Why can't a King Cat sidehill like an M sled?

high time · Dec 3, 2009

I've been trying to figure this out for years. My King can punch stright up higher than most M sleds but if breaking into a sidehill will angle a M-sled up and over, I might not be able to do it with the King. I have Simmons. Is that the problem, or maybe it's the weight more foreward? Maybe it's the total weight. I don't know. I know the M is easier to tip over, but why? You'd think the sled with the higher center of gravity, would be easier to tip. You'd think that if your on a sidehill The things that bump you off of it would be the runningboards and fat skies like the Simmons.

Ideas?

Owen

diggerdown · Dec 3, 2009

I think being forward more and the ski stance is a little narrower. I have never liked simmons on my sleds because they do make it harder to lay them over. With my bars forward and standing at my footwells, its pretty easy to lay my king over. If it's real steep I have a tendency to keep my line by using the tail swing to correct my line. I use C&A pros and add a 10" long, 1/4"square wear rod to the outbound side. I just make my own bars up. The M's are just plain balanced better but I have never had a XP or Nytro that could follow my lines with my king!

Arctic Thunder · Dec 3, 2009

Don't know why but I can side hill my old 900 all day long with ease compared to the M.

Just for comparison. I know both my boys one is 15 the other is 12 can pull the 900 1M up and ride a side hill much easier than on the M. Maybe it is the 1000. Don't know.

But I have found just the opposite of what you are seeing.

Thunder

high time · Dec 3, 2009

Arctic..what skis are you running?

Digger down, I think those skiis of yours soud like a good idea. Do the tops of them hold a lot of snow? The Simmons don't hold much.

Owen

diggerdown · Dec 3, 2009

No they don't hold much snow. They are only the 6" wide, but they have a pretty aggressive keel and with the side-bars I add they hold onto almost anything. The C&A XT's are 7" wide and have a very aggresssive keel and plastic side runners but they also pretty heavy and can catch you by supprise if you hook an edge.

horn813 · Dec 3, 2009

Owen- I've run Powder Pros on all my 1Ms and love the way they handle. My brothers got the same sled as mine and is running Simmons Gen I and his sled can't hold a line like mine can. Night and day difference in the handling dept.

powdercraver · Dec 3, 2009

I dont know if this will help but ive both ridden the 2003 800 polaris rmk and a 2003.5 900 mountain cat. And if i recall correctly the 2003 and 2006 900 cats had the same chassis. My point was, to get the polaris to sidehill was a piece of cake compared to the 900. i think the 900 just had a really bad chassis with the rider sitting way back and the engine way up front. This uneven weight distribution made it really hard for me to sidehill. On the other hand the polaris chassis by then was way more advanced. Same with the m its a new chassis with rider forward position and its retardedly easy to sidehill on it.

high time · Dec 3, 2009

I'll get those skiis and give them a try.

I think the King Cat can use the big wide skiis going down a hill, but are not so good for sidehilling.

Thanks, Owen

2zeros · Dec 3, 2009

I think it is the rider...............

I love my KK, I have moved the post forward, and have added the M-series skis. I feel it is what feels comfortable to you. I also feel a good rider that can sidehill good, can sidehill anything. Some sleds require more/less input than others. Even comparing the same chassis against each other, with the setup and rider being the only differance. -00's

KMMAC · Dec 3, 2009

I used to side hill a 580Z with a 136 and simmons skis all day long. You first have to play with the suspension some for that type of riding. Just depends on how your chassis is setup. NONE of these sleds come setup for everyone to ride you have to tweak it a little. It was the same with my zrt 8 it was heavy as he// and once setup, I could side hill it just about as good as the z.

Going West · Dec 3, 2009

Simmons suck, thats half your problem, get a forward mount post, best mod ever for the king, and that baby will side hill like nothing all day long. The M is easier to through around but old king sidehilled with the best of them.

sunbather1969 · Dec 3, 2009

years on same chassis

then somethings wrong with setup i have a stock king with poly hood, pp's and ce track and with last year being my first on it, well i can sidehill took me awhile to get it set up with constantly changing conditions last year but if i would have searched i would have figured it right out on this site, all the settings are the same on a king regardless of rider weight as far as im concerned unless you really want to get picky and upgrade suspension. light pressure on front springs, light preload on center and light on rear! TELL ME IF IM WRONG GUYS DON'T WANT TO LEAD HIM WRONG. i still bought a m this year and guess what, its set up all fvcked up at least i learned the shocks are on there way to zbros after 3 rides,got her figured out.....search function is awesome ps simmons skis do suck wanna buy some 1 or 2s

high time · Dec 4, 2009

One day on a sidehill.........

On a steep slope my sidehill was good but I couldn't angle uphill, while two M sleds could angle slightly up. They went to the top and I couldn't make it. Pizzed me off.

I think it was the Simmons, just wondering what you guys thought. My sled has way more power, more track and is King many times, but just not that time.

Owen

diggerdown · Dec 4, 2009

We all know that you won't beat everyone, all the time. I think the biggest difference in that angle cut up, is the old style belly pan dragging on the side. The M's tuck them in a little more and you don't see that bellypan mark at the edge of your track. But the simmons do have their draw-backs. They trail very well, take up shock and float but they are heavy, widen your stance making it harder to tip them up, and tend to drag under certain snow conditions.

Arctic Thunder · Dec 4, 2009

sunbather1969 said:
then somethings wrong with setup i have a stock king with poly hood, pp's and ce track and with last year being my first on it, well i can sidehill took me awhile to get it set up with constantly changing conditions last year but if i would have searched i would have figured it right out on this site, all the settings are the same on a king regardless of rider weight as far as im concerned unless you really want to get picky and upgrade suspension. light pressure on front springs, light preload on center and light on rear! TELL ME IF IM WRONG GUYS DON'T WANT TO LEAD HIM WRONG. i still bought a m this year and guess what, its set up all fvcked up at least i learned the shocks are on there way to zbros after 3 rides,got her figured out.....search function is awesome ps simmons skis do suck wanna buy some 1 or 2s

I am still running the junk parabolic's. And I think sunbather hit the nail on the head. I run the front springs pretty loose so the front end will colapse a bit easier. If the front springs are to tight you fight it.

Thunder

76FOMOCO · Dec 4, 2009

Arctic Thunder said:
I am still running the junk parabolic's. And I think sunbather hit the nail on the head. I run the front springs pretty loose so the front end will colapse a bit easier. If the front springs are to tight you fight it.

Thunder

I prefer the stock ski's over the pp they side hill way easier, and if you add the woodys dooly (sp) they handle very well on the trail too. the pp like to push you back down when you have to hold a line.
Yes as stated above the front shock as loose as you can get the spring with no load on it and take it up about 2-3 turns just to keep the spring from coming loose. Do the same with the middle shock and adjust the rear just to keep you from bottoming out. I have even had rev riders take mine for a spin and dump it on the side and come back to say how easy this thing lays over.

sunbather1969 · Dec 4, 2009

forgot

my pp's are cut on the rear that helped me lay it over

trappersnapper · Dec 4, 2009

side hill

just want to know if i got this right front ski shocks run loose along with the the front skid shock and set up rear

76FOMOCO · Dec 4, 2009

trappersnapper said:
just want to know if i got this right front ski shocks run loose along with the the front skid shock and set up rear

yep set up the rear so in the hard bumps you just almost bottom out.

and get a forward mount post.

MT rydn · Dec 4, 2009

very easy to sidehill / pull on side / side hill MC in my opinion. get your weight shifted and counter steer and is piece of cake. Learn to use your feet on the running board to push the rear end where you want it to go even makes those turns quicker. 12 year son also agree with that and he can side hill it easily (as he did through the trees last year riding with the 'men' !) I like the stock ski.

I was on M series and skidoo before riding a buddy's 2004 MC (never rode one before couple years ago because thought they looked like they would not handle well!)- after riding his MC I bought two! newer sleds better in the rough stuff and on trails with better suspension and sitting position. But if like the hills and powder, and a trail is just a road to get you to the riding I think the MC/KK are best.

Why can't a King Cat sidehill like an M sled?

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