wasn't able to get comfortable on the sled. I have always been a ski doo guy and prefer skidoo but in my quest for power and reliabilty I went to the yamaha. I have always wanted to do a yamadoo and now I am going to make it happen.

Sled will be a ski doo rev 162 with a mid mount turbo yamaha vector motor.

Here are a few pics of where I am at right now. I plan to make some progress on it this weekend. Funny that it is middle of summer and I am working on the sled. The bottom line is that I enjoy the fabrication as much as I do the riding. And I have never gotten big into summer time motorsports.

Vector motor with mid mount turbo, Also temporary plenum for mock up.

Old Home, new home.. . . .

rev engine compartment

Template for mounting locations in relation to jackshaft.

Turbo11T · Jun 25, 2010

Couple Thoughts on weight

I love my rev chassis, and of course I am worried that the chassis will not handle the same as it did with the twin 2 stroke due to the added weight of the 4 stroke motor. So I have been weighing things. I know my scale may not be totally accurate but it should be close and i have weighed everything on the same scale so if it is off it is off equally for everything.

That being said, I am quite happy with where i think i will be at the end of the build.

The ski doo motor, pipe, silencer, carbs, airbox, oil tank, y-pipe weighed 122lbs
The yamaha motor(as shown) as well as intercooler, charge tube and oil tank weighed 165lbs

So we are looking at a 43 lb difference. I would say that is not to bad, surely not as bad as I thought it would be. The advertised dry wieght of the rev is 489lbs in 04 for a 159 with a 800 twin. That is very close to have I have. I think I could even be lighter. With this estimate I think I will come in at under 540lbs dry on the sled. This is 51 lbs. I attribute 43 to the motor and that allows 8lbs for motor mounts. At 540lbs dry it should be under the weight of a nytro.

Also the motor will be back much further in the chassis compared to the ski doo motor and pipe, moving the weight back should help the sled not become nose heavy.

Also plan to have a couple other weight saving measures in place by the time snow flies. I plan to have floats on the front(-6lbs over stock) and a couple other things, like possible lexan panels. Figure this should save aprox total 10-15lbs off the front of the sled.

Please feel free to weigh in on the build, constructive critisism only please.

Wheel House Motorsports · Jun 25, 2010

hmmm.. cool idea! ahah.

IMO, mount the battery back under the seat, or on the side, I put mine up in the nose, that coupled with other things just put to much weight up there. I would work on a motor mount idea with you, but RT bulkheads are fairly differnt.

good luck on the build, should be a BLAST. once you get it done you should head out west and come ride. we can go for a yamadoo ride, except mine is the heavier version, bigger motor and chassis.

Turbo11T · Jun 25, 2010

Mounts

Ski-Dooin it said:
hmmm.. cool idea! ahah.

IMO, mount the battery back under the seat, or on the side, I put mine up in the nose, that coupled with other things just put to much weight up there. I would work on a motor mount idea with you, but RT bulkheads are fairly differnt.

good luck on the build, should be a BLAST. once you get it done you should head out west and come ride. we can go for a yamadoo ride, except mine is the heavier version, bigger motor and chassis.

The battery is most likely going to go in the battery holder that I have from a sdi sled, the one that mounts to the chaincase, it may end up being remade with alu but that is where i am planning to put it as of now. The seat will have a custom gas tank under it and cut out for that. So no room there.

I have the motor mounts figured out in my head already I just need to get my measurements to build them.

I had my CTC/motor alignment tool machined today at work so If my neighbor remembers to pick up his lift I can get alot done this weekend.

Trashy · Jun 25, 2010

*FINALLY* an accurate weight on a Yamaha engine...... for some reason no one likes to publish such info.

Turbo11T · Jun 25, 2010

No problem.

yammy1320 said:
*FINALLY* an accurate weight on a Yamaha engine...... for some reason no one likes to publish such info.

A note, That is with the turbo and thickwall SS header. Would guess the motor to weigh more like 130-140lbs without the turbo, header and IC.

Theres no doubt they are heavier but really not any heavier than the old triples that alot of guys ran, I am pretty sure that the WC triple by the time you get pipes weighs at least this much. They are a HUGE motor.

Wheel House Motorsports · Jun 25, 2010

very true, the motors arent to much heavier, there definately is more, but it aint so bad.

If the sdi battery your gonna run is only the little one that the rev had on it, GO BIGGER. i ran a decent bit larger one and still killed it a few times up in the hills. i ran a spare one from the 1000sdi doing testing last summer and killed it pretty quick cranking that big motor over.

and turn your attack 20 the right way. and clip all the litte support ribs off the front and back, it makes it a LOT more flexable, seems to work well in the deeper snow but still be stiff enough for spring snow.

and I see longhairfreak is watching, probably here to put down your build as stupid.

pus1100 · Jun 25, 2010

if my memory serves me right,my vector motor with carbs,midmount header and stock clutch weighed 56 kilogram,my thundercat motor with carbs,exhaust joints(not pipes) and p85 clutch came in at 62 kilograms.i think the 1200wc motor is even heavier than the tcat.i know that tcat engine has the the waterpump/balance shaft,but 1200 wc has much beefier crank,cylinders.have you considered using yamaha chaincase and secondary clutch?PITA with those DOO chain/cases.can't handle power.plus you can free up some space with the outside caliper/brakedisc on the yamicase.will follow your build,hoping someone puts together an iqr/apex motored soon:face-icon-small-hap

Turbo11T · Jun 25, 2010

huh

pus1100 said:
if my memory serves me right,my vector motor with carbs,midmount header and stock clutch weighed 56 kilogram,my thundercat motor with carbs,exhaust joints(not pipes) and p85 clutch came in at 62 kilograms.i think the 1200wc motor is even heavier than the tcat.i know that tcat engine has the the waterpump/balance shaft,but 1200 wc has much beefier crank,cylinders.have you considered using yamaha chaincase and secondary clutch?PITA with those DOO chain/cases.can't handle power.plus you can free up some space with the outside caliper/brakedisc on the yamicase.will follow your build,hoping someone puts together an iqr/apex motored soon:face-icon-small-hap

Huh that is quite interesting.

The reason I'm not planning using the yammy chaincase is because I like how the doo one fits in there. I have the motor hanging on the lift tonight though and think that I may need to move the jackshft back some so if I do this the yamaha chaincase will most likely go on the sled too. I I I personally don't care for how hard it is to work on a a yamaha chainxase compared to the doo one.

I guess we will see tommorrow where we are at and stuff.

We have no power here as we had some very severe storms role through tonight I would sure this we would again soon though.

Turbo11T · Jun 26, 2010

motor fits

got the motor sitting in the chassis with my alignment bar on it. I am very happy with how it will fit. Am going to need a different plenum but that is ok as I planned to remake the one anyways. Here are some pictures please enjoy. As I sure am excited about this monster sitting in my garage. I am taking a break for some ice cream and then going to go back to work here this afternoon. Should be a productive weekend.

Cut the middle motor mount brace out and opened up the bulkhead side a little more.

Motor in chassis with alignment bar in place.

Wheel House Motorsports · Jun 26, 2010

your lucky, the vector motor seems to fit between the little legs that go up to the steering post mount, I had to build custom ones and its a little bit of a hassle. the vec motor looks right at home in a rev, the rx1 one is a tad big for them, but oh well, not like I dont mind work eh?? looking good, your current header setup should work out really well.

rmking600 · Jun 26, 2010

wow that is a sick build i hope to ake one of these on day when i have the know how but when i make one i plane on making the whole thing and taking the best from every manufacturer but the apex motor w/ a super on it in a rider forward chasis. good luck and keep us posted gotta love the rev

Turbo11T · Jun 26, 2010

Hitting

Ski-Dooin it said:
your lucky, the vector motor seems to fit between the little legs that go up to the steering post mount, I had to build custom ones and its a little bit of a hassle. the vec motor looks right at home in a rev, the rx1 one is a tad big for them, but oh well, not like I dont mind work eh?? looking good, your current header setup should work out really well.

Yeah, it kinda fits in between, I can definately see why the 4 cylinder would not. It is sitting against the motor on the mag side on the valve cover. I think some slight modification and It will be able to be used easily enough.

Yeah that motor did seem pretty happy to fit in the chassis. It does take up the entire bulkhead.

As I was working on it this morning I was thinking about my alignment bar I had made. It is the ski doo CTC distance. I was thinking I wonder if the OD of the bottom of the clutch is the same as the ski doo. So I checked it and the ski doo one is about .100 smaller in Dia. This should be no problem as that can easily be taken up in the secondary belt hieght adjustment. Also if I have a custom jackshaft made I can adjust the yamaha secondary belt width to easily take up that little difference. It wasn't enough to make me wanna have the guy remake the alignment bar.

Wheel House Motorsports · Jun 26, 2010

yeah, thats a LOT closer then mine is, as long as the ctc is close, you can adjust out with belt delfection adjustment for say a worn belt. just get it in square, mine is in SO crooked it sadens me, I didnt realize how bent it was in there, but the motor has to sit in about 5 degrees out of alignment.

as for filling the bulkhead, luckily the RT has a 2" longer one, makes it a lot roomier in the front of the setup, BUT, the problem is the gear reduction makes the thing a PAIN and I had to notch the bulkhead a tiny bit below the clutch BC of it, really sucked to have to do that, again, the vector motor is definately more simple without that as well making it work out rather well.

also, laying the motor back like that should really help with the whole carb/steering post clearance issue. also helping the ergonomics out more with the motor rocked back nicely. You might just get away with moving the top of the post into the 2" forward position that people do on the stock little hoop up top/ having the jackshaft out of the way is a nice little perk as well for going midmount, I have enough cleanrance my new mounts might rock the motor back a TAD more, I just kept mine forwards originally to give me room with a stock tank in there. Looks good so far and I see lots of things your doing smarter better then my first one that im sorta copying mentally for reworking thats going on this summer/fall on mine. litte stuff that makes it work better

rmking600 · Jun 27, 2010

ok so if you transplant one of these in a two stroke sled can you tillt the motor back it make it handle the weight better or is it all in the spot were its mounted

Turbo11T · Jun 27, 2010

Tilted motor

Ski-Dooin it said:
yeah, thats a LOT closer then mine is, as long as the ctc is close, you can adjust out with belt delfection adjustment for say a worn belt. just get it in square, mine is in SO crooked it sadens me, I didnt realize how bent it was in there, but the motor has to sit in about 5 degrees out of alignment.

as for filling the bulkhead, luckily the RT has a 2" longer one, makes it a lot roomier in the front of the setup, BUT, the problem is the gear reduction makes the thing a PAIN and I had to notch the bulkhead a tiny bit below the clutch BC of it, really sucked to have to do that, again, the vector motor is definately more simple without that as well making it work out rather well.

also, laying the motor back like that should really help with the whole carb/steering post clearance issue. also helping the ergonomics out more with the motor rocked back nicely. You might just get away with moving the top of the post into the 2" forward position that people do on the stock little hoop up top/ having the jackshaft out of the way is a nice little perk as well for going midmount, I have enough cleanrance my new mounts might rock the motor back a TAD more, I just kept mine forwards originally to give me room with a stock tank in there. Looks good so far and I see lots of things your doing smarter better then my first one that im sorta copying mentally for reworking thats going on this summer/fall on mine. litte stuff that makes it work better

Yeah tilting the motor back in the chassis I think should make a nice difference in where the weight is and how the chassis feels with this motor in it.

I cannot take the credit for the ideas I have about how to mount the motor in the chassis. I have stared at pics of Jtabs, carbondaddies and that other one from canada for a couple years now pondering how they did it and deciding how I would do it. I also watched how you did yours last year and was a bit worried about he strength of your motor mounts. So I cannot take the glory away from any of the orginal guys who did this. We all though do it a bit differently though and that make each one there own. I think a kit would sure be sweet, much like the bondi triple kit but it would take alot of r&d to make something I would feel comfortable sending out and I don't have that time at this point in my life.

I am taking great care to keep my ctc distance perfect as well. I am sure at final assembly that the motor will need to be shimmed slightly to be perfect but that is ok, Not a big deal. AS I DONT plan on taking the motor out after I have it in to often anyways, HAHA.

I have the front mounts cut out and machined now I just need to get some more time in the garage to fit them up and do the finish work on them and decide how I can lighten them up. Right now they are a block of aluminum. I am sure I can cut the weight in half(and still be strong) but will need to figure a couple things first.

I cannot wait to have the motor mounted and whatnot then I will slow down on the project I am sure for a little while. Can't have it done to early.

rmking600 · Jun 27, 2010

ok so lets say i take out all of my mounts and every thin i can out of a belly pan i line up mounts line up clutches and hook everything up and its good to goo as long as its all balanced and in line right. can you post some pics of the mounts???

Turbo11T · Jun 27, 2010

Whoa. . . Hold your horses. . .

rmking600 said:
ok so lets say i take out all of my mounts and every thin i can out of a belly pan i line up mounts line up clutches and hook everything up and its good to goo as long as its all balanced and in line right. can you post some pics of the mounts???

Hold your horses. . .

What motor do you wanna put in what chassis? It is not super simple. I would not recommend it unless you have access to a machine shop and a can weld aluminum well, or have the money to pay someone too. There is alot of custom stuff that needs to be fabbed to make it work, and there is nothing off the shelf. Every yamadoo, yamaha-polaris, yamahacat's are one off builds no two are the same that I have seen thus far.

I will be posting some pics tonight of the mounts.

JTAB · Jun 27, 2010

I agree lots of things will come up steering, intercooler, oil tank etc motor fit is easy the rest is the hard part. But it all can be done, and it works this sled will be a blast to ride. :smile:

Turbo11T · Jun 27, 2010

MOunts

Well here are some pics of the front mounts, right now they are pretty crude and bulky. The first pic shows the mounts sitting on the tunnel, the second and third shows the aprox location of the mount. The fourth shows my temporary mount location drilled in a temporary pc of flat stock aluminum that will be gone once these mounts are mounted. The mount will mount forward to the front of the bulkhead and on the sides of the bulkhead as well. I also plan to add another .063 pc of aluminum to the mag side bottom of the bulkhead side to beef it up a little.

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