• Don't miss out on all the fun! Register on our forums to post and have added features! Membership levels include a FREE membership tier.

2013 belt failures

M
Nov 30, 2008
32
6
8
2013 SP 162, EVO 215, cold air intake and down pipe, EVO fan, CPC 38/44 helix, CPC turbo 80-90 weights and primary spring. Day 1- Easy trail/break-in for about 10-15 miles then started riding harder with very short blips of WOT. At 19 miles was WOT for maybe 5 seconds and the belt snapped and literally disintegrated. I chalked it up to possibly inadequate belt break-in and installed another. Checked the alignment that night using the new 2013 bar (1.450" offset) and removed one 30 thou shim as the bar was a bit tight to the primary. Broke the next belt in for 25 miles then ran for 2 more days (50-60 miles) in the trees with poor visibility and hardly a chance for any WOT. Day 4 - at about 95 miles on the sled, WOT for 2-3 second blips up a fairly long pull and felt the belt start to go(vibration) so let off and then it let go. This time the belt was still there but the cogs were all gone. I checked the alignment again and it is within 30-60 thou which according to cat is good. It seems that it is only WOT that is the problem. Could it be alignment/torque when at WOT? Or heat?

Has anyone else had belt issues on the 13's? I ran my 12 for 500 miles last year with no issues and another guy just blew his first belt on his 12 with very similar setup to my 13 and he is around 800 miles.

Talking to local shop in Revy, was told he sells 5-10 082 belts per weekend so I assume there are some issues,
 

charlie99

Member
Lifetime Membership
Nov 27, 2007
268
8
18
44
SL
I had the same problem last weekend with my 2012 with 250 big chute.Exact same clutching you have just heavier weights. last year stock I blew one belt at 600 miles. This year I have a full vent kit on it also. And blew 2 belts and almost another in about 60 total miles could honestly say I didn't climb one hike without blowing a belt the rest of the time I just putted around.
 
D
Apr 6, 2009
1
3
3
This is the my first post in 10 years on snowest ,just so people know how pissed I AM.Had ,my sled in dealer 2 times last year to check alignament,they said it was OK . BLOW UP 3 Belts in 1300 miles,not good in my opinion.Had my sled out for the first time yesterday and blow a belt.LOVE THIS SLED but feel this is a problem.Tried of some people saying the 1100 does not have a problem with belts. I have mds clutching,174 track,evo 215 ,and other evo upgrades,just want to ride my sled and this is BS.
 

type_a_positive

Well-known member
Premium Member
Nov 27, 2007
392
70
28
Mongo Norway
Formula X-1.com did exstensive testing of the driveline on the 2012 4-stroke turbo 1100.

Their findings are published in this 85-page thread on HCS:

Driveline test with video

The essence of the testing is summed up in this post:

clutchweight said:
As a result of 5 months, many many hours of testing, hours of analyzing, many hours of making changes, 30 gallons of fuel, three blown belts, broken secondary rollers, costly sensors, working in between other jobs, here is the list of things found and the results.

RH side of the motor was low and back. Raised the motor up closer to perfect. No change in temps.

Found c/c to be 11.573". No change made as there was no way to adjust c/c distance without replacing TCL bracket. Unknown if replacement would bring c/c to spec.

Found secondary sheaves out of true (.012) caused from prior belt failures or heat cycles. Machined faces. No noticeable change in temps.

Noticed end of secondary moving downward under load. Installed torque stop. Reduced downward movement dramatically. No change in belt temps.

Also installed D & D Racing left rear Polly motor mount for additional support.

Replaced OEM Arctic Cat 082 belt with a Carlisle 144-4640 belt. immediate 61 degree reduction in belt temps. Drive and secondary temps also reduced.

Still noticed some movement at end of secondary. Changed jack shaft to a Belanger Racing Products first generation jack shaft. No change in secondary movement.

Installed a Micro Belmont large diameter jack shaft. Nearly all movement eliminated at end of secondary. No provision for reverse mechanism.

Installed EVO manifold and turbo exhaust wraps. Noticed a big decrease of radiant heat coming from under the hood.

Set clutch offset by running clutches without retaining hardware or shim washers to determine secondary float position. Recorded belt temp.

Moved secondary in from float position .040". Belt temp increased 25 degrees.

Moved secondary out from float position .040". Belt temp increased 25 degrees.

Installed Belanger Racing Products second generation jack shaft as it has a larger than OEM mid section diameter and has reverse provision.

Installed a Carlisle XS 822 belt. No change in belt temps. Clutch movable was 108 degrees and secondary was 115 degrees. Noticed a 3 horsepower increase at the jack shaft over the 144-4640 belt at the same ratios.

Free spinning, no load speed, created belt temps of 175 degrees. Full load at the same speed (1:1) only increased belt temps 5 degrees.

Installed a Precision Auto Research belt slip sensor to record belt rpm's. Math channels were added to record belt slippage. Very little (2%) slippage was detected. Clutches have good power transfer and react nicely to changes in load.

Installed a lighter secondary spring. Belt temps increased.

Installed a heaver secondary spring. Belt temps increased.


Checked overdrive of the XS 822 belt. Found it to be 15% with this c/c distance. With stock 22/37 gearing, top speed calculates out to 131 MPH.

Recommended belts for this sled have had as much as 24% overdrive.

We will be installing Autolite iridium spark plugs in this 1100 as they have produced an additional 3 hp gain in two of our two stroke race motors.

All things considered, the longer belt had the biggest influence in belt heat reduction. Heat radiated from within the hood is of great concern for all things under the hood, including the belt. Clutch movement was suspected as a high likelihood of short belt life. Anything that can be done to better align the clutches, and keep the clutches in alignment, should have positive belt life results.

Thanks to all that have contributed to this project.

This concludes the dyno phase of the test as we have a Polaris race sled to dyno and a new Arctic Cat Snopro to build for the MIRA races and the Soo 500.

We will start another thread to continue with field testing of this sled when we get snow.

Questions? Comments? Fire away!


I ended up with a new dalton secondary spring DPSS-G/S(same rate as stock, fewer coils for less binding), spacer and new secondary bearing from a 2012 proclimb 800 update kit, 1.450 offset, alot of venting and this jackshaft snubber to control the downward movement of the jackshaft(see videos in the HCS thread):

jackshaft snubber.JPG
 
Last edited:
E

Evolution Powersports

Well-known member
Nov 23, 2006
688
619
93
It sounds like your belts are bottoming out in the secondary. This is about the only thing I know of that would cause a belt to disintegrate with so few miles. Thanks to Type A Positive for his good work with his clutch research.
 
Last edited:
N

nosajlleb

Well-known member
Feb 19, 2010
708
189
43
Michigan
Followed clutchweights thread also and ended up having to replace both bearings in secondary (both were shot after season at stock boost) along with adding the gizzy he created. Have both clutches in getting balanced along with secondary post being cut to get to the new offset. That dalton spring is very hard to find right now. Funny thing is it looks like the TCL was made for clutchweights piece, Cat penny pinchers eliminated it prolly off of stock machines.

If your blowing belts how much movement is going on inside of chain case also with these crazy bearings? Might be worth a look for those who have blown belts.
 

lundracing

Well-known member
Lifetime Membership
Nov 14, 2011
588
125
43
45
Rolla, ND
Wow, That sucks, I ran my 12 all last year with no problems. Hope the updates don't screw things up.
 
M
Feb 27, 2010
345
142
43
This is the my first post in 10 years on snowest ,just so people know how pissed I AM.Had ,my sled in dealer 2 times last year to check alignament,they said it was OK . BLOW UP 3 Belts in 1300 miles,not good in my opinion.Had my sled out for the first time yesterday and blow a belt.LOVE THIS SLED but feel this is a problem.Tried of some people saying the 1100 does not have a problem with belts. I have mds clutching,174 track,evo 215 ,and other evo upgrades,just want to ride my sled and this is BS.

if your running a 174 and 200+hp and you haven't geared it down you well blow belts. my friend is running 17 top with his 162 3''. works way better
 

10003514

Well-known member
Premium Member
Dec 17, 2007
1,237
779
113
34
British Columbia
if your running a 174 and 200+hp and you haven't geared it down you well blow belts. my friend is running 17 top with his 162 3''. works way better

x2 on the gearing down, my buddies turbo nitro would blow 2 belts a day when he switched from a 153 to 162. Geared down problem solved.
 
J
Feb 27, 2011
76
8
8
Followed clutchweights thread also and ended up having to replace both bearings in secondary (both were shot after season at stock boost) along with adding the gizzy he created. Have both clutches in getting balanced along with secondary post being cut to get to the new offset. That dalton spring is very hard to find right now. Funny thing is it looks like the TCL was made for clutchweights piece, Cat penny pinchers eliminated it prolly off of stock machines.

If your blowing belts how much movement is going on inside of chain case also with these crazy bearings? Might be worth a look for those who have blown belts.
There is a machined edge INSIDE where the jackshaft goes into that needs to be .650 so the secondary sits on the jackshaft properly or the secondary could lock onto the shaft or the shaft could crack. Double check it!
 

damx

Well-known member
Lifetime Membership
Feb 13, 2011
1,836
1,177
113
Im having belt problem also, 7 belt 500 miles. Had it at 3 different dealers to check every thing out. All work done on warranty. Can't find any thing wrong, is what each place would say. Well to when looking at some post over on hcs seen a pic of the brake down of the secondary clutch. And seen the washers on eather side of the spring. I don't reamber havin those. Just ripped my clutch apart and sure enough, NO plastic washers. I never knew about them just seen a picture. But 3 different cat mechanics looked and took apparat my clutches and never noticed eather. Hope this helps I'm sure I had lots of binding.
 
M
Nov 30, 2008
32
6
8
It sounds like your belts are bottoming out in the secondary. This is about the only thing I know of that would cause a belt to disintegrate with so few miles. Thanks to Type A Positive for his good work with his clutch research.

What are all the changes from 2012 to 2013 in the secondary? The 2012 with exact same mods is not having the belt issues and my 2012 last year, ran wide open all the time and no belt problems. How do you stop the belt from bottoming out in the secondary? Does it make sense that the belt would be bottomed out in the secondary based on my mods and expected track speed?

Does anyone else have a possible solution to this problem? It is useless the way it is...not to mention very expensive.
 

evandaigneault

Well-known member
Lifetime Membership
Oct 13, 2008
566
51
28
40
Portland,OR
I ended up with a new dalton secondary spring DPSS-G/S(same rate as stock, fewer coils for less binding), spacer and new secondary bearing from a 2012 proclimb 800 update kit, 1.450 offset, alot of venting and this jackshaft snubber to control the downward movement of the jackshaft(see videos in the HCS thread):[/QUOTE]

Where do i get one of them thar jackshaft snubbers???
 

type_a_positive

Well-known member
Premium Member
Nov 27, 2007
392
70
28
Mongo Norway
This was Arctic Cats official statement regarding the incorporation of the clutch spacer (part # 0648-827) on the 2013 Proclimbs/XF:

"A plastic spacer has been added to the driven clutch to improve belt life when running at high speeds on all M and XF High Country models. The spacer forces the driven clutch to reach full-shift slightly before the drive clutch can reach fullshift, thus allowing for the clutches to maintain belt squeeze at all times to minimize slippage. This spacer can retrofit to 2012 models."


Regarding jackshaft snubbers:

spacer.JPG osp.jpg ftp2.jpg formulax-1.jpg
 

type_a_positive

Well-known member
Premium Member
Nov 27, 2007
392
70
28
Mongo Norway
Video of downward flexing of jackshaft (stock):


<iframe width="640" height="360" src="http://www.youtube.com/embed/T7sKj15VZaM?feature=player_embedded" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
 
Last edited:

UtahEdge

Well-known member
Premium Member
Sep 19, 2003
1,061
370
83
Syracuse, Utah
So before the updates I didnt have any blet problems. Am I going to have issues now that they put the spacer in when they did the updates?????
 
Premium Features