Great Burn on Montana/Idaho border--STILL TIME TO PARTICIPATE IN THE PROCESS!!!

oldmaninmt · Jan 7, 2012

anybody know the facts re the clearwater nf closure of the great burn area (recommended for wilderness designation)? Reportedly as of Jan 4 it is now closed. This included Hoodoo,Surveyor, Blacklead,Williams Lake and all areas inbetween. It dosen't seem that we've gotten much help from BRC or other organizations on this.
If this is true, virtually all of our high quality high elevation riding has been eliminated in west central montana with the stroke of a pen.

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RNR1085 · Jan 7, 2012

Clearwater Forest travel plan is now in effect, if you call the orofino idaho office they will send you a copy of the travel plan. 3 volumes, each 200 pages long. I asked for one on thursday jan 5. it' in the mail. there is supposedly some seasonal closures and a compromise for motorized travel. I haven't read it yet, the north fork area in Idaho has 197 miles of trails closed now, mostly single track. But they are open for travel august 1 to nov. 1 for dirt bikes......I hope. The forest service expects an appeal and lawsuits from the environmental groups. It's b.s. and they're gonna make outlaws of all of us cause I'm not gonna stay out. The greenies want the weitas creek as a new wilderness area.

MT rydn · Jan 7, 2012

Lots of simultaneous Wildnerness efforts throughout the country. I never remember a time so much going on all at once AND how few people seemed to see it was coming....other than Obama's friends / and in Montana Tester and Baucus friends who both support all the closures. (hint hint - Rehberg MUST win over Tester, who is the Wildnerness Society best friend.)

It ain't just the job of BRC. How about all those companies we buy our snowmobiles/ATV's/motorcycles/campers/4x4's/other off road products from? Because when the areas are closed we quit riding which means we quit buying their stuff and that equals NO SALES. Not the dealers, I'm not talking about them. I'm talking manufactureres/the deep pockets. They think saving money on lobbying (which is needed in Wash DC / and around the country) is smart - ever heard the old saying "penny wise...dollar fool" All those little piddly raffles/etc we try doing at local level does not buy enough power/influence to do one thing at the level it needs to hange - the culture of the Dept of Agriculture / Forest Service at the national level.

What would help is if our local access groups and with all of us members would work together better (some of them never even speak to each other)
AND if snowmobilers/ATV'ers/motorcyclists/etc would all support each others efforts. Well I've blabbed my piece...again. But honestly doubt, at this point unless major changes as discussed above happen, my grandkids will be enjoying anything in the back country other than that which can be accessed by hiking boots or magic carpet that just hovers over the ground under magic dust power. Even then we would be "disturbing" the sensitive yellow belly warbler mating habits so that would be banned. I'm waiting for the Wildnerness Society and Obama to declare the moon Wilderness.

Oregongirl · Jan 7, 2012

Here's the ALERT that SAWS published to it's membership in August 2009. This one has been in the works for along time now.

Keeping land open for use, of all kinds, is a job for everyone -- your "watchdog" organizations (BRC,SAWS, State Assoc) cannot do it without your help.

This ruling is likely to have far reaching impacts to how the USFS manages RWA in all other Western forests. :face-icon-small-fro Specifically since the Colville/Okanagon/Wenatchee Forests (COW) and the Blue Mountain Forests are both in their Forest Revision Planning processes....which you can be assured will include thousands of acres being proposed as Recommended Wilderness Areas.

Here is the SAWS Alert on the Blues. And on the COW.

Our fight for snowmobile access rights is getting hot, fast. :boxing: Sadly, there is a large population of snowmobilers that pay no attention to these fights until the battle is already lost. Honestly, getting land open to access AFTER it's been closed is an uphill battle.

Dogmeat · Jan 7, 2012

I really wish the OEM's would jump in and build a fund between all of them and form their own legal team with a steady source of funding to combat this crap.

As much as I wish I could go back to school and get a law degree and just fight this crap full time, I can't.

Its appalling to me how well-funded the environazi groups are.

toesup81 · Jan 8, 2012

perspective

If you really want to see how well funded and well organized the opposition is read "Undue influence" by ron arnold. It is a real eye opener.

montanagrizzly · Jan 8, 2012

Check this out http://backcountryrebels.com/showthread.php?t=19708 It has some links in it!

TIM · Jan 9, 2012

you can legally ride in the rwa's on the clearwater until about mid march.

Older & Wiser · Jan 9, 2012

I think a lawsuit should be filed against the Forest Circus and Rick Brazell - not all groups/interests were represented. Was this done on purpose??

Tim, Are the areas that are open til March the same areas we have been able to ride in the past?

oldmaninmt · Jan 9, 2012

ride till March?

Is there somewhere that it is in writing that affirms that we can ride in these areas till March? I believe you(we) have a 45 day window to appeal the order,but only if you commented during the several stages of the process up to this point. I suppose the clock started to tick on Jan 4th, the date the decision was publicly released.

TIM · Jan 9, 2012

I called the clearwater natl forest on the 5th of january and they told me the date that the 45 day count down starts on is january 10. that is where i got the mid march. After that we need to call to see when the official date of closure is.

So we can ride where we rode last year until than. this was according to the lady i talked to at the forest service.

the ladies phone number that i talked to is:208 660 2058. I wish i would have wrote her name down.

tim

oldmaninmt · Jan 9, 2012

implementation date

I'll check with that # again tomorrow. I understand two citations were issued ,to two individuals at Hoodoo last Saturday, (reportedly) resulting in $200 fines for each citation. I have not been able to find out exactly what the alleged infractions were. If I here more credible info I'll report back.

sledfvr · Jan 9, 2012

I will do anything I can to help fight this too. Keep us posted on what you find and I'll do the same.

sledfvr · Jan 9, 2012

Only Congress has the right to create wilderness.
Recommended wilderness areas don't meet that definition.

Also, contact U.S. Rep. McCarthy, R-Bakersfield, Calif.
Ask them for help and information.

Check out.
U.S. Congress: H.R. 1581
The Wilderness and Roadless Area Release Act of 2011

This is a quote from Ollie on BCR. Anyone know anything more about this?

MT rydn · Jan 9, 2012

The Rules to fight additional Wilderness:
1. democrats = bad
2. Obama = bad

Sorry to be over generalized. Please someone give up the names and party affiliation of their states Senators / Reps, their positions on all the greenie/new Wilderness designation attempts and their party. Here I will start.
Montana.
Senators Tester (democrat), Baucus (democrat), both support new/additional Wildeness legislation
Representative Rehberg (running against Tester for Senate position and Republican does NOT support additional the additioanl Wildnerness designations.)
We need to vote out the radical Wilderness cheerleaders :cheer2::closed_2: and by doing so ultimately change the culture of Dept of Ag / Forest Service. Your local forest officials do not have enough power, it's top down management. It starts in DC and you need to send our guys / gals there.

Pol600 · Jan 9, 2012

MN Senators

We have Franken and Klobuchar here in MN. Both Dems but Klobuchar has some sense..

Obama is behaving himself (relatively) because he has to get re-elected. If gets re-elected, the next four years could break the back of snowmobiling..

Who is the best Republican for us to support? I worry that Romney, if elected, may waffle and cave into NE liberals on land/environment

TIM · Jan 10, 2012

I hate to say it, but this has nothing to do with congress or the president.
about 5-6 years ago, Abigal Kimball was the acting forest supervisor of region 1 of the forest service. She went on to be the main forest service supervisor accross the country. before she left for washington dc, she wrote a directive letter to her region. Basically in the directive letter, she stated that all region 1 recommended wilderness be treated as wilderness. And this is what region 1 has been doing. Montana was quick on that, and northern idaho is slowly coming around to that directive. The forest supervisors of region 1 want wilderness and they are doing everything they can. And yes it is legal. Montana never opened up after all the lawsuits, in the early 2000's.

The lolo national forest has been closed to rwas since about 2000. They have been asking the clearwater to close there side. well the lolo is getting there wish. The great burn battle has been going since 1998 and looks to be wrapping up. It sure has been a long painful battle.

I also mountain bike in there, and that is a no no now, also.

focken greenies

sledfvr · Jan 10, 2012

!#!$%@#^#%^&*$&W#%
This really, really sucks!

RNR1085 · Jan 10, 2012

Well, I received the travel plan documents yesterday (three volumes, 200 -300 pages each and a map), the great burn area is closed to anything motorized or mechanized, (bicyles), except for F.S.Rd 419 into fish lake during the summer months. Rick Brazell is very clear that he is all for "preserving" wilderness status on areas that congress has hesitated to act upon instead of leaving them open for use "as is" until there is a decision on the status. So as long as the lands are in "wilderness study status" we have no say on the matter as a user group or individuals. We all need to write, call, and/or email our congressmen and women and insist that they remove the widerness review status of these public lands and restore them to multi-use status. Even then we have to get past the bias travel planning process which is apparent when reading memorandum of decision in the travel plan. Our kid's future use of public lands depends on it. The US Forest Service has too many environmentalists on the payroll to ever get a common sense decision out the Adminitration.

toesup81 · Jan 10, 2012

correct designation

not to be picky, but part of the game the FS plays is with semantics and confusing designations. This area is " recommended for inclusion in the wilderness preservation system". It is not a wilderness study area. They have different rules and legal guidelines that apply to each because of different laws being applicable.

Great Burn on Montana/Idaho border--STILL TIME TO PARTICIPATE IN THE PROCESS!!!

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