THE NEW M.............

winter brew said:

Does anyone know if this Team secondary uses the TSS04 Helix's? Or is it all proprietary parts? It looks a little different and I keep seeing pictures of the outer half being separate from the inner.
I like the huge bushing area on the new primary flyweights!! Finally!

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Should know all the details in a couple days. It is a fixed to the shaft secondary like Ski-Doo. I should have some information on helix and springs interchange with current parts that are available.

The primary and secondary are both completely serviceable units and spare parts will be available.

Silverado19 said:

Wait till you ride this sled....the new front end and the new skid frame make it a whole new sled.

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That is what I keep telling people. Everybody thinks that there have been minor changes from 12 to 16, but much like the M chassis sleds, from 2005 to 2009 was a completely different animal.....but it looked exactly the same.

Just the front end, or just the rear skid would make it much better. Combine the shocks, the front end, the skid, and the clutching changes and it's gonna be awesome!

kind of disappointed in the fix to shaft secondary, should have floated it.

Slednoggin23 said:

I thought mountain riders were men not weak boys.... If you can't handle an extra 50 pounds on a sled you should stick to riding trails.

I watched early twenties woman take a stock Yamaha Viper up and over the hill at the Afton hill climb this past weekend. Not once but she rode it over several times all weekend long. On a hill that is very steep with little snow, rocks, stumps and off cambers the whole way. Not many men were calling it a heavy POS that day.

Now I know Riding a sled up a course that only takes a minute or so is different than riding one all day in the the mountains. But after a while you'll gain muscle and wont even notice the extra weight.

I think what Cat has done for 2016 is the most they've done since 2012. I like what they've done. I'll take weight and strength over light and weak all the time. Has any one ever weighed a super light weight Poo Pro after they add tunnel strengtheners, skid supports and what ever else they add for strength?

But I guess if you're the type that goes to the parts store and has them change your car battery because it weighs more than 50 pounds. Or you have your wife bring in arm loads of wood because its heavier than 50 pounds. Or calls OSHA because you think square hay bales are too heavy and want them changed then a light Polaris is your only option for a light sled.

Rant over but I don't see what all the fuss over fifty pounds is. Does it get you any further up the hill? Do you really feel it when their stuck? Is the track speed faster by 10 MPH? Can someone on a 400 pound sled go over every hill, never get stuck, ride the fastest sled? I don't think they do. It just gets under my saddle blanket when I hear or see grown men complain about 50 pounds like it is 1000 pounds.

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think you bumped your noggin..

Slednoggin23 said:

I thought mountain riders were men not weak boys.... If you can't handle an extra 50 pounds on a sled you should stick to riding trails.



I watched early twenties woman take a stock Yamaha Viper up and over the hill at the Afton hill climb this past weekend. Not once but she rode it over several times all weekend long. On a hill that is very steep with little snow, rocks, stumps and off cambers the whole way. Not many men were calling it a heavy POS that day.



Now I know Riding a sled up a course that only takes a minute or so is different than riding one all day in the the mountains. But after a while you'll gain muscle and wont even notice the extra weight.



I think what Cat has done for 2016 is the most they've done since 2012. I like what they've done. I'll take weight and strength over light and weak all the time. Has any one ever weighed a super light weight Poo Pro after they add tunnel strengtheners, skid supports and what ever else they add for strength?



But I guess if you're the type that goes to the parts store and has them change your car battery because it weighs more than 50 pounds. Or you have your wife bring in arm loads of wood because its heavier than 50 pounds. Or calls OSHA because you think square hay bales are too heavy and want them changed then a light Polaris is your only option for a light sled.



Rant over but I don't see what all the fuss over fifty pounds is. Does it get you any further up the hill? Do you really feel it when their stuck? Is the track speed faster by 10 MPH? Can someone on a 400 pound sled go over every hill, never get stuck, ride the fastest sled? I don't think they do. It just gets under my saddle blanket when I hear or see grown men complain about 50 pounds like it is 1000 pounds.

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DITCHBANGER said:

think you bumped your noggin..

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Slednoggin is right on the money.

Polaris riders only defense is weight this weight that, short little Rasmussen/Burandt wannabes with low fixed handle bars that scream for help when they get stuck.
I don't get to ride in the epic powder like in the movies, I hit rocks & stumps under the snow that would fold a pro(yes I have folded a pro). I will take strength any day over a sled that you better have insurance on because it's paper tunnels are pricy to replace. Cats can take a hit and keep going.

You rarely see used cats for sale with the words "fresh top end." Just saying if you have ever seen any used poo or doo add ever..........ever.

Let's not forget that it's really not 50 lbs either. Its more like 43. And one you do a can and headlight (which it seems like everyone does) its more like a 20 lb difference.

kiliki said:

kind of disappointed in the fix to shaft secondary, should have floated it.

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They don't have the secondary floated? That sucks.

polarisfornow said:

Let's not forget that it's really not 50 lbs either. Its more like 43. And one you do a can and headlight (which it seems like everyone does) its more like a 20 lb difference.

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If you compare 3" track sleds, the weight difference is even less. If Cat lost weight, I really wish they would advertise that. Poo is a master at marketing and catch phrases. One nice thing, losing 30 lbs on a Cat is simple and easy. You can lose 20 just by putting on a can.

BLITZKRIEG said:

Slednoggin is right on the money.

Polaris riders only defense is weight this weight that, short little Rasmussen/Burandt wannabes with low fixed handle bars that scream for help when they get stuck.
I don't get to ride in the epic powder like in the movies, I hit rocks & stumps under the snow that would fold a pro(yes I have folded a pro). I will take strength any day over a sled that you better have insurance on because it's paper tunnels are pricy to replace. Cats can take a hit and keep going.

You rarely see used cats for sale with the words "fresh top end." Just saying if you have ever seen any used poo or doo add ever..........ever.

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The weight of the poo has nothing to do with it's reliability.


It gets so old hearing the doo & cat apologists talk about how great it is having a stupidly heavy sled. There's NO REASON for it. At least on cat's side you can legitimately say it's the strongest sled, when i hear doo guys say this I just laugh at the junk front end of the XM.

The poo issues are electronics, motor, and a tunnel issue that is easily braced. The rear bumper is a laugh, but between that & the tunnel, you're not talking about much weight difference. The front end is strong, which is where the real difference lies between the sleds.

Btw... with Poos you don't see "new top end" (which means you maintain your sled & spent $300) you see NEW MOTOR which means you spend $3800!!

Stop apologizing for mediocrity... make them innovate. That's the ONE thing we can say for poo, at least they're truly trying, and if the new poo motor is anything but poo, we're all in trouble. :face-icon-small-win


btw... you guys know you can do cans & headlight deletes on the poo too, right?

You're right, I really wish Cat would push the weight envelope. Doesn't seem to be a top priority with them. If they would get to within 20 lbs of a Poo, I think they could increase market share substantially. You can do mods to the poo for lightweight, it just won't net you as significant of a weight loss. If weight is the only concern, then I guess you would need to buy Poo.

Bacon said:

You're right, I really wish Cat would push the weight envelope. Doesn't seem to be a top priority with them. If they would get to within 20 lbs of a Poo, I think they could increase market share substantially. You can do mods to the poo for lightweight, it just won't net you as significant of a weight loss. If weight is the only concern, then I guess you would need to buy Poo.

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Agreed... IMO cat is the closest to the total package, but it just costs so much to lose weight. I've been riding 400ish lb sleds for so long now I can't go back, and I'm kinda getting tired of spending the $$ losing that weight.

My main point is that IF (BIIIIG IF) poo finally has learned to build a motor, (IE, having caught up with cat from 10 years ago) cat & doo will now be so far behind because of a lack of prioritization that IMO they'll have a hard time catching up. Obviously the brand loyal will never leave, but many of us are willing to just ride whatever works for us.

I tried doo for a few years, great sled, after $3000 it's strong with good failure points, and a little lighter than a poo. It did great, but I'm kinda bored with it, and I've noticed a decrease in my steeper right sidehills for some reason (could be I'm getting old!) so I'm ready to move on again. If I could NOT spend that $$, and have a sled that's fun... man, that's hard to resist.

Problem with poo is that even if the motor is good, an 858 in that sled is a JOKE compared to a 900/925/940 in the cat, and I trust the cat.

It's fun having 3 legit choices though, I'm enjoying the fact that none of them have any ONE thing that makes me say "no F'in way".

backcountryislife said:

Agreed... IMO cat is the closest to the total package, but it just costs so much to lose weight. I've been riding 400ish lb sleds for so long now I can't go back, and I'm kinda getting tired of spending the $$ losing that weight.

My main point is that IF (BIIIIG IF) poo finally has learned to build a motor, (IE, having caught up with cat from 10 years ago) cat & doo will now be so far behind because of a lack of prioritization that IMO they'll have a hard time catching up. Obviously the brand loyal will never leave, but many of us are willing to just ride whatever works for us.

I tried doo for a few years, great sled, after $3000 it's strong with good failure points, and a little lighter than a poo. It did great, but I'm kinda bored with it, and I've noticed a decrease in my steeper right sidehills for some reason (could be I'm getting old!) so I'm ready to move on again. If I could NOT spend that $$, and have a sled that's fun... man, that's hard to resist.

Problem with poo is that even if the motor is good, an 858 in that sled is a JOKE compared to a 900/925/940 in the cat, and I trust the cat.

It's fun having 3 legit choices though, I'm enjoying the fact that none of them have any ONE thing that makes me say "no F'in way".

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im with this guy. preference on what you like. i ride cat. love it. wouldnt trade it for nothing. the pro climbs good. just different riding styles i think. plus if they were all the same it would be dumb. my .02

I think at this point we are asking cat to make this sled in the 430's dry from the factory... I know you can do headlights and cans on the doo and poo... but you get MUCH more bang for your buck from the cat in these two areas.. hell just a BDX style intake and can on the cat is 25ish pounds depending on which can. We are still 20 pounds away from this... I HAVE the side panels, running boards and everything else I can suck in on mine done and it just needs to be 2-3inches narrower IMO.

I also spend all of my rides with nothing but Poos... I've ridden 11-14 Pro's (and these are full days on these sleds), as well as XP's and XM's... I can say without a hesitation in my mind that they are all capable sleds no doubt, but the one I see riders continually be the most successful on in the trees are the Pro's. I can do anything they do and more with my sled and my ability, but mine is VERY far from stock... and my buddies would admit that in a heart beat.

Hoping the front end and rear skid changes make this a different sled in the trees... it still doesn't quite side-hill like a pro and it FOR SURE doesn't pop on the snow with the same authority. The pop of the pro is a HUGE advantage for that chassis... and I know the cat chassis is strong, but I think Bret put it the best a few years ago... when you take weight off the sled, each part can be lighter as there is less stress being transferred to that part.

We have all seen that Cat looks at and listens to this forum... he!! they mention it in the new intro ads for the sled... but we've got to figure a way out of pushing these changes into the production sleds quicker, that is a HUGE reason they are loosing market share as quickly as they are. Take a look around the lot, dudes are riding Pro's cause they work and their reliability has substantially increased in the past 3 years. The new front end and skid and clutches SHOULDN'T have taken 5+ years to make it to the sled.

Said it before and say it again... gotta cut weight, it is flat out amazing what these sleds will do these days in basically stock form, but they've GOT to push the envelope to get some riders back on green sleds.

--What are the advantages of having the jackshaft mated to the secondary clutch sheeve as opposed to having a floating secondary???

Slightly lighter, and I imagine less stress concentration on the shaft from not having it neck down there for the clutch mount.

lundracing said:

One thing I love about my 14 is the adjustable post. Wish they could have just improved on the current design


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Tele post has been redesigned with tighter tolerences. Part # 6639-994 $249.95

They had a High Country at the show with the new tele and it was talked about in the mountain seminar that it had been redesigned with less play.

Currently shows no availability date on Cat Tracker, but if you want one, give me a call for a better price than retail, if its on back order they will ship as soon as available.

Wayne
Dakota Cat
Valley City

The cat clutching and belt problems was the main reason I switched to the new Viper.
Glad to see the team clutch,but its not proven on the cat. Give it a season.
It's my opinion that cat has had crappy clutching since the diamond drive.
We all have boxes of old clutch parts cam arms,helixes etc.
Do like the 2016 M's But love the new viper. (ya I know the viper comes out of the cat factory, but the yamaha engine and CLUTCHES are awesome! )
I wonder why cat didn't use the yamaha clutches. They are trading chassis and engines why not the clutching?

Tar

wow, a great amount of small steps. Love it! They look killer too! Props to all three/four mfgs. Can't go wrong across the board in 2016. How awesome is that!?

My only beef left with Cat is the dealer support is absolute garbage. The mothership seems to give zero #$#%s about their dealers, and as such western WA has next to nothing for dealer support. I ain't driving 2 hours out of my way to pickup parts or get warranty work done in traffic. The product is getting better and better, but their service as a mfg is terrible.

And to all you "weight doesn't matter much". BAH ha ha. why do everyone spend money on lightweight parts if it doesn't matter?! Trust me IT DOES. I was a Cat guy for 10 years before i tried Doo, and then Poo. I would buy another Poo in heart beat, and probably a Doo too. But the lightweight Poo is a game changer, so is the handling in the deep techy riding when it weighs less. I've never had more fun on a sled period. Now, Poo needs to step the quality up as they wear out too fast, perhaps the Axys addressed that?

Point is this: Don't talk crap until you've ridden them all. They are all amazing these days. Cat just needs to give their dealers some love and drop some lbs. Other than that, BOMB! Love that green Limited. So sick! It might push back to Cat if i wasn't in love with my Timbersled! Oh yeah, and if we had snow in WA.

Speaking of weight, how much is going to be stuck to those non-powder coated rails?

I just spent two years being indoctrinated by AC videos convincing me how clean powder coated aluminum stays.

Are they taking a lesson from polaris with the mindset now of "why bother, people are gonna buy this shlt anyway"?

kidwoo said:

Speaking of weight, how much is going to be stuck to those non-powder coated rails?

I just spent two years being indoctrinated by AC videos convincing me how clean powder coated aluminum stays.

Are they taking a lesson from polaris with the mindset now of "why bother, people are gonna buy this shlt anyway"?

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Which model you looking at? I see white rails which I assume are powder coated on most of the models.