P
how much we wanna bet there is a "revision" of the bulkhead/and or a-arms for next year. IMO a hit on the ski should not total the sled. early season blah blah blah still should not destroy the bulkhead.
Brace kits still needed :(
- Thread starter toyotamobbin
- Start date
Dang.....
Insurance!!!!
I'm sorry You smashed your sled Dude.
But I guess after my experience with the xp chassis i was really hoping to ride a skidoo again...... sigh....
Wait 10 more years I guess.
I got no time for that.......
M
Man I feel terrible for you, I bought a rzr and tagged a rock that was hiding under a bush at 15-20 KM/H and ripped the entire driver side front control arm right off. I did this at 5 hours on the machine on day 2 in the morning... I had to replace the entire frame (a chance to way over build it too) and a bunch of front end parts.
If you were anywhere close to me I would gladly bring a truck full of tools by to help you wrench on that thing if needed.
If you were anywhere close to me I would gladly bring a truck full of tools by to help you wrench on that thing if needed.
P
Last weekend brake in ride marginal snow and some guys could not help themselves pounded several meadows to the point where you could see dirt everywhere, the count is at 4 sleds towed from doo alone and several from other Manufacturers.
If you hit stuff hard enough the right (wrong) way stuff will brake if you want to wine about it stay on the trail.
I would not shoot of my mouth about weak anything unless I see a trend. The RX1 and Apex bulkheads were the toughest bulkheads ever made on any sled with A arms and I did see some of them cracked as well--Again see paragraph above.
Anyway this bulkhead will weld rather easy make sure you know a guy who is handy with a Tig welder if you decide too tempt Mr Murphy.
If you hit stuff hard enough the right (wrong) way stuff will brake if you want to wine about it stay on the trail.
I would not shoot of my mouth about weak anything unless I see a trend. The RX1 and Apex bulkheads were the toughest bulkheads ever made on any sled with A arms and I did see some of them cracked as well--Again see paragraph above.
Anyway this bulkhead will weld rather easy make sure you know a guy who is handy with a Tig welder if you decide too tempt Mr Murphy.
T
I'm not shooting my mouth off or blaming the manufacturer,I'm just showing what happened to me. This is snowmobiling stuff always breaks no matter what brand you ride. I Hit the rock right below the spindle it transfered all of the energy into the bulkhead, if I hit the rock with the very front of the ski or the very back of the ski I'm betting their would be less damage. :juggle:
Ouch!
Damn! Sorry about the damage. Not that it matters, but here are my thoughts. Looking at your pictures and especially the ski one. If you were sidehilling on that side and you hit the rock so hard that you went over the bars:
1. the rock must of been big
2. You may have maxed out suspension travel and the rest of the force transferred to suspension module and engine mod
3. You carbide may have caught on the rock, making this even worse. Carbides are known to catch rocks, especially brand new nice sharp ones
4. You probably needed a drink after you took the hood off.
5. It will buff out. My buddy was riding my XM last year hit a tree and he had to replace my s mod and e mod, plus some plastic. Good thing for insurance
B
The A arm needs to be the first thing to bend. I really don't understand why this is such a difficult concept for ski doo to understand. Take your new protype out and run it into a tree. If it gets messed up beyond the A arms go back to drawing board. Or im sure they have safer ways of testing, but why does the consumer/aftermarket have to be the one who has to figure out how to fix there sleds with brace kits. I looked at this new chassis at the snowshow and knew instantly it would be a disaster. And im a highschool dropout. How is it that a team of engineers cant build something that can bend a A arm before self distructing. I will admit when I was looking at it i was more concerned about the area where bulkhead and tunnel atach. I thought the new bulkhead was gona bend A arms cause it didn't have a Nun anymore. But instead they just made it more difficult to fix with a huge one peice cast bulkhead that i would imagine is gona be expensive to swap out. On my old rev race sleds i used to use high grade bolts to atach the Nun and heavily reinforced the area behind it to stop the damage from transferring back. With the bolts in the Nun and no rivets i was able to change Nuns over night. I never had a xp or xm but they had similar design using a cast peice instead of Nun, but same basic design so same method can apply. The new sled is probably glued and gona be a pain in but and very pricey to fix.
I was mistaken it doesn't look difficult to swap out but definitely not a go back to truck and swap A arms type deal. I just wish they had made it bend the A arms first and then the suspension module. I was hoping they where gona build something tough that could trickle to the Freeride in a few years. I really like the Freeride just wish ski doo would make it a bit tougher.
I was mistaken it doesn't look difficult to swap out but definitely not a go back to truck and swap A arms type deal. I just wish they had made it bend the A arms first and then the suspension module. I was hoping they where gona build something tough that could trickle to the Freeride in a few years. I really like the Freeride just wish ski doo would make it a bit tougher.
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my bad i thought this was a real discussion ,i guess you just can't help being a douche
C
Ive hit a rock with enough force to send me over the bars on my xp, it s-module and a arm bent it didnt break anything the the g4.
P
Preventative Mods
One thing I do religiously is to take a grinder to the tip and back end of any carbide and grind it as flat as possible so it cannot hook a rock. I have seen many frond ends bend by simply biting a frozen in rock. I also believe in larger 8" sly dog skis that are more flexible than stock ones when you hit something the ski will bend and lift over rocks and logs much easier. This is where the ground down Carbide comes in -- there needs to be a super smooth transition from plastic to runner and carbide so the under a hard impact load all that force can bounce and slide over the obstacle. It has worked for me for the last 10 years staring with the first Gen 10s fro Simmons on the Yamaha's.
One thing I do religiously is to take a grinder to the tip and back end of any carbide and grind it as flat as possible so it cannot hook a rock. I have seen many frond ends bend by simply biting a frozen in rock. I also believe in larger 8" sly dog skis that are more flexible than stock ones when you hit something the ski will bend and lift over rocks and logs much easier. This is where the ground down Carbide comes in -- there needs to be a super smooth transition from plastic to runner and carbide so the under a hard impact load all that force can bounce and slide over the obstacle. It has worked for me for the last 10 years staring with the first Gen 10s fro Simmons on the Yamaha's.
M
The A-arms didn't really take an irregular hit, the shock won out over the bulkhead during the hit. The force was transferred from the ski, to the spindle, to a tiny portion of one arm immediately beside the spindle, to the shock, and finally to the bulkhead. I'm thinking with where the rock hit the ski, the force was transferred to the arms in a way similar to what it was designed for (mostly upwards force).
For the A-arm to have bent there you would have needed bump stops that the arms hit before the shock hit full compression.
I can appreciate where you're coming from in regards to an engineered failure point but a hit directly under the spindle pushing upwards doesn't seem like it was exerting irregular force on those A-arms by comparison to the shock/bulkhead being hammered by the shock when it reached full compression. Speaking of which, I essentially think the shock bottoming out that hard acted like a hammer hitting it there. I really do think that even if this is a weak point in the g4 that other sleds with a similar impact have a very reasonable chance of suffering a similar fate.
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M
The arrow may be off slightly from where the rock impacted the ski but it was fairly close to right under the spindle. It looks like it basically shoved the ski violently upwards until it had no travel left to go so it essentially acted like a hammer.
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T
The arrow may be off slightly from where the rock impacted the ski but it was fairly close to right under the spindle. It looks like it basically shoved the ski violently upwards until it had no travel left to go so it essentially acted like a hammer.
Correct, along with all the forward momentum that came to an abrupt stop.
P
The arrow may be off slightly from where the rock impacted the ski but it was fairly close to right under the spindle. It looks like it basically shoved the ski violently upwards until it had no travel left to go so it essentially acted like a hammer.
if your theory was correct one would think it would have broken the top of the shock mount. it did not break there, it broke around the upper a-arm mount. its possible that shock binding pulled the a-arm out i suppose
M
It broke in several places including between the upper arm mount and the shock mount from what I could tell
It does actually look like someone struck that part of the machine with a hammer
Edit: I don't personally expect that the shock mount would have failed from this particular type of hit
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M
A sudden stop and stopping even a couple feet later are very very different things. I can't actually imagine you came to a dead stop with this little damage IMHO
T
I was thrown from the sled and it traveled about 5 more feet forward then rolled twice before I was able to grab it. When it rolled it only contacted snow no rocks. I consider that an abrupt stop since I got thrown not a dead stop, that would have been even worse.
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I also do this. I broke a s mod but hooking a log with the carbide. The hit was so soft that I didn't even notice it til we were 2-3 miles down the trail.
M
That seems like a reasonable way to define "abrupt stop", I get that.
Thank you very much for sharing all of this information, I'm sure that there are several people on here that appreciate it as well. I'm super glad that you're physically okay and I hope they get you back out there ASAP!
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