TRS clutching NA

Norway · Feb 5, 2018

TRS said:
The 125-175 may be to light for all snow conditions. I may have jumped the gun on this spring for all conditions.

With feedback from Sierra Cement type riders, it may be upshifting to quickly and hindering backshift. Testing is in order.
I apologize to those having issues.

Hopefully my “new short block” is in today and I can test. I’ve been riding the mule the last two weeks.

I say no need to apologize Tony.

This is not a product sold by you in any way, shape or form. I for one am fully aware of the fact that this is "nothing more" than your speculations on clutching products for a certain sled.

My purchases are done on my own risk, period. So please keep up the good work and you'll get there.
The rest of us will follow or not at our own discretion.

Sent fra min S60 via Tapatalk

Wheel House Motorsports · Feb 5, 2018

Tony,

Riding in cooke yesterday in that crazy heavy snow (felt heavier then average coastal snow) and was definitely having some issues with it over shifting even with the 140-200 sec spring. We had 2 axys's a G4 and a Cat and the 18 cat was the only sled holding consistant RPM all day.

TRS · Feb 6, 2018

Wheel House Motorsports said:
Tony,

Riding in cooke yesterday in that crazy heavy snow (felt heavier then average coastal snow) and was definitely having some issues with it over shifting even with the 140-200 sec spring. We had 2 axys's a G4 and a Cat and the 18 cat was the only sled holding consistant RPM all day.

Nick,
Are booth Indy Dan kits?

rx1tonofun · Feb 6, 2018

The Gates CF belt is a MUST! If any of you guys are trying to clutch with the stock Polaris belts you're wasting your time and only causing yourself unwanted frustration!

I finally ran one yesterday and it makes the clutching work.

dktraw · Feb 6, 2018

rx1tonofun said:
The Gates CF belt is a MUST! If any of you guys are trying to clutch with the stock Polaris belts you're wasting your time and only causing yourself unwanted frustration!

I finally ran one yesterday and it makes the clutching work.

No it doesnt.....we tried it on three different Axys sleds. Its not a belt issue.

Wheel House Motorsports · Feb 6, 2018

TRS said:
Nick,
Are booth Indy Dan kits?

Tony, My groups sleds were as follows

2018 axys 163x3 stock clutching - experienced strange inconsistent RPM fade not totally related to heat soak.
2018 G4 153 3" All stock - minor RPM fade, just insane clutch heat.
2018 SnoPro 153x3 - WOW, rock solid RPM and impressively cool clutchs for being WOT in the flats.

My sled is a 2018 axys 155 2.6 and although I was experiencing fade and rpm struggle in Cooke this weekend I put the stock clutching back in just as a baseline and rode yesterday back in bozeman, 1000 feet lower elevation and far less snow and I was getting even worse RPM drop then ever before, I can get it below 7000 RPM if I really dig it in on a steep sidehill. Sled is at the dealer.

Excited for the day I can get an axys that runs consistantly for 1000 miles. 850 right now and this thing would get whooped by a 600.

**EDIT** Just got a call back from dealer my TPS was way out of whack. Gonna take it for a quick night ride tonight and see if it works any better now.

rx1tonofun · Feb 6, 2018

dktraw said:
No it doesnt.....we tried it on three different Axys sleds. Its not a belt issue.

Here's why it works for me. I'm running a stage 3 SLP setup, I ride from 6200-8200 foot elevation. Before running this belt and trying different clutching it would slip the belt in the primary and cause it to have smeared brown marks and occasionally the black rubber marks from the belt. I've tried SLP's recommended setup and some stuff that TRS has been trying. I could never get a consistent run from the sled. As elevation changed it would increase rpm until it was too high in elevation and I'd see rpm drop. All along I'd have excessive belt heat from the Polaris belt slipping, especially at lower elevations.

When I did ride with the stock belt at lower elevations and it would only hit 8150 at wide open it would fall off so bad that a 600 would walk away from it. The clutches were smoking hot and the primary sheaves showed obvious signs of smearing the belt. It just never worked good.

Yesterday running the Gates belt it pulled really good. There wasn't any signs of smearing on the primary sheaves at lower elevations and the clutches were pretty cool compared to past runs. At lower elevations it would go into the soft over rev and drop rpm to 8150 at wide open but would still hold track speed. As I went up in elevation it pulled more rpm at wide open and would pull more track speed and pull 8300-8350 and it worked more like I expect it should.

I'm running magnum weights(4 sets and 1 lock) with the blue/pink spring the 54-38.25 cam with a shim and stock sec spring and PRO RMK quick drive pulleys. I will be going to the straight 40 cam, I think where I ride the load changes enough that a straight cam might work better.

dktraw · Feb 6, 2018

I also am running slp stage 3 at 6-8k ft. I do not have any belt slippage with my Carl's setup. Clutches clean, 8300rpm, high 47-48mph track speed avg. The 61g speedwerx weights do not have enough mass to even come close to holding the poo 183 belt, or the gates belt at lower elevations. They seem to be working well above 8k ft though. All three test sleds we ran (2 stock 16s and my stage 3 Axys, Peak rpm is terrible, lots of belt heat, and low track speed. Im trying a set of lightning weights tomorrow on my stage 3 setup.

rx1tonofun · Feb 6, 2018

I ran Carl's too. I had too much slippage at lower elevations for my liking. I like the SLP magnums for the adjustment aspect I can use them pretty much anywhere I ride.

nosman4 · Feb 6, 2018

rx1tonofun - The gates belt may work better but it does not fix the issues we are experiencing with the L weights. It is great to hear that it fixed your clutching, but by saying "it makes the clutching work" you are taking this thread off track. When I heard you say it makes the clutching work my first thought was "oh so this will make Tony's clutching work better". After you posted more information about your clutching, it turns out you aren't running any of the recommended clutching from this thread and it is very misleading for people who don't read the whole thread. I am not flaming you, just trying to keep this thread on track to find a fix for Tony's clutching recommendations at lower altitudes. I am one of the stock Axys' that dktraw was referring to and I am running a gates belt and it does not make the current setup work.
Ian

rx1tonofun · Feb 6, 2018

Not to be a jerk but good luck to you guys! You need a LOT more weight than those L's on an Axys with any horsepower at all. You'll probably end up with the M's or even the N's from speedwerx. They need the same heel cut as the L's though. Again, good luck fellas! Kevin.

dktraw · Feb 6, 2018

WOW! So we've said multiple times the Ls are to light for our elevation and yet for some reason you feel like you need to say good luck on making them work?? We are no longer trying at our elevation! Tony and others have them working above 8k ft. We are looking for other options now other than the L weights.
Thanks for the good luck wishes though!

nosman4 · Feb 6, 2018

And I suspect rx1tonofun is one of those that didn't read the whole thread..... Thanks for the help though....

Spaarky · Feb 6, 2018

Why don't you use lightning weights.... If your not going to use speedwerx

nosman4 · Feb 6, 2018

dktraw is trying some lightning weights tomorrow, but lightning weights are impossible to find. He is borrowing a set from Tony. We are trying to find something that is available to everyone and easy to find.
Ian

Norway · Feb 6, 2018

Engine map vs. riding conditions? Someone on here mentioned that Polaris struggled with mapping, making the engine "vary" of weather.. Supposedly why they went with a straight 40 helix?

Couple that with electronics messing things up for one person and not the other..
Could be people have vastly different engine output to start with. And new engine mounts gains someone 400rpm!?

Interesting to see that Polaris' chart for the Axys actually has the Gold spring, 100-275, listed for sealevel together with 70gr weights.
My -16 run 110-290 with 70gr Lightning weights and a 46-32F with 100-200 spring. Gunned it to 8150 right away on a field and quickly climbed to 8450.

dktraw: did you have a 44/34F helix?

dktraw · Feb 6, 2018

Norway, my original setup i tested with a 42-32, and a 42-34. Both angles was with a 125-175 spring. I was fighting a loosing battle though since i was slipping badly in primary with the speedwerx weights.
Also, im not running factory mapping. I have a bully dog tuner that is custom built fuel mapping completely, not just piggy backing on.
Im trying lightning weights now with a 46-34 helix and 140-200 spring

TRS · Feb 6, 2018

We had an epic snow day today. We received another 2’ on top of the unbelievable snow accumulation we had on Sunday.

I have the Hill Pumkin back with a new long block.(‘18 AXYS 163 3”) it is box stock other than clutching and gearing.

I ran my lightning setup today.
58.3g
Gold spring 100-275
40-32F
125-175 Red/Gray
Gates belt
19-41 gearing(reprogrammed ecu for 19-41)

Many of you asked what track speeds I am seeing. So I set my gauge to read mph and rpm. I’ll post them here and let you decide.

We rode 59.8 miles on a tank of fuel today in less 3 hrs. Not much rest time except when we were digging out.

The new engine was rode hard from the time we reached the play area(9600’-10,000’) till we were out of fuel. We rode the trees most of the day because it was snowing hard. This ground is not flat by any means.
Sled ran from 8300-8350 with spikes to 8400
Tracks speeds were from 37-45 mph. With short bursts maneuvering through the trees I would see instant 30-32 mph track speeds from near dead stops. With deep snow on the lake it would bounce between 51 and 52 mph at WOT.
I don’t know what your thoughts are but I had permagrin all day.
No, I did not stop to check belt temps, nor did I want to. I put a new 47C(.169” longer)Gates belt on it this morning and “I did not break it in correctly”. I rode it to the pin and it didn’t explode.

pj8556 · Feb 7, 2018

With these L weights how can I add more weight to the tip.? Currently I'm running the short bolt with 2 washers but I need to add more. The long bolt screws in about half of its length and stops, is it ok/recommended to leave to long bolt just hanging out like that? Why even include these long bolts in the adjustability kit if they are too long for the threaded hole they belong?

nosman4 · Feb 7, 2018

You can leave it hanging out as long as it's loctited, but the long bolt is less weight than the small bolt and 2 washers. You can try buying more washers and stack them, but I will save you the time and tell you it still likely won't work. The problem is in the heel of the weight and adding all that weight to the tip only slightly affects the heel and mid. These weights just don't grip the belt good enough to compensate for the strong upshift at lower elevations. I got up to 64g on a stock axys and it still didn't work at 6-8k feet. I am trying a 140-200 spring this weekend to see if that will slow the shift and allow these weights to work. Otherwise we will need something adjustable to work at lower elevations.

TRS clutching NA

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