Start shopping for a backup sled and best of luck.
2016 axys turbo or 18 mountain cat
- Thread starter iluv2fly
- Start date
Start shopping for a backup sled and best of luck.
Takes a LOT of sand to get your head buried that deep son. The Axys is the only brand on this site with a laundry list of problems, period end of story. There are tons of them with issues, just like the Pros and Dragons before that. The CFI motor is seriously flawed in its design. You can deny it and hope for the best but quality and durability wise, they are bottom of the barrel. I hope you get lucky but the facts have been stated. If you ride it hard in deep snow, it is going to wear out and break. Adding a turbo doesn't help. My 14 Pro took 12 dealer visits, to three different dealers in its first season. It was so bad Polaris bribed me with a $2000 incentive to buy an Axys. It blew up and fell apart before 1200 miles. My buddies turbo Assualt isn't much better but he keeps his head in the sand too LOL.
Too late anyway, you pulled the trigger. I just marvel at those who do not really look hard before dropping the cash, at least you didn't waste $15-20k building a new one.
What I know is that Polaris screwed me repeatedly. I hope you have better luck. That Cat would have been a MUCH better choice but some folks are prideful and need to learn the hard way. That is the path you have chosen...
Too late anyway, you pulled the trigger. I just marvel at those who do not really look hard before dropping the cash, at least you didn't waste $15-20k building a new one.
What I know is that Polaris screwed me repeatedly. I hope you have better luck. That Cat would have been a MUCH better choice but some folks are prideful and need to learn the hard way. That is the path you have chosen...
Wow, anyone that closed minded should stay out of this sport all together. All brands can disappoint and all brands can put on an ear to ear grin. Depends on your knowledge, luck, riding style and general outlook on life.
How was I closed minded? Did you READ my post? I owned three consecutive Polaris machines, only one of the three made it a full season without issues. Trying to deny the Polaris 800 has issues is just ignorant. When I casually scanned the classifieds on this site I found three nearly new Polaris sleds with new motors. I didn't see any near new Cats or Doo's being sold with factory replacement motors.
When they build junk it doesn't have anything to do with knowledge, luck or general outlook, just facts... The list of issues on the Axys is longer than the rest and the prevalence of them occurring is also much higher. The truth is out there if you are willing to honestly look.
I do agree with you some what. But i want to see a failure rate that takes into consideration all of snowmobiles ON THE SNOW. I see 6 to 1 Polaris to any other brand around here. Ski doo is second to that. I went a whole day on the mountain and parking lot last year and only seen one cat sled to at least 30 others. I was honestly surprised. I was die hard cat guy and bought a turbo pro and had the most fun I’ve ever had. It was the best year I’ve ever had on a sled. No real issues either.
I haven’t ever had to tow out a Polaris yet. But cat and skidoo..... I’ve pulled before. For the cats it was because 2 spare belts weren’t enough and once a chain case. Ski doo was also belt related. Hell. Even pulled a Yamaha out once.
So for me. Polaris Gave me something that cat or doo couldn’t do. Polaris gave me my fun back. And never had a issue.
For some reason people are so much more critical over their power sports purchases over pretty much any other purchase they make. They are brand loyal to ford or Chevy or dodge no matter what trash they produce. But when it comes to a Snow machine. That in these days are a race engine In a ultra light chassis performing at 10,000 ft at full throttle for most the day.
Just ride what gives you the most smiles.
No matter what there will always be a hater.
I was a hater once.
I ate/eat a lot of crow for that time in my life.
Polaris makes a damn good mountain sled, axys or pro. Ive never had so much fun on the snow until I bought one.
QUOTE " The Axys is the only brand on this site with a laundry list of problems, period end of story"
The truth is that the CFI started with a bad record but with continual improvements over the years it is now a decent, reliable motor. There is always other issues such as minor electrical gremlins but these too are being addressed in the 2019 builds. I have also had 6 Polaris CFI's since 2010 and I can't bitch about their reliability. I have seen so many issues with the G4 that it makes my AXYS look perfect. What it comes down to for me is if a known problem is something I can easily fix before it happens or not. There are guys who are clueless and walk right into problems but for anyone who does their research and does their maintenance I can't see any AXYS issues being a problem. When there are problems that are not easily fixed such as belt blowing, broken bulkheads etc, the fix may be overwhelming.
Well, what I have read about the G4 is a big reason not to consider one, even though the 4-5 I ride with have not had any problems. In my area it is mostly ski doo and even my completely maintenance ignorant buddies had great luck on XM's. I just do not like how they ride. I only know of one other regular Polaris rider besides myself, before I switched. His has had problems too. I listed the problems on mine. I consider common Axys problems to be premature primary clutch wear, exhaust valve cable, motor mounts, electrical gremlins like the tps issues, the mtn strap breaks if you use it. I see all of these over and over on the forum and experienced every one of them and a blown motor with low hours.
Since the original choice here was a Cat or a turbo Axys with miles, I think that would be a no brainer for me. I spent a lot of my riding time on a borrowed Cat, that still hasn't had any problems, while I owned Polaris sleds. I naturally bought a Cat when I figured they had caught up to Polaris in capability. With the drop and roll starting with the '17MC, narrower boards and the best motor and track in the industry, I found out quickly I could get the Cat into more places than I ever thought possible, and I agree the Axys is an amazingly capable machine.
It isn't like I haven't been around and on all of them. What I read and have experienced leads me to firmly believe the Polaris is substandard when it comes to durability and build quality. I am MUCH happier on the Cat that just doesn't seem to ever break. I bet I could run it for years where I consider the Polaris to be a one season pony, at best. I could not recommend one to anybody based on my experiences.
I've bought two new axys 800's, the first to 1500 miles, always maintained and never had any issues. I traded it for my 2nd, a 16' pro 155 2.6. I ran that 500 miles, put a silber kit on it and I wrecked it this spring taking it out of the trailer after a trip when my throttle cable stuck open with 1800 miles. It was always maintained and warmed up well. I had torn 2 lugs, and I wrecked multiple aftermarket a arms, had broken the fiberglass rear bumper, tweaked the back of the tunnel from an endo down the face of a mountain. In short I rode it hard as hell, beat the hell out of it actually, and couldn't have been happier. All the damage I did to it was my own fault, and I firmly believe any other sled would have been damaged as well. My last Cooke trip this winter, we had a brand new cat 163, and a brand new doo 165 in our group.( forgive me if that's not the right track length). Personally, I liked the cat better out of the two. It had very smooth clutch engagement and power delivery. It felt slightly easier to climb with than the doo but I didn't spend enough time on both to give a honest review. Both are great sleds, but anyone that tries to compare a newer model turbo'd sled to a stock one in performance is so biased it's comical. You will destroy any NA sled you meet, and if it's clutched right still maintain your stock rideability. You would have a great time with either sled, but be ready for a perma grin every time you fire up that turbo. Fyi, I snowchecked an 850 patriot and have a turbo snowchecked for it, but I would've had a hard time choosing what to do if I didn't already own polaris. I would love to ride a new cat and doo boosted, and I think a couple guys in our group might do that after riding the boosted polaris. Anyway, have fun, Just like every sled, do your proper maintenance and you shouldn't have many problems. Fyi, these forums are great for horror stories, because most people aren't commenting when their sleds are running great. Don't believe all the naysayers, there are a ton of axys 800's out there with great motors.
Sorry about the long winded response
Sorry about the long winded response
so you like the Polaris?
To provide a more informed response on the Polaris crank weak points, the bearings are generally undersized and the crank pins fatigue and fail.
These are both known issues from Polaris engineers and this is why they beefed up the bearing sizing and pin configuration on the new cranks. The bearing sizing allows more flex around the pins which puts more stress/cycle on them.
BTW, I have a Polaris and a Cat sitting in my garage. I have no skin in this game. Just trying to best inform you of something to keep an eye on.
That said, these motors are incredible across the board. Laying down 150HP from 800ccs for 5 minute plus pulls is nothing short of incredible. But they do have weak points...all of them. There are simply certain weak points to each sled you have to watch out for. Polaris has piston and crank longevity issues. The problems are fatigue based (cycles + load = fatigue life).
These are both known issues from Polaris engineers and this is why they beefed up the bearing sizing and pin configuration on the new cranks. The bearing sizing allows more flex around the pins which puts more stress/cycle on them.
BTW, I have a Polaris and a Cat sitting in my garage. I have no skin in this game. Just trying to best inform you of something to keep an eye on.
That said, these motors are incredible across the board. Laying down 150HP from 800ccs for 5 minute plus pulls is nothing short of incredible. But they do have weak points...all of them. There are simply certain weak points to each sled you have to watch out for. Polaris has piston and crank longevity issues. The problems are fatigue based (cycles + load = fatigue life).
I agree that Polaris has some weak points as all brands do but never see crank problems in our area. Eating reeds has been the most common problem for the 16+ motors. I understand that there is a fine line between beefy/reliable and light/vulnerable but all and all I believe the Polaris Engineers have done a good job walking that line.
Interesting about the observation in your group. Cant argue that these sleds are inherently reliable and I too have seen riders go forever with no issue. I have always wanted the cat motor with polaris clutching and yamaha drivetrain. Maybe they will join up! We live in a cool era...amazing power and reliability with light weight chassis. I honestly think that the new polaris motor is looking bullet proof. My crank buddy does too. If it all comes together we might see turbo motors go 5k miles without a hiccup. Mix in the efi which mixes perfect everyday, and we have some good rides ahead. Cool stuff. Good converstion gents...is nice to have a debate without anyone being aholes about it. Cheerz!
I am very familiar with the weak points of the Polaris motor. I love how people make the bold statement that they all have issues. Would you please list the engine issues with the Cat 800 that have caused a rash of failures? I don't think we can speak to the new motors, the two 850s and the new Cat motor yet but I have a lot of experience with the old Suzuki 800 and would be curious to see you back up the above statement.
Again, you can simply scan the classifieds and see lots of Polaris motors replaced. I do not see that on the Cat and Doo 800s. They last at least twice as long from what I can tell. That may be acceptable to some but not to me.
Cats that I rode with have had clutch spiders breaking and of course 2012 Cats had terrible belt issues. My statement was not directly aimed at motor failures alone. Yes the motors are strong but dump heaps of gas and oil into any 2 stroke and it will last. Many turbos outlast NA motors due to excessive fueling. The real feat is running them lean and see if they last. It appears the latest motors from Cat actually are lean and reliable too so that is good. Even the old 700 polaris I owned was super reliable and long lasting but it ran way rich compared to the new engines.
Suzuki 800: Pistons weren't the best, but were good to 1500 to 2000 miles. Power valve seat tended to deform over time and allow the valve to scrape the pistons. Motor prone to detonation that the det sensor didn't always catch. Stator failures.
Yeah, I don't have a lot of faith in any of the lean burn ideas for two strokes.
I am party to a fleet of four old cats and then my buddy and I each have a newer one. If you keep the clutch weights centered properly we haven't broken a spider in many years. The 16+ machines have solved that problem with team clutches. I did have a bunch of trouble with my Axys clutch though. Jammed open one ride, rebuilt once and replaced the second time, all under 1200 miles...
They still strike me as much better than the Pro's I owned. Jumping on a 2010 M8 and being able to feel the power difference right away over a much newer Polaris was always a clue for me. You did forget exploding diamond drives but those are a thing of the past now too.
I just ended up with a really bad taste in my mouth after a dozen dealer visits on my 14 poo and my exploding axys. I have just never had that much trouble with the Cats.
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Were you overheating them? I have never heard bad things about the zuk pistons, almost everybody considers them the best at top end time. Never have a PV deform as you describe on 8 different Cats. Never seen detonation on one either and as mentioned, I have been around quite a few. I did tow out a buddies Cat once, with a Polaris, when his stator wire broke.
Again, nothing compared to the failures on my Polaris sleds, and the lack of co-operation from PI.
I also do not think people only come to complain. I was a HUGE Polaris fan boy when I ran them. Ask Decker, I used to blow my horn for Polaris constantly. I just got to the point where the multiple major failures could not be ignored. I learned the hard way, that is for sure.
