Polaris Engine and surrounding information

mrquick68 · Sep 17, 2013

Kelsey, is the case volume being too small a myth, or fact?

Also, is stock piston quality a myth or fact?

Does this motor run too little oil to keep lubed? Myth or fact?

RoffRider · Sep 17, 2013

if theres lots of heat in the low end, that must mean the air is getting heated easily, from low amounts of air be highly compressed and being saturated from hot parts

if there was more case volume it would take longer to saturated and heat soak the larger amount of air, and it would not be so compact so most of the air wont come in contact with the hot parts

rkt, do any of your fix kit engines burn reeds?

Solby · Sep 17, 2013

I think a key fact of the discussions that gets left out a lot is pure metallic weight of the engine. I know it has been touched here and there on different threads, but it is fact the Polaris engine is the lightest of the bunch. Compared to the Suzuki I have heard it is around 20 pounds. That is a lot of engine weight that can be turned into strength. I'm no engine builder but to say that an engine built out of very similar materials one weighing say 10% less than the other, it should not be a surprise that it produces less power and does not have the longevity.

gunnerthesnowman · Sep 17, 2013

RoffRider said:
thats what bikeman says, they claim 4 hp from a cylinder spacer and a longer piston, not sure if thats right but i asked them about it and they said while primary compression is a good thing, it can also be over done, and that there was not enough air in the crank case to begin with so when they lowered the primary compression ratio they gained power from more air over all...high crankcase compression is usually a gimmick unless it is very low

What are we talking about here , what are you referring to as primary compression ?

RKT · Sep 17, 2013

gunnerthesnowman said:
What are we talking about here , what are you referring to as primary compression ?

Primary compression is the proper term for crankcase compression .

The primary compression ratio is the volume above the piston vs. the volume below the piston...

This is another "term" that surrounds this engine... Myth or Fact? Great question.... Let's hear the data to support the answer..

TAE · Sep 17, 2013

Have had a terrible run with polaris - 2012 pro 155
1st year under warranty
500 km engine cut out after running for 30 min or so. Back and forth to dealer six times before finally finding faulty injectors
1200 km same issues changed out injectors and stator
Went without sled for six weeks that winter- still had my 09 xp to ride but hated it after riding pro!
2nd year purchased esc from cornerstone because my experience and this forum made me nervous - $1700 for three years
2000km primary clutch fell apart
2200km rear shock broke in half
2300km ves solanoid failed
2600 km center rear shock lost fluid on garage floor
3200 km dropped piston - new motor
3700 km terrible rattle - broken motor mounts
3800km clutch cover cracking at mid point causing oil tank to leak and sled cutting out again- replaced clutch cover, oil tank, fly wheel and stator.
All of the above work and parts approx $9000 covered under esc. i kept all records of maint. and did it at polaris' recommedned intervals which is manditory otherwise u risk lossing coverage. but had enough of this and moving back to doo this season
Imho, dont own a polaris without some kind of warranty especially if u ride the steep and deep!

xc_rider08 · Sep 17, 2013

2011 pro rmk 800 with PAR head, hps can.

1275 miles - cracked cylinder skirt, polaris warrantied monoblock but wldnt put new pistons in.

1275 miles- tore old pistons out of new monoblock and replaced with rkteks pistons.

2055 miles- sled runnings strong, less viberation, better throttle response.

cant wait to get back on the snow again this year

Slick · Sep 17, 2013

2011 Pro. 3000 ish miles, changed to Camo extreme track when new, tried RKTek head and helix in a Tied clutch, set up as he advised, hated it, took it off and would feel guilty selling it to anyone, back to stock with a SLP pipe and controller, stock secondary, MDS weights, worked awesome , 0 issues loved the sled, installed mtntk fix kit at 3300 miles, Sold to a buddy, still running strong at 4200 ish miles.
Bought a 13 Pro , put a 174 on it new, have put 1000 miles on , 0 issues, clamped from new, original drive belt still in place, loved the sled, just sold it also.
Had a lot of Pros out in our riding area since 11, nowhere near the issues you'd expect if you believe all the crap about that sled you read on here.
Fun sled, Polaris really hit the mark with this chassis.
My experience, and I know it's hit and miss, I've had a hell of a lot more issues with my Doo's rings and crank seals over the years than I've had with The Polaris's and 1 Cat I've owned, but admittedly I missed the 08 to 10 Draggin fiasco.
3 good solid options available for all of us now.

BigMan · Sep 17, 2013

Solby said:
I think a key fact of the discussions that gets left out a lot is pure metallic weight of the engine. I know it has been touched here and there on different threads, but it is fact the Polaris engine is the lightest of the bunch. Compared to the Suzuki I have heard it is around 20 pounds. That is a lot of engine weight that can be turned into strength. I'm no engine builder but to say that an engine built out of very similar materials one weighing say 10% less than the other, it should not be a surprise that it produces less power and does not have the longevity.

And whose fault is it they have made it so light and flimsy? Why anyone would be so consumed with saving weight that they would give up reliability is beyond me.

RKT · Sep 18, 2013

BigMan said:
And whose fault is it they have made it so light and flimsy? Why anyone would be so consumed with saving weight that they would give up reliability is beyond me.

I think the engine weight is not the reason behind some of its short-comings (reliability -wise) You can address the reliability concerns and still keep the engine lightweight..

IMO, Polaris just has a few design issues and have opt'd to use some "less expensive" components that attribute to the longevity of the engine..

Once you get the "less expensive" parts out and replaced with a higher grade part... the reliability of the engine is near or on par with the other two engines.. HP is up as well.. so, there is "hope"

IQRIDR · Sep 18, 2013

So long story short just buy your pistons and then we can all make 160 horsepower and go to 5k miles without a rebuild, right?

Powderforlife907 · Sep 18, 2013

BigMan said:
And whose fault is it they have made it so light and flimsy? Why anyone would be so consumed with saving weight that they would give up reliability is beyond me.

I don't know either. I would rather use the money I saved from using using less material and introducing an element like scandium into the aluminum creating a stronger block that's just as light. Probably end up costing a lot more but would be pretty awesome...

Pro-8250 · Sep 18, 2013

RKT said:
This thread is not a thread about what is wrong with the 800 CFI engine.

It is a thread about "myths" that surround this enigne and whay they may or may not be "myths"

Can we try and stay on topic?

I do think the 800 is slightly under powered compared to the competition.
Or maybe I should lose some weight and quit drinking beer while eating pizza when I am watching snowmobile DVD's while my wife is mowing the lawn!:crazy:
Maybe that would make up for it!:face-icon-small-ton

mtncat1 · Sep 18, 2013

Pro-8250 said:
I do think the 800 is slightly under powered compared to the competition.
Or maybe I should loose some weight and quit drinking beer while eating pizza when I am watching snowmobile DVD's while my wife is mowing the lawn!:crazy:
Maybe that would make up for it!:face-icon-small-ton

go for the extra power . we all know that other stuff aint gonna happen:face-icon-small-hap

Pro-8250 · Sep 19, 2013

mtncat1 said:
go for the extra power . we all know that other stuff aint gonna happen:face-icon-small-hap

Frickin Funny! I love it!:face-icon-small-hap:face-icon-small-hap:face-icon-small-hap:face-icon-small-hap

madman · Sep 20, 2013

Competative Marketing

Many companies are importing chinese parts for there products, Perhaops chines pistons and other substandard parts being used?

HannaB · Sep 20, 2013

So what about the over-heating?

I've got the 2012 RMK 800 and had huge issues with it over-heating last season. Just about eliminated spring riding all together because the sled would over-heat so badly — and I don't ride trails or roads.

THAT has to be a recall fix for sure. Just sayin'

Besides that, I really LOVE my light and nimble Pro RMK 155!

Hanna in Tahoe

Outlaw · Sep 20, 2013

(2) There is a "Cold Shot" that causes engine failure: This is a good one and a huge gimmick.. Arctic Cat has had the SAME type as Polaris of coolant system for ever (no by pass loop) and has no issues .. the difference between Cat and Polaris is Polaris has a digital gauge so you can see the actual temps.. Cat has the same temps but no gauge.. Install a gauge on the Cat and ,SUDDENLY, it will have a Cold Shot problem as well... Only Ski Doo utilizes a by-pass loop and they only started doing this in 2000. For more details on why this is simply not an issue please check out this article:WHAT CAUSES and ENGINE to COLD SEIZE?)

FYI.
Arctic Cat has a reverse flow cooling system. This means that when the cold coolant returning to the engine from the tunnel hits the Thermostat it closes. The Polaris on the other hand flows thru the Thermostat to the Tunnel coolers then directly to the water pump on the front of the motor. So the cold coolant that has returned from the tunnel has to flow completely thru the motor before it hits the thermostat. This IS the Cold Shot.
Not picking a fight just educating.

RKT · Sep 20, 2013

Outlaw said:
(2) There is a "Cold Shot" that causes engine failure: This is a good one and a huge gimmick.. Arctic Cat has had the SAME type as Polaris of coolant system for ever (no by pass loop) and has no issues .. the difference between Cat and Polaris is Polaris has a digital gauge so you can see the actual temps.. Cat has the same temps but no gauge.. Install a gauge on the Cat and ,SUDDENLY, it will have a Cold Shot problem as well... Only Ski Doo utilizes a by-pass loop and they only started doing this in 2000. For more details on why this is simply not an issue please check out this article:WHAT CAUSES and ENGINE to COLD SEIZE?)

FYI.
Arctic Cat has a reverse flow cooling system. This means that when the cold coolant returning to the engine from the tunnel hits the Thermostat it closes. The Polaris on the other hand flows thru the Thermostat to the Tunnel coolers then directly to the water pump on the front of the motor. So the cold coolant that has returned from the tunnel has to flow completely thru the motor before it hits the thermostat. This IS the Cold Shot.
Not picking a fight just educating.

Arctic cat only started using reverse flow in 2005.. ALL prior sleds were designed exactly like the CFI 800...

Again,, if you can dis-prove the physics behind the near impossibility of a "COLD SHOT" happening.. please explain, afterall, this is what this thread is all about..

RoffRider · Sep 20, 2013

i have a question...will a doo thermostat fit into my poo motor?

im not going to fork over 200 bucks to terra alps or most wanted performance for a thermostat

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