14 to 15

don't jump the gun.

We need to wait and see what the production sleds run like before that statement can be even close to being true.

What about the production 15's that the dealers already have?:face-icon-small-sho

That's what I was wondering. Cat is selling the 15 protos now. Does that mean I should have bought a proto since it might be better? Or could it be worse? Can cat sell a proto with different mapping that doesn't meet production epa guidelines?

After reading Jorlis post I'm wondering. I did go look at a 15 and clutching has the same stuff in it from 14s (springs, etc) with clutches built last year.

Suspension I expect to be carried over from the prototypes. After talking with Tom at toms snowmobile, the shocks on the 14's still use steel pistons in the front shocks which are 10 year old junk technology for fox, along with cheap valve stacking. The 15's use a better/more valve stacking... not sure about what pistons are inside the 15, hopefully aluminum.

I cannot see the current '15 proto sleds being considered as part of the '15 production. Maybe call them a '14-1/2.

I cannot see them being 100% identical to the 15 models.

I'd be interested in what's updatable from the skid ?

15 protos

"There is no question that the new 2015 will probably in small ways be a better sled as this chassis evolves into it's 4th season. However, it has been my humble experience over the past 40 years that these demo sleds that are being test ridden will not to be exactly what we will be riding as production sleds next year. I have seen this many times over the years. The demos have been finely tweaked and are always superior to the production models. I am sure we will see improvements but I do not think they will be as dramatic as we would all like to think. I hope they prove me wrong but this has been my experience with both Cat and Polaris. I am sure it holds true with the other manufactures as well. Sorry to dampen the spirit of this thread. Just trying to share my experience with many years of buying new sleds. I will also say that they just keep getting better and you will not go wrong by updating as your pocket book allows.
Cheers! "

I repost this as has been my experience. If Cat improves the shocks alone, It will be a hugh improvement and with other small tweaks the production models should be great. However, we will just have to wait and see. I think one would be able to do a 14 the same after we see what it is they actually do to improve the production sleds. If I owned a 14, I would not be in a panic to buy new though.

It's all hype, and new stickers. Buy a 14 and have Tom do the shocks. Most they could've done is fix the map to eliminate the bog if its possible.

new sales strategy

"If you like your 14 pro-climb, You can keep your 14 pro-climb"
Now that would be a good sales tool to use!

Ran into a dealer demoing a 15 153. Said it was similar to a 14 and he didn't have much else to say, so I didn't pry more. Now I'm ticked I didn't ask him to take it for a rip. If I had read Jorli's review before, I would have bagged if I had to. If there is that much of a difference, why isn't cat chatting it up? Considering what the other three put out, one would think they'd be all over anything they could. Also, would have demo'd one at West Yellowstone Expo, if more would have been said.

Jorlis primary improvement points were:

1. Suspension - it does sound like there have been significant improvements in the shocks, which has probably been over do. Ok, not a huge deal, easy enough to update; I can't wait to hear CO's report on Toms full setup, front and rear. I really like what I've heard so far.

2. Clutching - honestly I feel with the small tweaks I've made to my 14 it does what Jorli describes in his review. It's butter smooth, yet hits hard, no hiccups, holds consistent Rs. Last trip out I would not have been upset if the belt blow but it did not. Stock clutches with diff primary spring, and Kevin's (MMSports) modified stock weights and suggested secondary helix. Works awesome for me; keep in mind that is my opinion and someone else may not like it.

3. Mapping - if there is a change on the production sleds and not just something used to make the 15 demos look better, hopefully there will be an update. I hope it's changed for the better and will be an update if the sled Jorli rode is what goes into production.

4. Skid geometry change - not sure on this one, tunnel mounting locations look exactly the same so believe it will have to be something with arms and rails. Maybe the change in shocks is that good making it seem like there was a geometry change. Yamaha has clearly disclosed they have changed the geometry maybe Cat did as well. To be determined.

If 3 and 4 have indeed changed, hopefully this will be upgradeable on the 14s.

And there is the beefed up jackshaft.

If it's just hype at least it gives us something to talk about. It's been pretty boring in hear lately...fock.

But guess I've had time to catch-up with chatter in the other sections; wow is there a lot of entertaining hen clucking going on.......:face-icon-small-hap

I'd be looking for a non biased review before I jumped on the "15 is way better than the 14" bandwagon.

How was Jorli's review biased? He does not get free sleds from Cat. Hell I'm pretty sure he rides an XM...

CO 2.0 said:

How was Jorli's review biased? He does not get free sleds from Cat. Hell I'm pretty sure he rides an XM...

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If I see a dealer and a rider cross promoting themselves and there companies for monetary gain IMO it's a biased situation....

Well I hope the boys at International take that riding course cuz the only one that rides a sled is the mechanic. And he's from Ontario and rides an old Zert or T-Cat. Hopefully they start selling more than 3 sleds a year.

sled-fiend said:

I'd be looking for a non biased review before I jumped on the "15 is way better than the 14" bandwagon.

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I get demo sleds to use from International Motorsports, there hasn't been any monetary gain on my side, the promotion you are showing didn't fashion any results and was over long before I did this review. I also have an XM and really like the sled, this in contrast to the 2014 M8000 which I really wasn't overally fond of. The bog off the bottom scared the crap out me, there were a couple times it really didn't respond in very critical situations. The 2015 seems to be vastly improved, I feel confident in the power, the sled runs really well and sure seems to handle better than the 2014. I found the 2015 M8000 to be a very good snowmobile, especially when I compared it with the 2014 which I certainly felt like I was struggling on. I will be the first to say there is always room for improvement and I haven't had a chance to ride a 2015 Polaris or Ski Doo T3.

I'll likely continue to split my time between a 2015 M8000 and an XM next season as I really like the Cat for tech riding and the XM for edge to edge (descents). I feel that both snowmobiles work well for different applications. I felt that there were some sidehills I was able to pull off on the Cat that don't think the XM would have held, likewise there has been some lines I've done on the XM that I don't think I would have been comfortable doing on anything else. I'm getting a little old to play the sponsor game, there isn't much in the way of opportunities for upward mobility within the industry so I'm not too concerned, I just want to enjoy riding. The review I did was my overall impression of the sled, if you choose to question the interpretation, that is your choice.

I would imagine that those with 2014s could likely do many of the changes that are on the 2015 or even improve on it. If I was to rebuild a 2014, I would look into a fuel programer, different helix and clutch springs as well as different shocks- probably a multi-rate spring/oil/gas shock for all 4. Between that, could probably have a machine that works exceptionally well. The green tunnel on the 2014 is killer! JMTs

Reeb said:

Well I hope the boys at International take that riding course cuz the only one that rides a sled is the mechanic. And he's from Ontario and rides an old Zert or T-Cat. Hopefully they start selling more than 3 sleds a year.

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Zach the owner rides and he rips. I've been super impressed with his operation, he is a super nice guy that genuinely loves to ride.

Jorli thank you for the review. It was great insight and 10 folds better then anything cat did or said. I have no doubt there is improvements and hopefully it can be made on the 14s. I just wish I would have read your review sooner. Had two opportunities to ride one and primarily didn't because cat wasn't saying much. Again thanks for the feed back, great hearing positive reviews.

Chewy22 said:

Jorli thank you for the review. It was great insight and 10 folds better then anything cat did or said. I have no doubt there is improvements and hopefully it can be made on the 14s. I just wish I would have read your review sooner. Had two opportunities to ride one and primarily didn't because cat wasn't saying much. Again thanks for the feed back, great hearing positive reviews.

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Thanks, I should add that I've personally found that setting up the sled can make a huge difference in ride quality on the ACs. Even suspension adjustments seem to be more important on this sled than others because they ride fairly stiff. I would start playing around with the baseline settings and really experiment before spending any money on upgrades, there may be some cheap clutching mods that really help. I'm certainly no expert on the AC, perhaps others can offer advice that can better help.

Jorli said:

Zach the owner rides and he rips. I've been super impressed with his operation, he is a super nice guy that genuinely loves to ride.

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Yeah, believe me, I know Zach.