Diesel Tuners

grandpaj · Feb 17, 2011

I have a 2009 Gmc Dmax. Have had many other diesels, this is by far in stock form the best of the bunch, EXCEPT it gets the worst mpg towing of any of them. Empty on the highway it is about as good as any. So my question to any one that has expertise in this, is there something that can be done to help the the towing fuel economy. I'm not young and don't want noise, want to be able to hear whats going on in the back seat. Don't want to have the dealer throw out the warranty the next time I go in for an oil change. I don't need more power, it pulls my 26' foot camp trailor and my 6 place open trailor just fine, but would like to get 13-14 when towing like I used to get.
So I don't want to start a brand comparison, just some friendly advise if you have some.

snowman429 · Feb 17, 2011

go talk to the guys over at powerlabs in idaho falls. They might be able to help you out

SLDHVN · Feb 18, 2011

pacific performance economy tuner would suit your application well

line8 · Feb 18, 2011

I am in the same boat. It's quite frustrating to think how nice these new heavy duty trucks are, and a gas station can't be missed. It's a good thing mine has navigation and I can input points of interest that consist of where I can get diesel along any route I go. I have a different brand but the same concern. I've read and researched until I'm blue. It's the emissions and to obtain better efficiencies, they have to go. I've got a Ford so I can't give you specifics for what you have other than the dpf is a huge factor. Remove the emissions stuff and you get a better running truck and better fuel consumption but, you run the risk of warranty problems with the manufacturer.

CFH616 · Feb 18, 2011

EFI Live hands down!!

KSH · Feb 24, 2011

grandpaj said:
I have a 2009 Gmc Dmax. Have had many other diesels, this is by far in stock form the best of the bunch, EXCEPT it gets the worst mpg towing of any of them. Empty on the highway it is about as good as any. So my question to any one that has expertise in this, is there something that can be done to help the the towing fuel economy. I'm not young and don't want noise, want to be able to hear whats going on in the back seat. Don't want to have the dealer throw out the warranty the next time I go in for an oil change. I don't need more power, it pulls my 26' foot camp trailor and my 6 place open trailor just fine, but would like to get 13-14 when towing like I used to get.
So I don't want to start a brand comparison, just some friendly advise if you have some.

Talk to your dealer and see what "They" will allow. GM has zero tolerance.
Any and all changes to ECU are stored in the ECU for GM to view later.

So you have to find out what the dealer will allow and ignore.

The DPF is what is killing your mileage, so with out removing it your not going to see big gains.

As far as programmers, EFI Live changes the stock programing and is the most versatile. I went with Banks, they are a piggyback unit and only modify the programing.

barry1me · Feb 24, 2011

im in the same boat as you also. Im looking at doing an H&S Mini Maxx tuner or EFI Live. Also have to do a DPF delete to get any kind of decent fuel economy out of the LMM duramax.

Dustin_R · Feb 25, 2011

barry1me said:
im in the same boat as you also. Im looking at doing an H&S Mini Maxx tuner or EFI Live. Also have to do a DPF delete to get any kind of decent fuel economy out of the LMM duramax.

Do it!! H&S is top notch imo. I bought my exhaust (dpf delete) and chip from them and everything else from rolling smoke (James is a stand up guy, its a one man show). I got the Black Maxx after my other tuner crapped out. Only wish I had done it sooner. (6.7 Dodge)

trickedout700 · Mar 3, 2011

H&S all the way my buddy is a dealer in Montana and he has sick prices on tuners and dpf delete systems. If you want to wake up your diesels and get real mpg out of them go this route. I am in the process of going to a new ford and we will do a bunch of things to it and will probably pull 18-20 mpg! If you have any questions call me at 406-899-2838 and i will get you hooked up with some amazing deals.

carlc · Mar 3, 2011

h and s is nice for cummins, but they dont have near the options for ford or gm. I Tune dmaxs with efilive and it truly is the way to go for a dmax. nothing even comes close to the adjustability it has. As stated above, dpf delete is a must on any diesel 2007 up, and also as stated above, check with you specific dealer about pulling your emissions, some are way more leniant than others. Any chip/tuner/module will be able to be detected if the factory looks hard enough, boost, torque output, pulse width, timing, and fuel pressure are all measured and stored by the ECU. That being said, 13-14 is usually attainable with a mileage/tow tune and dpf delete. the pickup will be slightly louder than before, but definitely not loud. email me at Christianson.Carl@gmail.com if you want more info, or a price quote. Hope this helps, Carl

Hawkeye · Mar 5, 2011

I have a 2008 duramax LMM and have done the turbo back, complete new exhaust. You would think taking all those restrictions off that the mileage would go thru the roof - not! Might have helped slightly not towing, but made it louder, has always had great power. Would have been better off using the money for more fuel. The only way a LMM gets good mileage is to go 55 to 60 mph and baby it and/or wait till it hits 60K miles

badass1000 · Mar 9, 2011

isn't it great knowing $7,000 of your new truck purchase is going towards emisions crap. Then you have to spend $$$$ more to take it all off so you can get some decent gas mileage.

CaptNCoke · Mar 9, 2011

Duramax

I've got an 08 Duramax. I run the PPE hot race 2 w/ DPF delete, 5" turbo back, with the edge juice w/ attitude as well. It's got way more power than I need, or than the tranny, injectors, etc, can handle. But I've got a lot of adjustability on putting the power to it, or going for mileage. At best I get 22-24 on highway, 16 with my 27 ft enclosed, and 14 with my 36ft Montana 5th wheel, and it pulls like a freight train......stock, it was the worst Duramax I've ever owned. I got 12 empty, 6 towing. IMO anyone that spends the money for a diesel, must spend a little extra to get the performance out of it. They are all de-tuned from the factory. hopefully this helps.

Iowaplowboy · Mar 9, 2011

onthejuice2 said:
I've got an 08 Duramax. I run the PPE hot race 2 w/ DPF delete, 5" turbo back, with the edge juice w/ attitude as well. It's got way more power than I need, or than the tranny, injectors, etc, can handle. But I've got a lot of adjustability on putting the power to it, or going for mileage. At best I get 22-24 on highway, 16 with my 27 ft enclosed, and 14 with my 36ft Montana 5th wheel, and it pulls like a freight train......stock, it was the worst Duramax I've ever owned. I got 12 empty, 6 towing. IMO anyone that spends the money for a diesel, must spend a little extra to get the performance out of it. They are all de-tuned from the factory. hopefully this helps.

I also put the PPE on my 09 Duramax with 4" turbo back. It definately has more power - but I'm not getting the mileage I hoped for. Pulling a trailer will get me 10-13 mpg. Driving it like a car will get me about 16 mpg. If the PPE settings are downloaded back to the PPE controller, then GM should not have a record of it being installed - shouldn't be a warrenty issue.

ndC7M8 · Mar 9, 2011

they easiest and most common way of telling if your truck has had a tuner on it is the Key-On-Counter. It's exactly what it sounds like; it keeps track of how many times the ignition has been turned on. If the tuner you purchase doesnt say that it doesnt reset the key-on-counter when you plug it in and change parameters on your truck, then it will be detected at a dealer right away.......The only tuner I know of for sure that doesnt reset the key-on-counter is the MADS Smarty tuner for the Cummins diesels.....I'm not sure about the Duramax tuners out there, but I gaurantee most of them, if not all of them can be detected later on. But, like it was stated earlier, other readings like boost, torque output, pulse width, timing, and fuel pressure are all measured and stored by the ECU so even if the tuner you purchase is "undectectable," depending on what parameters you change, a good technician will realize slightly higher than normal readings means a tuner was used......

there are more than likely cases where I'm wrong on this, but for the most part I would take this post into consideration. Get a good dealer and make him your friend. Thats the best option.

robertyoke · Mar 10, 2011

ndC7M8 said:
they easiest and most common way of telling if your truck has had a tuner on it is the Key-On-Counter. It's exactly what it sounds like; it keeps track of how many times the ignition has been turned on. If the tuner you purchase doesnt say that it doesnt reset the key-on-counter when you plug it in and change parameters on your truck, then it will be detected at a dealer right away.......The only tuner I know of for sure that doesnt reset the key-on-counter is the MADS Smarty tuner for the Cummins diesels.....I'm not sure about the Duramax tuners out there, but I gaurantee most of them, if not all of them can be detected later on. But, like it was stated earlier, other readings like boost, torque output, pulse width, timing, and fuel pressure are all measured and stored by the ECU so even if the tuner you purchase is "undectectable," depending on what parameters you change, a good technician will realize slightly higher than normal readings means a tuner was used......

there are more than likely cases where I'm wrong on this, but for the most part I would take this post into consideration. Get a good dealer and make him your friend. Thats the best option.

even the smarty will show on a 6.7 C, just how deep does the tech want to dig. simple things like you have a truck with 25,000 miles and 4 regens....kind of a give away. the dealers have to log any re-flashes to the ecm and record them, so if you have a unauthorized re-program, you are your own warrantee station.
Some guy a while back on the cummins site put a chart together that fuel savings by dpf delete/tuner over 100,000 miles at 3.50 a gallon for diesel, you could buy a crate motor and still pocket some cash......i dont know how true that is but its probably close. not sure if he added in the cost of the tuner and exhaust though.

Skogen · Mar 10, 2011

CFH616 said:
EFI Live hands down!!

X2...

ndC7M8 · Mar 11, 2011

robertyoke said:
even the smarty will show on a 6.7 C, just how deep does the tech want to dig. simple things like you have a truck with 25,000 miles and 4 regens....kind of a give away. the dealers have to log any re-flashes to the ecm and record them, so if you have a unauthorized re-program, you are your own warrantee station.
Some guy a while back on the cummins site put a chart together that fuel savings by dpf delete/tuner over 100,000 miles at 3.50 a gallon for diesel, you could buy a crate motor and still pocket some cash......i dont know how true that is but its probably close. not sure if he added in the cost of the tuner and exhaust though.

way to be heads up. I was referring to the 5.9 cummins + smarty, not the 6.7. you are right tho, I should have been more specific there.....but back to topic, I don't believe you can get away with it on any 6.6 Duramax, can you? D-max guys? Anyone? lol

Burn Down · Mar 11, 2011

ndC7M8 said:
way to be heads up. I was referring to the 5.9 cummins + smarty, not the 6.7. you are right tho, I should have been more specific there.....but back to topic, I don't believe you can get away with it on any 6.6 Duramax, can you? D-max guys? Anyone? lol

You are correct with the d-max. LBZ, LMM, LML will all record how many times the truck has had its programing changed. If it does not match the factories record, GAME OVER WARRANTY VOID. It can even be found on older models that don't record the number of tunes. The torque tables in the transmission ecm will give it away.

You cannot hide any of this from GM anymore. They are cracking down on cooked trannys & melted down engines. I don't like it anymore than anyone else, But I don't blame them either...

To the OP. You are not going to get any better mileage without voiding your warranty. The DPF has got to go. If you are not willing to void it then just leave it be. Even if you find a dealer who will turn a blind eye. What happens when you go out of town and have a problem? I bet that dealer won't be so forgiving. All it takes is one dealer & your warranty is void no matter where you go.

So, from reading your post I would say leave it be...

Hawkeye · Mar 14, 2011

In my case, even taking off the DPF and all the other restrictions in the exhaust didn't help, the brand of tuner doesn't make a difference does it? I have a basic tuner, can not recall the brand, just to eliminate the code and dash lite

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