I will be sure to change my avatar to a photo of a sled in a garage to increase credibility, thanks :face-icon-small-win
850 175 washing out on steep sidehills
- Thread starter TreeThrasher
- Start date
I will be sure to change my avatar to a photo of a sled in a garage to increase credibility, thanks :face-icon-small-win
T
I tried every foot position possible from way way back to all the way forward and all while in good control with the rear end continually falling down hill until it’s parked straight up the hill. I have about 20000 miles in the hills on modern skidoo chassis so I do have some good background on doos. I also have an axys with a 163 so I’m not without something to compare too.
I’m not saying the 175 is not hugely capable and fun. I’m just saying i rode it side by side with our 165 and the 175 washed out at least as bad if not worse than the 165 which is really weird. Also in the same ground my t3 with 3.2 track skinz panels and my boards but stock t mo and skis the t3 does not wash off the hill.
The 175 is an easier to ride chassis and has a great feel. And it never did the skidoo toss where it’s wildly throws you. But it just nice and controlled turns uphill and will not reangle to sidehill down very well. Wondering what the cure is.
Too be clear this happens on ground far steeper than the videos or pictures posted so far in this thread. That ground would be shredded through with not a single issue
I’m not saying the 175 is not hugely capable and fun. I’m just saying i rode it side by side with our 165 and the 175 washed out at least as bad if not worse than the 165 which is really weird. Also in the same ground my t3 with 3.2 track skinz panels and my boards but stock t mo and skis the t3 does not wash off the hill.
The 175 is an easier to ride chassis and has a great feel. And it never did the skidoo toss where it’s wildly throws you. But it just nice and controlled turns uphill and will not reangle to sidehill down very well. Wondering what the cure is.
Too be clear this happens on ground far steeper than the videos or pictures posted so far in this thread. That ground would be shredded through with not a single issue
T
I built a set. They are at powder now. Will have them as well as a narrowing shoe on the front to narrow the belly pan flare
Will have a report by Christmas
Also, it appears that the front of the skid contacts the shop floor while the rear is still 2 inches off the floor. On both the 850 and my t3 the skid hits the floor even. I’m thinking part of the great easy handling of the 175 is that it carries more weight on the front of the skid. I’m also thinkin this contributes to the wash out
Will have a report by Christmas
Also, it appears that the front of the skid contacts the shop floor while the rear is still 2 inches off the floor. On both the 850 and my t3 the skid hits the floor even. I’m thinking part of the great easy handling of the 175 is that it carries more weight on the front of the skid. I’m also thinkin this contributes to the wash out
On my 2009 M8 turbo with 153, I have found that after I pull a long sidehill that the burritos in my muffpot can almost be too hot...sometimes burning them. And if I pull too steep of a sidehill, especially on the right side where the muffpot is mounted, that snow mist can actually cool the burritos. What is up with that? And has anyone had luck with actually cooking raw food in one of those? Seems like it wouldn't be very sanitary.
A
The 175 rails are slightly kicked up in the back. Tighten the limiter strap one hole that might help some.
I think you are spot on with your observations above. In my experience, when the front of skid contacts ground earlier than the rear it makes for a nimble feel but not great for more technical lines. Most of the weight is already transfered in that situation and the front of sled will ride high and hunt up hill putting too much weight transfer on the rear skid and washing out.
I would recommend cranking the rear springs all the way up, very little preload in front track spring, and keep pulling limiter up until track hits shop floor flat. It will make for a different experience.
Sucking up a limiter strap will not transfer the weight to the rear of the skid... That puts more weight on the front skis...
Just saying in general...suspension set up has a LOT to do with handling.
Plus, finding the sweet spot and balance point for feet placement is always critical. Move your feet all the way from front to back and back to front again in the most similar terrain you can find.
You'll find your sweet spot that goes with your suspension set-up and throttle/brake habits.
Plus, finding the sweet spot and balance point for feet placement is always critical. Move your feet all the way from front to back and back to front again in the most similar terrain you can find.
You'll find your sweet spot that goes with your suspension set-up and throttle/brake habits.
T
Called Kmod. If I can’t get the factory skid to work in the bad ground I’ll see if his will
F
Out last three days and rode the 175, found a foot of untouched snow with harder base in the trees..
What we found, with limiter in stock portion there just was no positioning yourself for control, this was steep technical riding.. We then took limiter up two portions and it was much much better, same run.. Than took up a third position and now skis stayed planted once moving.. Other than the initial start or less than five mph at wot, you were in good control, with full control on ulgy side hills and no washout
Now it still felt somewhat to Darty at the slower speeds at wot, somewhat a handful, guessing the weak rear shock and rear leaf sag causing it to collapse is main reason but would removing the tmotion help out?
Be my next step on perfecting this stock junk skid for tech steep riding
What we found, with limiter in stock portion there just was no positioning yourself for control, this was steep technical riding.. We then took limiter up two portions and it was much much better, same run.. Than took up a third position and now skis stayed planted once moving.. Other than the initial start or less than five mph at wot, you were in good control, with full control on ulgy side hills and no washout
Now it still felt somewhat to Darty at the slower speeds at wot, somewhat a handful, guessing the weak rear shock and rear leaf sag causing it to collapse is main reason but would removing the tmotion help out?
Be my next step on perfecting this stock junk skid for tech steep riding
J
IMO, the sled actually holds a sidehill better with...
Limiter 100% open. FTS sprung super linear with a relatively soft spring rate (air shock). This lets the front arm collapse easily, helping get the sled on top of the snow, keeps your edge "flat" in a side hill, gives you max travel so the sled can track better across the hill.
RTS super firm with a lot of compression damping. This limits your weight transfer and keeps the skis down. (again, air shock)
Locking out T-Motion. Obvious reasons.
Limiter 100% open. FTS sprung super linear with a relatively soft spring rate (air shock). This lets the front arm collapse easily, helping get the sled on top of the snow, keeps your edge "flat" in a side hill, gives you max travel so the sled can track better across the hill.
RTS super firm with a lot of compression damping. This limits your weight transfer and keeps the skis down. (again, air shock)
Locking out T-Motion. Obvious reasons.
Pretty much have mine set up the same way but with Raptors and Z motion instead of air shocks.
T
Mine no longer falls off steep side hills. Built and installed my old 174 timbersled skid into positive stop t motion style coupling skid. Pulled the limiter strap up until the skid contacts the shop floor flat and even. Now this sled works
Are you sure you didn't just finally learn how to sidehill? :face-icon-small-win
T
Lol
Always a possibility!!!
Always a possibility!!!
Limiter strap up one, raptors in the skid with Tmo locked out, proper foot placement.....the 175 sidehills so well its ridiculous. If the snow sucks so bad your washing out on hard pack those are the days to work and save up for the next epic dump....
I have a 175. LOVE IT! Man about every set up and riding post I’ve read here has NOT been my experience. My sled is stock except for the QS3 spring shocks all around. I’ve literally never rode a sled stock this long. Rear torsion on 4, RTS comp on 3, rebound on 12 clicks from full soft, FTS set 3 turns of preload from contact with the perch(soft), front shocks have an inch of preload(springs too soft for my big azz), comp on 3(honestly I can’t tell the diff from 1-3), rebound 22 clicks from full soft. Oh and limiter strap in one hole. The valving in the front shocks is way to soft, I think I got the 17 valved shocks instead of the 18 even tho I bought them this year. No t motion lock out, no skid change. Best deep powder sled I’ve ever owned.
When I hear people say the 850, especially the 175, doesn’t sidehill in the steeps, I’m pretty surprised. Go ride with Brett Ras, Tony Jenkins, or Karl Kuster. Those guys will reset your instruments for what is possible on this sled. Hell even go ride with Chadly, he gets around pretty damn good too. I’d be surprised if a Cat(own one) or a Pr/Axys(owned one before) could go anywhere that an 850 could go riders being even somewhat equal.
When I hear people say the 850, especially the 175, doesn’t sidehill in the steeps, I’m pretty surprised. Go ride with Brett Ras, Tony Jenkins, or Karl Kuster. Those guys will reset your instruments for what is possible on this sled. Hell even go ride with Chadly, he gets around pretty damn good too. I’d be surprised if a Cat(own one) or a Pr/Axys(owned one before) could go anywhere that an 850 could go riders being even somewhat equal.
J
100% agree with this. I've ridden with some of the top dudes too. Anyone that says they can't go somewhere but could on another brand's OEM is lying to themselves. They need to ride more
. (OEM vs OEM that is)The one thing I've noticed is you do need to carry a hair more speed on the G4 compared to the Axys in steep terrain (side hilling). If you do drop below a certain speed washout becomes harder and harder to mitigate on the really steep stuff.
This is true with any chassis, just a hair more pronounced on Doo.
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