Photos of MDS weights

Camo-toe,

I see what you are saying but that was not what I was looking for. Maybe the example below will explain better for what I am asking:

A current 2011 M8 has a 68gram light tip weight as its stock weight for the 6000-9000' elevation setup. An M1000 (I believe) uses a 80gram light tip weight as its stock weight for the same elevation. Now take out the stock weights and install MDS weights. Typical setups with the MDS weights are in the area of 8 grams (give or take) over the stock weights...so for an M8 we are looking for around 76grams and for an M1000 we are looking for around 88grams. I believe that the base weight of the MDS weights are the same for an M8 and an M1000...for this example lets assume 72grams. That means we need 4 grams added for the M8 and 16grams added for the M1000. Here is my question...why for the M8 is the added weight only on the tip yet on the M1000 it is across the whole body?? Why not place the added weight across the whole body on the M8 as well?

different power curve the m1000 can take the pull, the 800 you want it to engage then rev up then hold the belt tight when running max track speed. Look at it like this as the clutch shifts the roller moves down the weight, if you have weight in the middle hole once the roller passes that point of weight it no longer has leverage, if its in the tip it has leverage but slowly looses the leverage as you increase speed ie the roller get closer to the tip and with less leverage its like dropping weight to keep the rpm up. If you just loaded the middle it would be a dog of bottom and then loose its pull on the top because after it broke the leverage point you would have to add a bunch more weight to maintain rpm. The m1000 you need to harness the torque quicker or you just have belt slip in the mid, it creates a smoother transition through the shift. Mainly its because the m1000 has the power to pull it.

Tee-Kay said:

Camo-toe,

I see what you are saying but that was not what I was looking for. Maybe the example below will explain better for what I am asking:

A current 2011 M8 has a 68gram light tip weight as its stock weight for the 6000-9000' elevation setup. An M1000 (I believe) uses a 80gram light tip weight as its stock weight for the same elevation. Now take out the stock weights and install MDS weights. Typical setups with the MDS weights are in the area of 8 grams (give or take) over the stock weights...so for an M8 we are looking for around 76grams and for an M1000 we are looking for around 88grams. I believe that the base weight of the MDS weights are the same for an M8 and an M1000...for this example lets assume 72grams. That means we need 4 grams added for the M8 and 16grams added for the M1000. Here is my question...why for the M8 is the added weight only on the tip yet on the M1000 it is across the whole body?? Why not place the added weight across the whole body on the M8 as well?

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Sorry I should of got into it more. The problem on the 1000, and I could be wrong because I don't own the weights yet... Is you cant load 16grams into just the tip of the weight. Even with the weight fully loaded into the tip it's not enough weight to pull the rpm for the 1000 down. It needs more base and heel weight to get enough weight to pull down rpms. I bet a 1000 with a 4 post clutch would not have this problem, could get away with just minimal tip weight. It's like some issues guys are having with 800s at lower elvation, tip weight is full and can't get rpms down so they have to start adding into the heel.

Camo-toe said:

Sorry I should of got into it more. The problem on the 1000, and I could be wrong because I don't own the weights yet... Is you cant load 16grams into just the tip of the weight. Even with the weight fully loaded into the tip it's not enough weight to pull the rpm for the 1000 down. It needs more base and heel weight to get enough weight to pull down rpms. I bet a 1000 with a 4 post clutch would not have this problem, could get away with just minimal tip weight. It's like some issues guys are having with 800s at lower elvation, tip weight is full and can't get rpms down so they have to start adding into the heel.

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I am having this issue with my 800 and i run mostly in the 500-1500 range. I have the MDS weights loaded all in the tip at 81g.

rocketball said:

I am having this issue with my 800 and i run mostly in the 500-1500 range. I have the MDS weights loaded all in the tip at 81g.

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What RPM are you getting? I'm usually around 500-1500 too.

i'm running at 1000 ft full tip weight and one light screw on heels with 44/40 and shift assist seems good till about 75 mph then the xp's reel me in fast 2011 m8 8000 till it hits the 40 ramp then 8200 could proabably take out the heel screw never tried. with the stock secondary could not get it below 8400 with belt slip

After tuning in two sets of MDS weights, I found very very little or subtle differences in where I put the weight. Ditto with the last 15 years of of moving the screws and rivets and nuts and allen set screws on lots of brands of weights. Cutting the wrong dog as they say. I got the rpm I wanted when I added weight, but tip or middle.............?

I think your going to find that Steve's weight profile and small secondary spring pressure adjustments are going to find you the smile you have been missing.

If you need more weight you could ask steve for a plate like what is used in the m1000, if it is to much just start grinding it down, that is if you have a way to weigh it so its right. You also may be able to add bigger washer and grind them to fit. Just make sure it doesn't make the bolt stick out to far to the side and hang up. Or Take out the allen head screw and put in a bolt, might add a tiny bit more.

Camo-toe said:

What RPM are you getting? I'm usually around 500-1500 too.

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I am still at 8150-8200...my sled has full SLP pipe so I would love to get down in the 8000-8050 range. What primary spring do u run? I am running a cat purple with Steves weights set at 81g. Secondary still stock with 46/40 helix, orange spring and shift assist. I am still having some belt slippage and Steve has recomended removing the 2 plastic black shims in the secondary to take a little pre load off the secondary. Maybe help the slippage in the primary and should drop the RPM some too.

i noticed on my 1000 when i took one black shim out it dropped 50-75 rpm.

Has anyone tried adding a lightweight aluminum bolt or rivet the inner holes on these MDS weights?

Camo-toe / WyoBoy1000

Thanks for the responses above but they lead me to ask a few more questions.

Camo...in my example above the M1000 need an additional 16grams of weight to be setup correctly and it was placed evenly across the body of the weight. Your opinion was that it would be almost impossible to load that amount of weight into the tip only and I would agree with you 100%. But...why not load the weight similar to an M8 setup and put say 6grams in the inner hole and the rest out at the tip? It can be done and it keeps a similar "loading" theory between the two different models of sleds. It also leads me to my last series of questions below for both you and Wyo.

(BTW: I like the 3 post verses 4 post comment...it would be interesting to see someone run that and post results).

Wyo...you make a very good point about the amount of torque the M1000 makes and I would agree with you that engine loves to be loaded down low and it can pull through it. Here is were I get a bit lost...directly from Steve I was told not to load the inner hole on my M8 setup because it would hurt my track speed and give me a poor back shift. On the M1000 the trackspeed issue I can see not being a problem because of the extra torque you mentioned but explain to me the poor back shift when both setups recommend using the exact same secondary (stock 36° helix and orange spring) and the same or very similar primary springs? Why hurt one and not the other? Not only that but looking on the MDS site the M1000 shows the biggest gain...now is that because the stock clutching sucks the worst on the M1000 or is the full body loading of the MDS weights on the M1000 the reason for the big gains?

Thanks for your time.

If you can find a way to load the tip then by all means give it a try, or run a softer finish spring and remove some weight from the middle. If your backshift sucks it may be a clutch issue. alignment, worn out etc.. Are you running a shift assist.