Beta 478 Honda 450 KTM 300 and Camso DTS 129

Three Camso DTS 129 kits. I love the kits. Easy to install, durable, reliable, incredible in all the conditions we got to ride in last year, from powder, shallow powder, deep powder, mashed potatoes, peanut butter, even soft hardpack or frozen hardpack, the Camso kit worked well in all conditions.

The Honda 2008 CRF 450X is now running perfectly. Between having had the carb professionally cleaned, all the seals and rubber in the carb replaced, the cleaner/rebuilder, Keihin-FCR.com, and returned the carb clean and ready to go.

I put the Blue JD Jet Kit needle, a 165 main jet, a R&D adjustable flex jet turned 1 1/8 out and the bike is now running awesome with the Yoshimura full exhaust system and the stock foam air filter in the airbox.


My 2017 Beta 500 RR-S is a gem. I put a Rekluse Radius CX in this past April and the bike only has 3,200 miles and about 185 hours right now and between the well made 478cc Four Stroke motor along with the Continental Fuel Injection and an otherwise stock motor, it all works so well with the Camso DTS 129 kit. Oh yeah, I do have a PST engine jacket otherwise, the DTS 129 kit has also been awesome on this bike. It is a twist and go, point and shoot machine that just goes, and goes, and goes.



I just finished the 2008 KTM 300 XC-W and the 2019 Camso DTS 129 kit.

I installed the Smartcarb that PST-Power Sports Tech, and Brad from PST hooked-me-up.

Thank you Brad and thank you all on here for ALL the help you have ever given me for snowbiking as riding these things is just crazy.

So, the Smartcarb was worth it. The bike idles and runs perfectly with PST's Velocity Intake with the Outerwears filter cover on it. We have to install the Thermobob but we will tomorrow.

For one, the bike now starts perfectly. The carb was adjusted from Technology Elevated and I have not needed, other than to possibly increase the idle. I'm like a Conor McGregor in the 165 lb weight class so I always have the power to weight advantage when I pilot anything and the KTM 300 has all the power I will ever need and other than not having the instant 450 four stroke torque right off the bat, it does not take much to get the super-light KTM 300 into the power and it just stays there and the Smartcarb makes the power about perfect.

The lightness of the entire snowbike is a huge difference and in a good way. It is Sam, who is 12 years old, who will be riding the bike the most but when I had it on 8" of loose granular snow that had been rained on all day yesterday during a 50 degree day, then froze as daylight faded this 12/23/2018 and in top gear, the bike had all the power of any 450.

The only thing the KTM could use is a Rekluse auto-clutch and it would then be perfect but having to skill-it and use the clutch is no big deal either. It is just that having a Rekluse and not needing to worry about covering the clutch is a nice-thing.

More after more riding tomorrow. I'm just so glad that there is enough snow to ride on until I have to go home sometime on Wednesday.

There are pictures of all three bikes at the end of this thread:


https://thumpertalk.com/forums/topi...credible-more-pics-and-another-review/?page=3

More, I say, MORE, fun to-day. Bright sun. No too cold. Not much wind. What a day. Snowbikes and snowmobiles. It sure is nice having a choice of which to ride.

Status report. All three snow-fighter bikes are operating at 100% Capitain!


Full speed ahead.

The KTM 300. We had installed the Thermobob and hooked up new lines to the PST carburetor heater that was clamped onto the brand new Smartcarb 38mm and that was tuned from the factory and so far, not one. Single. Adjustment. Has been necessary as the bike starts, idles, and runs, perfectly.

The Smartcarb, coupled with the PST carburetor heater, that is getting its supply of hot radiator-sauce via the Thermobob, then add in the neoprene carburetor jacket to keep that heat in and a nice, new, Velocity Intake with a perfectly fitted Outerwears skin-equals, 300cc two stroke perfection. I/we did it.

Between stripping the bike down to put the 2019 Camso DTS 129 kit on it.

Then removing the airbox so the Smartcarb and PST Velocity Intake-and by the way, thanks to the maker(s) of the Smartcarb and PST and Thermobob and ALL you guys who had put the time in using these snowbiking products so us "pioneers" of the sport, really just a freaking HACK like me can follow directions and we can go and ride these machines and not have to worry about much else but making sure we have enough fuel is really fantastic. All the bits and pieces work/are working/have been working-so well together that I'm looking forward to the three of us riding until there is no more snow this winter.

The KTM is now both complete and ready for the upcoming season.

The Honda CRF 450X. The engine with the carburetor that gave me fits all last season and again at the start of this one.

We have finally verified that the CRF 450X is back to what we think is 100%.

Here is a good starting-routine-story. I ask Sam, my 12 Nephew In-Law. He has been riding both the 450, the 500 and the 300, the same three bikes I will talk about throughout this entire thread as they are the three bikes we have, for now. Sam had gone to start the 450 this morning. I ask him;

"Sam, did you use the choke to start the 450 this morning?"

He says that he doesn't even know where the choke is on the carburetor. I'm sort of incredulous as the bike staring, on the button, for the very first start of the day, and one does not need choke, well, Tickle Me HAPPY!!!! That the CRF450X is now starting almost effortlessly in the morning with no choke and then re-starting on the button every time and also idling and running perfectly, well, that is making me very, very happy as my guy Steve had mentioned just tonight, because he is like 6'-something and 240 lbs, that he now prefers his CRF450X over the KTM 300 because the 450 has instant grunt and just more of it, everywhere and he is also so used to it after having ridden it all last season. Thank goodness the 450 is running like a Honda 450 should.


Once again, my Beta 500 RR-S is the picture of perfection. Everyone loves the Rekluse in it. Everyone loves how easy the gearbox shifts and how smooth the G2 aluminum throttle tube with a QUICK TURN cam and a Jimmy Twister that makes the entire right-hand-experience so, SO nice, that it makes riding the Beta one of everyones favorite bike to try as it is a 2017 after all and the Beta has been said(rumored) to have the SMOOTHEST four stroke engine out of ALL the engines made. If this is true then I'm loving it because the engine is both all there and runs just like a well made/tuned engine should.

I had a starter go out this past September/October. It had taken like 4-5 weeks for it to be replaced but it was totally worth it as I got the bike back running like the day I got it. I think what had happened and why the starter magnets imploded inside of the little starter housing, here is my theory.

Last winter we had some brutally cold mornings where it would get down to -10 or sometimes -20 and come morning, it would be in the low single digits, like 2 or 5 degrees, maybe in the low teens. I had learned that it was not until I would hook up the Weego JS12 jump pack that because the battery didn't quite have enough juice/amps to fire up the bike, because I had kept on trying to get the bike started until the battery would go low and I'd have to(be forced) to put the jump pack on, I was overheating the starter bigtime.

I had no clue that all the attempts at trying to get the bike started in the extreme cold was putting way, way too much strain/stress on the starter and heating up the internals so that eventually, one day after the summer was almost over, that the magnets that were lining the inside of the starter would just implode/grenade and taking out the entire inside of the starter-BIG LESSON LEARNED-use the jump pack on cold mornings. If the bike does not light up on the very first try, put the jump pack instead of trying over and over and over to get the bike to light.

It is late. It is now after 12am. We are going to ride up to a spring up on the mountain and go ice skating sometime after breakfast tomorrow on the mountain spring that has now frozen over and happens to be almost the exact size and shape of an Olympic sized hockey rink. There had been a pretty good thaw and rain on Friday but since then, it has been freezing and the spring is frozen solid and a dusting of snow has covered the ice.

Happy Holiday fellow SnoWest snowbikers.

It is now, and I emphasize "FOR NOW", all the machines are in tip-top order.

I no longer have any machines that are pending any repair, maintenance or anything at all really. It has not been this way for the past couple of months as something has always needed replacing but now we just wait for more snow to fall up north and then we can start breaking stuff.

Tonight.


All is quiet. Big snow for us is going to come all day on Sunday, 12-24" where I am but the best part is that there is a 6-8" hard base and then another 6-12" of powder on top of that, so anything more is going to just be white-delicious-gray-vee. I'm loving life right now.



Tonight.


All the bikes have been living outside, covered but unheated. CRF450X up first. By 5th try, full choke, the engine stayed fired and settled into its high idle to warm itself up before I push the choke in and let the bike idle for a minute as the clutch plates stick and one can't just step for first gear or the engine dies, so one waits but then it is first gear and the bike is off, with the Yoshimura quiet-insert.

The quiet insert does help at idle and going slow but once one turns up the volume on the 450X, the Yoshimura R2 pipe and muffler bark and scream but the 450X does have some excellent power for a 2008 engine. The FCR carburetor is now running pretty perfect for the motor. Good CRF.


Next up, KTM 300. Kickstart bike but, once warm/hot, the button fires the bike up easy but the bike is a one kick bike all the time now and between the Smartcarb, which has had the bike, with my 12 year old nephew in law, loving shallow 12" powder tonight, when I got to try the bike it is just so much lighter but with just as much power as I'd ever want or need. A 300cc two stroke KTM is a great bike with the Camso DTS 129 and the Smartcarb, PST carb heater, thermobob and carb jacket. I'm going to learn how well it does in the powder coming on Sunday but so far, the bike is everything a 450 is with less weight.

The only downside of the 300 is that the two stroke can scream and the sound can carry but, it sure is a nice sound and scream.

The Smartcarb has been terrific so far. The engine just starts right up. Idles. Never stalls. The entire setup was just over $1,000, but to get the ability to not ever worry about jetting, or icing, or stalling, or leaking, and the best MPG one can get out of a non-EFI KTM 300 engine, is pretty excellent. Twist and go.

The KTM has the 2019 kit while the 450X and the Beta have 2018 kits. There is no way we can tell any difference between the two and if the 2019 is better, so be it. I'll never be able to tell on my Beta and the 2018 kit. I just know that the Beta 500 RR-S rocks.


Ok. Let me get this out of the way, this 2017 500 RR-S, with its new this past summer AGM battery, 478cc fuel injected, electric start engine from Beta coupled with a 6 speed close ratio with a Rekluse Radius CX, and otherwise stock but for an Outerwears prefilter on the air filter cage and a PST engine jacket, the engine is pretty much stock-city and it is a great city to live in.

I do not and will not, ever want more power out of a bike engine. Beta's 478cc engine, fuel injected, is more power than I ever need at pretty much any-time. It is a good if not great-thing, all the sweet, sweet power the engine makes. There are many who say that the power is this, that, or, the other-thing, but very simply put, the smaller than a 500cc engine by 22cc's has great power.

Little did I know that the 478cc engines from Beta are considered the smoothest of all the four stroke big-bore thumpers. I am coming up on two years that I have had this bike as the date 02/22/2017 is an easy one to remember.

Here is the story, again, if you may have forgotten;





My first bike was a 1987 KX250. I think Jeff Ward won something, maybe the whole year of MX, on an 87 KX250. Win on Sunday, people buy on Monday.

It was 1997 and I could pay $600 for the bike and another $150 for the perfect pair of Alpinestars Tech 7's. I had put some premix in the tank and as there was no kickstarter, or it was loose/missing a bolt-something, pushed it down a street and the bike fired up and ran, and ran, and ran, and ran some more until one day a ring broke and had stopped the engine. I had no money and no desire to fix that engine and bike.

I had a 1984 XL250R and I put pure dirt tires on it and had my first taste of smooth, tractable, four stroke power. Just enough power to get me up and around everywhere and anywhere. The bike had proved that it is not always the bike but the rider when it comes down to things. I had almost gotten a 2017 CRF250L because of that XL250 and my BIL's XR250 that I had also enjoyed riding.

Instead, once I had ridden the XL into the ground, I got a 1985 CR500R for like $700 from some kid that had put a 56 tooth rear sprocket or some other massive sprocket that was totally wrong, but to be fair, the kid was a good 250lbs plus, he was a big boy, but the air filter was so clogged, like the kid never cleaned it, that the bike would not start on the kickstarter and we had to push the bike down the street to get it to start. This was why the bike was only $700. It needed both tires. New rear sprocket and front sprocket and chain, it needed everything but I got it everything and no matter what anyone else says, the bike had decent power but the 1996 CR500R was the faster and more superior bike each and every day and time.

The 85 no matter what sprockets were tried, was a short-shift, powerful bike for a very smal window, but it was a fun, fun bike. I had realized that I was loving the power but with an oddball front-end, RWU forks, lame disc up front and a drum in the rear, once I had tried the 96 that used to be some guys ice-racing bike and was running really strong, between the so much better stock suspension and stock everything on that 96, the CR500R that I had for so long, had never let me down, was one of the very best woods bikes that I will have ever owned, had to be sold sometime and I sold it to a guy for $1,300 in 2009, right before my boy was coming the following year.

I wanted CR500R power and the better 96 big bore Honda CR500R motor-power and got it in the Beta 500 RR-S.

I now have the way superior suspension as compared to the CR500. I like that I can be quiet on the RR-S. That it has a license plate and can be ridden on any road in the US of A, but can also ride on any trail as it really is a full on enduro bike with lights. A nice bright Baja Designs, Squadron Pro LED headlight. Talk about lighting up the night. The Squadron Pro has to be the very best, light. For the money. For $300. Motominded makes the very best plug and play solution for my toy. (period)

I can't and won't even take pictures as one knows what bright is on the snow or at night when they have seen a nice LED lightbar at night. Squadron Pro, two long-range LED's and then two wide LED's.

Well, I'm tired. It is almost midnight and there are things to do tomorrow like take chainsaws on the powdersleds and cut down/open up the trail that leads to the trail that gets groomed/the local snowmobile club trail, that if it not groomed, will be great to take the snowbikes on once the big snow comes on Sunday. That will be some fun for tomorrow for sure. Chainsaws and snowmobiles.

I will concede, absolutely, will I concede and put it out there that a 300 TPI/FI two stroke, provided we can keep on riding the open areas on our snowbikes, but a 300 two stroke with the Camso 129 kit on it, is all I need and here is why;


1. Even though I'm tooling around on a 2008 KTM 300 XC-W, the bike has all the power I need in the snow. I also, and this is odd for me, in the snow, I like the sound of the two stroke in the snow.

2. The lightness of the entire bike/unit. There is an entire thread now dedicated to all the snowbikes with all manner of kits on them and most of them are 4-strokes. No matter. Today was the definition of "Epic"-day for us. We already had 12" of powder and then it had snowed another 2' today. I now know what some were referring to when they mention that the snow is so deep that when one falls off the bike-for whatever reason, it is hard, no, make that, it is almost impossible to get back on the bike.

The lightness of the bike made it so that anytime I had let the bike fall over, it made it so much easier to get the bike back up compared to the lead-sled Beta 500 RR-S that is some heavy-iron compared to a 300 XC-W.



I will say/type all of this with a grain of salt. I had woken up on Saturday and was slicing and dicing up blowdowns and big fallen trees that had gone across the trails. It was not easy, slipping and sliding out in the woods and on the side of the ridge where all the trees had fallen, wrestling in the slippery snow with live chainsaws, having to break trail with a SkiDoo Expedition and a Tundra, but with so much snow, it was not easy in the deeper powder that had already been on the ground since last Thursday as both sleds have studded tracks so they are not the best deep-snow sleds due to the weight on both of the tracks but we had still made due and got all we needed to get done, done. We had then rode around for the rest of the day Saturday, before the snow, and into the night Saturday night.

We woke up on Sunday(today) and went skiing after having woken up to at least 18" of new snow. New sugar snow as that is how it was stacking up, all cold and light and in pellets like big sugar. I had not skied since last winter when I had gone one time but today was fun and I had realized how much I used to love skiing, when I was broke and had nothing else to do but ski for fun in the winter. After skiing we took the snowbikes out in more powder than I have ever ridden in and I must have had the front ski wash out on me, or, I was trying to make tighter turns in the powder that just can't be made. The thing is, my body was so tired from all the activities that I could not help but to let my bike, or whatever bike I was riding, from going onto its side. Fatigue had set it, but it did make me realize that the perfect snowbike for me will be a 300 with fuel injection or whatever TPI means from KTM as a new KTM, or if Beta has a FI 300, I'd be thinking about it for a dedicated snowbike and I would no longer need to swap out my dual sport bike and the 500 RR-S, even though I do like it as a snowbike. Lighter might just be a LOT better for me in the long run as the nimbleness of the two stroke has made me see the light.

I need to get to bed as I am whipped after a glorious winter weekend.

Oh yeah, the 2008 Honda 450X. It had another near flawless day of operation.

It was only 15F this morning. The battery, while able to turn the engine over, without a jump pack, was not enough to get the bike lit but, the kickstarter came to the rescue and after two good kicks, the bike fired right up and once warm/hot, could/would easily start using the magic button.

All the carburetor work on the FCR carburetor had/has paid off as the bike is now a perfectly great snowbike.

M5- said:

Now just add a Yeti 129 SS in lieu of the Camso as its a full 39 lbs lighter yet again than the Camso. Do that math.


M5

Click to expand...

Wow, 40 lbs, that is some savings right there. I'll have to read/hear about how the Yeti 129 works as I have not seen much about them.

Misha Subo said:

Ah Ben, you are finally coming over from the dark side (4T) to the light side.

Click to expand...

I've always had a fondness for two stroke. Now that I have ridden the KTM 300 in the deepest powder we have ever had, and after having been so utterly exhausted from two full days of clearing/cutting trees, alternating between riding the snowmobiles and the snowbikes, and having had to pick up the bike so many times from either losing balance when stopped/stopping, or being so fatigued and allowing the front ski to wash-out in the deep powder when simply carving a trail and not having the presence of mind to just open the turn up instead of trying to knife the turn when I had all the space in the world to run wide in an open space, I was wiped-out and tired by the end of the day on Sunday.

Someday, someday, I'll be in the market for a FI 300 two stroke for a dedicated snowbike.

It is just that the 500 RR-S I have is a good commuter and dirt bike.

While I know that the KTM 300 would be awesome for the snow, once the TPI is deemed reliable and the first or however many years it might take KTM or, should Beta come out with their version of a DI/FI 300, it is the quiet and relaxed-part of the big four stroke that I have that is nice for the trails and being able to ride a lot more places without the two stroke-sound bothering anyone.

That I'm not picking the Beta up off the road or the trails, the weight is not much of a problem and certainly not while I'm riding it.

I also think that because it was the very end of the second day of some incredible winter activity, that the (lame, again, I know) fatigue had really gotten to me and lifting the bike out of the snow was a chore and there was one point where I had thought that if I had gone down again that i might not be able to get the bike upright again as the snow was so deep where I was and the two other guys, my BIL and his son, had already gone home.

I did notice how much easier it was getting the 300 up off the snow as the weight difference does make a difference.

Cold-starting the three bikes-notes after having had more time on all three bikes;


Beta 500 RR-S. Down to 18F, the engine will start on the 2nd or maybe 3rd try with no help. Fuel Injection and the motor being a 2017 has to help. Below 17F I have to put the Weego JS12 on and the bike will fire right up.


2008 Honda CRF450X. From about 25F to 18F, the engine will start on its own but it will take 5-7 tries with full choke. Under 17F the engine needs either the booster pack or to be kicked. Once the bike has been run/warm/hot, it will fire on the button no problem.


2008 KTM 300. I have learned(from the good Misha Subo), that the e-starter on this year bike is weak. We always use the kickstarter to get the motor going when it is cold but thankfully, with the Smartcarb, the engine fires up easily no matter how cold and once warmed, the engine will start with the button.

I will admit/say, that in the snow, the 300 two stroke is quieter, shockingly quieter as the snow absorbs all the sound while the 450 four strokes are a lot louder, in the snow.

I have yet to hear the 300 TPI/FI either on the snow or on the street/dirt. I do know that off the snow, the 2S is not quieter and that I can't ride one on the streets legally as making bikes street legal here in MA is just not possible.

My BIL had to ride the KTM 300 this morning. While he loves the bike on the dirt, he is not a fan of it in the snow. He is over 6' and 240 lbs so this makes a difference as I'm only 5'9" and 165 lbs so the 300cc two stroke can pull me around, easily, where he has a lot more weight to get around.

He definitely prefers the 450 and the power that it has right from GO.

It was another awesome ride today. The 10" from Tuesday night settled and the wind blew it where it needed to go so it just made for another memorable morning from about 10am to 1pm. I took my 2004 Rev 500SS back up and down just to run it some more and keep everything running well so that was fun until it was time to start the 125 mile/2-hour drive south, back home till the next time.

Despite it only having been 2-3F this morning, the Beta fired up on the 2nd try with the Weego JS12 jump pack on it. Fuel Injection is really where it is at, it just works so well, all the time.