I have an 09 M8 pg turbo with 153. Sled is great and can hang, but is tiring when sidehilling a lot...especially compared to the new stuff. What set up are you guys running to make sidehilling easy? I have gone soft on the pressure for front shocks...but still tougher to hold on sides and initiate technical downhill to uphill turns.
M Series Sidehill Setup
- Thread starter jim
- Start date
M
Ditch the turbo! Add '19 G2 ProClimb7 or Polaris Gripper skis!
Sell that sled and buy a newer chassis??? I have spent some time recently switching back and forth between a '10 M8 153 and my '17 Mtn Cat 153. The handling is just night and day different. The 10 was a great sled in its day, the 17 is sooooo much easier to ride and my buddies Alpha is that much better than my MC.
There is only so much lipstick you can put on your pig, the best answer is stop stop wasting money on mods, money you can not recover, and invest that in a new sled. There is no set up that will get you to where the newer versions are.
There is only so much lipstick you can put on your pig, the best answer is stop stop wasting money on mods, money you can not recover, and invest that in a new sled. There is no set up that will get you to where the newer versions are.
I'll agree that there is only SO much you can do to the bath-tub chassis before you are peeing in the wind. I will say that the alt impact 36in front end was a huge help and definatly aided in the sleds sidehilling ability. if you are running powder pro skis I've heard the "carls cut" helps as well. BUT with all this being said my 18 does things I'd never even attempt on my heavily modded 10' M8, so just keep that in mind
Add up the cost of the following:
Gripper skis
Alt impact 36" front end
Coil rear track shock if you have the snopro float back there
Longer lug track that allows you to move along on a sidehill without having to punch it as much
Those all help. I had every one of them done on my 2010 and can vouch.
It's still going to be an m-series with a really low slung center of gravity though. Rad for steep climbing but you're still putting band aids on a low wide sled. Not saying it's not worth it but just laying out the ways to go about it so you can figure out if it's worth it or not.
Gripper skis
Alt impact 36" front end
Coil rear track shock if you have the snopro float back there
Longer lug track that allows you to move along on a sidehill without having to punch it as much
Those all help. I had every one of them done on my 2010 and can vouch.
It's still going to be an m-series with a really low slung center of gravity though. Rad for steep climbing but you're still putting band aids on a low wide sled. Not saying it's not worth it but just laying out the ways to go about it so you can figure out if it's worth it or not.
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Thanks guys. For me, I have young kids who I ski with on most days...so I'm only up there 2-3 days/year. New sled makes zero sense now. Turbo is staying (love that thing). And any big spends don't make sense for me.
So, with respect to putting as much lip stick on this pig as I can, what do you guys have for shock pressure settings up front? Rear skid? I do have PowerPros, which helps. Not the Carl's cut though...might hack them up for that. Thanks.
So, with respect to putting as much lip stick on this pig as I can, what do you guys have for shock pressure settings up front? Rear skid? I do have PowerPros, which helps. Not the Carl's cut though...might hack them up for that. Thanks.
If you've got powderpros, no real big need for the grippers. I still like the grippers better in deep stuff but the PPs with the cut are pretty darn good.
I'd say just get the alt impact arms and a coil rear shock and forget about it.
Trust me when I say this though: that rear air shock will never work with that sled. When AC designed those rear ends it was for a coil shock, which means the leverage ratio of the rear arm is somewhat progressive. Air shocks ramp up, especially those older float 1 and 2s. So you're always either getting half the travel or having to sag way too much. The floats are fine everywhere else but not on the rear end of an M-series. You can get the stock 2011 base model shocks for like 100 bucks. Sidehilling aside, that's the single best thing you can do for that sled.
I'd say just get the alt impact arms and a coil rear shock and forget about it.
Trust me when I say this though: that rear air shock will never work with that sled. When AC designed those rear ends it was for a coil shock, which means the leverage ratio of the rear arm is somewhat progressive. Air shocks ramp up, especially those older float 1 and 2s. So you're always either getting half the travel or having to sag way too much. The floats are fine everywhere else but not on the rear end of an M-series. You can get the stock 2011 base model shocks for like 100 bucks. Sidehilling aside, that's the single best thing you can do for that sled.
My 162 Pro-Lite full of fuel with it's big tank, and my friends lightweight M7 (800 big bore) 162 full of fuel weighed within 7lb of each other on the same scales on the same day. His just felt heavier and did not handle as easily as mine due to geometry and how the weight was carried.
I personally do not like running low pressures in the front shocks. Especially on the M-series. It may make the sled feel like it's rolling easier initially, but puts the front end too low to the ground once it's up on edge: makes it push through the snow, not absorb bumps well since there is not enough stroke left, and require more effort to make it change directions. Think about what it feels like to balance a full 55 gallon barrel on it's edge and move around.
On the M1000 it helped to drill the front arm mount 3/4" lower in the tunnel. Helped lift the heavy front end and feel lighter. Holes were already in the reinforcement bracket inside the tunnel. Just had to drill them through.
I personally do not like running low pressures in the front shocks. Especially on the M-series. It may make the sled feel like it's rolling easier initially, but puts the front end too low to the ground once it's up on edge: makes it push through the snow, not absorb bumps well since there is not enough stroke left, and require more effort to make it change directions. Think about what it feels like to balance a full 55 gallon barrel on it's edge and move around.
On the M1000 it helped to drill the front arm mount 3/4" lower in the tunnel. Helped lift the heavy front end and feel lighter. Holes were already in the reinforcement bracket inside the tunnel. Just had to drill them through.
M
I thought the m-float skid was designed to be a falling rate rear suspension compatible with a progressive rear air shock?? It was set-up with too much pre-load from the factory. It is hard to tune for a comfortable ride vs sag though. I still have one and its does not have the agility of my Mountain Cat but with the addition of HyGears rear link kit & re-valved Fox float 1's with a dual auxiliary chamber it is much improved. I agree it will always be a low center of gravity stable "non-technical sled", but as my back-up, paid for, solid low mileage sled, it's a keeper!
Kid woo
I don’t trust you at all when you say that.
I’ve got way too many kick ass miles with way too many friends to believe it even a little bit. Those sleds have tons of technical ability! They may take a bit more skill and a bit more effort, but by no means are they pigs or bathtubs.
To say so after the places most people have taken them over the years only reveals limitations in rider ability.
Not looking to insult anybody, just saying I’ve been there, done that with a lot of other guys, DOING what you and others in this thread say can’t be done.
OP,
That sled can rock without spending money. Tinker with it a few rides and experience will teach you to sidehill it. Biggest key is commit and give it throttle. Throttle lifts, keeps you on the line, hesitating drops you.
Nothing will help that sled sidehill more than good snow and practice.
Go Have Fun!!
I don’t trust you at all when you say that.
I’ve got way too many kick ass miles with way too many friends to believe it even a little bit. Those sleds have tons of technical ability! They may take a bit more skill and a bit more effort, but by no means are they pigs or bathtubs.
To say so after the places most people have taken them over the years only reveals limitations in rider ability.
Not looking to insult anybody, just saying I’ve been there, done that with a lot of other guys, DOING what you and others in this thread say can’t be done.
OP,
That sled can rock without spending money. Tinker with it a few rides and experience will teach you to sidehill it. Biggest key is commit and give it throttle. Throttle lifts, keeps you on the line, hesitating drops you.
Nothing will help that sled sidehill more than good snow and practice.
Go Have Fun!!
The dual auxiliary chamber is the key. That's the only thing I ever did with the float 1 (that I got revalved and regutted to a float 2) that made a real difference because it gets rid of that nasty ramp up in the shock. If you could find and evol shock the right length that would work too since it's essentially the same thing. Just run zero pressure in the evol chamber.
I don't remember what cat said about them at the time, I just know that I literally tried just about every kind of shock on mine, and it behaves like a progressive link. It's not like they used different skid parts between the coils and the float models. It's fine with a big air spring air shock but the easiest cheapest way is just to find a coil in my opinion. Certainly not the only way.
Agreed though as far as keepers. When I have friends that ask what's the best used sled to get for under 5k, I always recommend hunting one down.
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I don't think you're even understanding what I'm saying. You act like I claimed you just can't ride the things without a bunch of changes.
Read what I wrote again. Those were specific answers to a specific question. I rode the shlt out of mine for 5 years doing 90% of the things I do on a proclimb and axys now. There's a difference between capable and 'can still be improved'. Not everything is black and white. In fact there is about 10 years of threads here with tons of people saying the exact same things I just did. That's for a reason. Techy sidehilling was pretty much invented on an M-series. But it's also 2019 now and people have figured some things out a little better. It happens.
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Here is a situation I was in a few years ago that I think describes what others are saying about newer chassis vs older m-series
I was riding with three axis, a couple pro-climbs and a m7. I was on my 2010 m8
Rode all day in awesome powder and towards the end to get out of the area we were in we had to cross about 3 hundred yards of steep side hill on snow that had set up some as it warmed up
The axis and the pro-climbs went across without problem while myself and the m7 could not hold our lines. There was no out at the bottom (cliff)
The m7 and I stopped about mid way and a couple of the guys on the axis had to come back and help us get across
Myself and my riding buddy on the m7 are similar in riding abilities and while we aren’t as good as the guys on the axis we are on par with the pro-climb riders
I wish I would have had the 36” front end that I installed after that ride as I have no doubt I would have had no problem with it
I’m sure a better rider would have rode through that side hill with no problem but for the average joe the newer sleds are more sidehill friendly
I have a 2017 mountain cat now and sidehilling is a dream compared to the stock m-series, besides that rutted hills are smoothed out so much better with the new chassis
I was riding with three axis, a couple pro-climbs and a m7. I was on my 2010 m8
Rode all day in awesome powder and towards the end to get out of the area we were in we had to cross about 3 hundred yards of steep side hill on snow that had set up some as it warmed up
The axis and the pro-climbs went across without problem while myself and the m7 could not hold our lines. There was no out at the bottom (cliff)
The m7 and I stopped about mid way and a couple of the guys on the axis had to come back and help us get across
Myself and my riding buddy on the m7 are similar in riding abilities and while we aren’t as good as the guys on the axis we are on par with the pro-climb riders
I wish I would have had the 36” front end that I installed after that ride as I have no doubt I would have had no problem with it
I’m sure a better rider would have rode through that side hill with no problem but for the average joe the newer sleds are more sidehill friendly
I have a 2017 mountain cat now and sidehilling is a dream compared to the stock m-series, besides that rutted hills are smoothed out so much better with the new chassis
M
I still have great difficultly side-hilling on both my M8 & Mountain Cat on hard, set-up, crusty, off camber snow!! Maybe old & slow?
It's the weight distribution. If you get a chance pull the side panels off an axys and your mountain cat side by side. Look where the motor sits. Everything's lower so you're having to lift the motor a little to keep the front end up on a ski, especially the mag side because literally everything under the hood on a cat sits on the clutch side. Getting rid of the stock can for ballast makes it even worse.
But..........it's also why cats barrel through old tracks and chunder better than anything else without getting bounced around.
This is pretty much the max sidehill my M will sustain at a slower speed situation (notice the full-on panel with running board scrub marks, or panel-out as we call it nowadays). I measured this slope at 54 degrees. Betting the new stuff can do closer to 60 degrees? Regardless, appreciate the input. Some good advice.
I'll bet you took right off again and ripped right out to didn't ya.:face-icon-small-hap
