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Skidoo G4 rtr weights vs axys

rulonjj

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Just some figures I threw together here. They may not be 100% accurate but they are close.



Axys 155

Dw. 408

11.5 gallons fuel 71 lbs
2 gallons coolant 14 lbs
1 gallon oil. 7 lbs.


Total 500


Skidoo G4 154

Dw 434

9.5 gallons of fuel. 59 lbs
1.5 gallons coolant. 11 lbs
1 gallon oil. 7 lbs


511 lbs ready to ride.

11 lbs difference. Wow. Not so much difference any more.


Let's look at a 163x3 axys vs a 165x3 G4.


Axys dw 426
Add the 92 lbs of fluids
518 lbs

G4 dw. 441
Add 77 lbs of fluids.
518 lbs.

��
 
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winter brew

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It is VERY easy to drop 35 lbs off the front of a XM...I imagine the number for the same changes on the Gen4 will be a little less, but not much. I know -30lbs will be easy.
 

Ace Freely

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The belly aching regarding the fuel differances will be a hot topic this fall. 8 personally don't leave the sno park without my sled fuel of fuel, and never more than 3/4 full of oil.

Ace
 

rulonjj

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The belly aching regarding the fuel differances will be a hot topic this fall. 8 personally don't leave the sno park without my sled fuel of fuel, and never more than 3/4 full of oil.

Ace

I have run my Xm out of fuel before and couldn't fit more than 9 gallons in my tank anyway. So it was just extra weight to have a 10+ gallon tank anyway. I was the last sled to run out between 2 cats and 2 pros I was with.
 
H

hoov165x

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I have run my Xm out of fuel before and couldn't fit more than 9 gallons in my tank anyway. So it was just extra weight to have a 10+ gallon tank anyway. I was the last sled to run out between 2 cats and 2 pros I was with.

But what if the new tank won't take all the fuel like the old ones? What are we going to have for usable fuel? 8 gallons? LOL!
 

G-Force

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The belly aching regarding the fuel differances will be a hot topic this fall. 8 personally don't leave the sno park without my sled fuel of fuel, and never more than 3/4 full of oil.

Ace

So if the new XM/rev only held 4 gallons of fuel like a race sled, would you Doo guys be crowing about the RTR weight being so awesome? OR bellyaching about the lack of range etc?
The only way to make it fair is equal amounts of liquid, or use DRY weight. Don't penalize or reward a particular sled because it has a smaller capacity gas tank (Doo), or a larger capacity coolant system (Poo).

Sorry, didn't mean to bring logic into the equation :face-icon-small-win:face-icon-small-con
 
B

burnz

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So if the new XM/rev only held 4 gallons of fuel like a race sled, would you Doo guys be crowing about the RTR weight being so awesome? OR bellyaching about the lack of range etc?
The only way to make it fair is equal amounts of liquid, or use DRY weight. Don't penalize or reward a particular sled because it has a smaller capacity gas tank (Doo), or a larger capacity coolant system (Poo).

Sorry, didn't mean to bring logic into the equation :face-icon-small-win:face-icon-small-con

so subtract 12 pounds from his axys figures and its equal big deal his point is still proven just the same. nice try bud
 

KingCon

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Wow, I guess a new Doo with a 2 gallon tank would be lighter than a Polaris! LOL. This is what sucks about forums, nobody can admit that "Their Brand" is wrong. Did Doo make some big strides? Heck Yes! Are they as light as a Polaris Axys? Not Even. If you are going to compare apples to apples then make sure they have equivalent tank sizes.

I guess the new LinQ system with the stackable fuel cans is for the extra gas Doo guys will have to pack to get back to the truck.

I really like the new Doo, and might even buy one, but this reasoning people are using is nuts! Why didn't Doo just fix their problem with the original tanks and leave it the same size?
 

Mafesto

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The only way to make it fair is equal amounts of liquid, or use DRY weight. Don't penalize or reward a particular sled because it has a smaller capacity gas tank (Doo), or a larger capacity coolant system (Poo).

Sorry, didn't mean to bring logic into the equation :face-icon-small-win:face-icon-small-con

To debate that point,
If the Doo & Poo can be ridden equally and have an equal range, the it would actually be silly to put a larger tank on the Doo.
Who cares how large the tank is? The very real world criteria is range not capacity.
This would be a very interesting test to see the results of.


Let's face it, if one of the manufacturers had a 15 gallon tank, it would be penalized by rtr comparisons and many of the sheep eat it up.
 
F
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In less than a month we will see both the poo and new doo on a scale full of everything ready to ride.. That easy

Remember now the power difference.. Their should be a modest 20 hp gain for the doo and over 200sq inches of track more on the snow for doo..:eyebrows:
 

rulonjj

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All you diehard poo guys are sure kicking up a fuss. Makes me wonder if y'all are concerned. Lol. I mostly did this as a comparison. I ride a poo as well so I know all about weights and I also know that the etec is more efficient so it can do with the smaller tank. It's just a different way of saving weight. I personally have never gotten more than 9 gallons into my etec anyway so I doubt we will even notice that the tank is smaller. With that being said I'm curious to see how hard it will be to get this new Doo to 400 lbs dry. Not that dry weight matter much to me but just to push the limit. Should make a pretty good rtr weight.
 

PaulAnd

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Dont forget the entire tunnel will be filled with coolant..
So that means zero snow/ice build up.
Not sure how much more coolant it will take.
Hope it doesnt leak..
 
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bmiller

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Are you guys telling me that you don't know how to burp the tank? This has been known since 2008 you can burp it and get 1.5 gal. More fuel! Ski doo has better mpg and hp! That does count for something in apples to oranges.
 

Chadx

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For my purposes and skill level, weight (especially when talking about 20 or 30 pounds) is lower on the priority list for me personally than things such as reliability, price, functionality, etc. If all the other features are equal, then yes, i do start to compare weigh.

...but comparing dry weights make zero sense because you don't ride them that way so dry is not a real world comparison; it's a bench racing, paper-only comparison. Yes the manufactures can and do play games with wet and dry weights. But, just like on an adventure motorcycle, the gas/weight arguement should be based and measured solely on range. If two bikes or sleds have a range of x and one can do it with 10% or 20% less fuel, then the manufacturer (or aftermarket) has the option of putting the same size tank and getting more range or a smaller tank to get the same range. If a smaller tank, then yes, the reduced weight due to reduced fuel needed is a very real thing in the real world riding.

No less real than reducing weight with aftermarket parts. Note that the fuel weight difference goes away as the day draws to and end, but early in the day, the weight difference is there. And, for a long day, if the owners pack an extra can with 3 gallons, the more efficient sled will go a lot further on the same 3 gallons, which is also valuable.

We won't be able to compare range/gas mileage between the axys and 850etec until they are on the snow together on the same day, so we will not be able to answer that question until then.

If it turns out that one brand sled can have less fuel and less oil on board because of efficiency gains, that, to me, is valid and valuable because it gives the option of carrying less weight on a ride.

Just as valid is the weight of snow that a sled holds. Tougher to measure, though some manufactures have tried, but also very inconsistent from snow condition to snow condition. But if a manufacturer of any brand takes steps to reduce snow weight accumulation, that is valuable in the real world because a sled sitting in a show room is irrelevant to the same one at the bottom of a gulch about to sidehill through the trees.
 
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Trashy

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My thoughts on the whole fuel tank size discussion...

If you were to get a larger sample size (such as to poll 1000 etec owners that ride mountain sleds) you would see that it is a stunningly small percentage that ever use up their full tank of fuel in one day of riding. Those riders have the option to carry a Jerry can holding another 12 liters. Gotta love the LinQ system...!

I think the .1% group is making a mountain out of a mole hill on this topic.

I am very pleased about the new (reduced) fuel capacity. Most days I only use 25 liters or so (the XP/XM tank holds 40). I am weight conscious, and carrying around 10+ extra liters is substantial. I think people have already forgotten and overlook the amazing fuel efficiency of the Etec engine. Direct injection comes at a cost (extra weight and complexity) but there is no going back. Period. End of story.

Which leads us to the next point: oil capacity. I find it amusing that the new sled still holds a gallon of oil. Once broken in (and especially considering the advertised gains in oil efficiency for the 2017 of 40%) that might be a month's worth of oil for some people. I never have filled my oil tank on my 2011-16 Etecs past half, it's completely pointless. At least the tank is clear, so you always know exactly what you have got.

Another tidbit on the whole "burping the tank" conundrum...
Fuel tanks, by design (maybe this should read PROPER design) should not be filled past 90ish percent capacity in order to allow for expansion (all hydrocarbon fuels expand with an increase in liquid temperature). This is why the tank in your car, truck, big rig, airplane, boat, etc has the filler port lower than the top of the tank. If you were to fill your sled full (burped) with cold fuel and then park it in a warm garage or heated trailer, it WILL expand and it WILL be forced out the vent. I know a portion of you will know this, but for general knowledge (and obvious safety reasons) this is information worth sharing.
 

10003514

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Just some figures I threw together here. They may not be 100% accurate but they are close.



Axys 155

Dw. 408

11.5 gallons fuel 71 lbs
2 gallons coolant 14 lbs
1 gallon oil. 7 lbs.


Total 500


Skidoo G4 154

Dw 434

9.5 gallons of fuel. 59 lbs
1.5 gallons coolant. 11 lbs
1 gallon oil. 7 lbs


511 lbs ready to ride.

11 lbs difference. Wow. Not so much difference any more.


Let's look at a 163x3 axys vs a 165x3 G4.


Axys dw 426
Add the 92 lbs of fluids
518 lbs

G4 dw. 441
Add 77 lbs of fluids.
518 lbs.

��

163x3 Axys RTR is 532lbs, was only 19lbs lighter than a 174x3 XM. RTR the Gen4 165x3 is lighter than an Axys.
 
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