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The illustration clearly shows the arms/rollers do need need much force at engagement points of the 3 ramp.
DPG
DPG
pDrive CLUTCH... DISCUSSION... TUNING, CLICKERS, FLYWEIGHTS... PHOTOS AND VIDEOS.
- Thread starter mountainhorse
- Start date
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I've run both Thundershifters and HeelClickers against flyweight and TRA ramps. The Thundershifters & Heelclickers produced awesome hole shots but once in the midrange & top end no performance gains were achieved.
DPG
DPG
rilonjj,
It's taking me time to wrap my noodle around this clutch too.
I WAS thinking the same thing... until I did a couple of napkin drawings over breakfast today.
If the flyweight lays flatter (clicker 1) then centrifugal force is more pushing outward directly from the weight to the pivot pin... if the flyweight is tilted up more (clicker 5) then the centrifugal force is acting more to pivot the weight in its arc... once the flyweight contacts the roller... it will have more force pushing against that roller which will lower the engagement RPM.
An analogy... a kids merry-go-round (mgr) on the playground... if you were to lay flat on the floor of the mgr with your feet apart and planted against the poles, and spin it up... the pressure would be against your feet, perpendicular to the axle of the mgr. Now... if you were to lift your head, your head would want to tilt up and not push against your feet so much.
It will also have more force pushing against that roller as the flyweight swings out... and "load the motor more at a lower RPM.
Of note... this is not a feature that any other clutch enjoys.
In order to allow a consumer the ability to actually use the clicker... and not have to pry open the sheaves of the primary... clicker 1-5 would still not have the flyweight in contact with the roller with the engine off. ... The clicker only changes the inclination of flyweight... from rest through the maximum inclination of that flyweight at full clutch clutch-closing (when it reaches the stops).
I look at the clickers in what might be a funny way... the clicker acts to tilt the flyweight into or away from the 'stream' of centrifugal force.
Are the pDrive flyweights a true 'arc' or a progressive or regressive curve...or are those options going to be available.
Does anyone know of info on the web for pDrive flyweights that were used to tune last years 600-RS sleds equipped with the pDrive clutch??
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That seems to be on target from what little I know about the new Pdrive. Very well thought out.
On any of my Polaris sleds in the past, if I wanted to get my RPM back at elevation I had to pry open the clutch to change the weights.
This new one if a person wanted to change to a different cam profile it looks like it would come out pretty easy.
Really pretty excited to try it out.
On any of my Polaris sleds in the past, if I wanted to get my RPM back at elevation I had to pry open the clutch to change the weights.
This new one if a person wanted to change to a different cam profile it looks like it would come out pretty easy.
Really pretty excited to try it out.
Another thought......will changing clickers change the shift characteristics like it does on the tra?
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Hopefully not, that was one of my biggest complaints with the TRA clicker adjustments.
That would depend on the shape of the curve of the flyweight.... like I said above... a true 'arc' or a progressive or regressive curve
It would depend where on the curve the roller rests for a given sheave position.
Clutching is the definition of a complex simultaneous equation. :juggle:
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I've tried to get parts from the race department both sides of the border this season - I couldnt even get a broken...anything.
They are low on supplies and can't even keep up with the racers ordering them parts.
once the sleds are parked and atv season upon us, im hoping to get my hands on a primary clutch.
T
So Joe, What do you think of the concept for the clutch? I am thinking of getting a new sled and if I do I want DJ clutching no questions asked.
I am pretty sure Joe is really excited to get his fingers on one!!
Yep
Getting a good view of the parts... and piecing it together... it is very easy to understand... especially coming from a P85 background.
The 600 RS pDrive clutch didn't have clickers on it...or clicker pins to add weights to.
The clickers on this clutch seem like a whole new thing... and only loosely related to the ramp/arm system from before.
The clickers have a few things in common with the TRA... but not a direct correlation.
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That's true, but have they been running the clutch with clickers or not? That's the main thing I'm trying to understand. The rest of the clutch looks simple enough.
Clickers in one post.
I've started the video at the part with the clutch motion and the clicker operation
Basically... moving the clicker tilts the flyweight up from it's starting position more.
This will increase the centrifugal force on the flyweight sooner... that will lower engagement speed and lower max speed.
Adding weight to the clicker clamp pin will add weight to the heel... and affect loading the engine lower down in the RPM range.
There will be a learning curve for all used to the TRA design.
<iframe width="900" height="506" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/7-kf9KxiR54?start=267" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
I've started the video at the part with the clutch motion and the clicker operation
Basically... moving the clicker tilts the flyweight up from it's starting position more.
This will increase the centrifugal force on the flyweight sooner... that will lower engagement speed and lower max speed.
Adding weight to the clicker clamp pin will add weight to the heel... and affect loading the engine lower down in the RPM range.
There will be a learning curve for all used to the TRA design.
<iframe width="900" height="506" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/7-kf9KxiR54?start=267" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
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Looks like it will be a easy to tune setup.
Depending on what the aftermarket does for flyweight profiles (if it will even prove necessary to change??), it may be cheaper and just as effective to tweak clutching to your liking with secondary changes...helix and/or spring to make the system do what you want.
I have always liked the QRS. The issue with floating to keep proper alignment should no longer be an issue as the new primary has straight sheaves rather than the progressive (12-14*) sheave angle of the TRA that did not allow for proper alignment throughout the shift without the secondary moving.
Depending on what the aftermarket does for flyweight profiles (if it will even prove necessary to change??), it may be cheaper and just as effective to tweak clutching to your liking with secondary changes...helix and/or spring to make the system do what you want.
I have always liked the QRS. The issue with floating to keep proper alignment should no longer be an issue as the new primary has straight sheaves rather than the progressive (12-14*) sheave angle of the TRA that did not allow for proper alignment throughout the shift without the secondary moving.
Howdy, for me the clutch stirs up happy emotions that caused me to not fall asleep right away for a few nights. Not falling asleep because of thinking about profile curves and...testing.
I hope BRP has a bigger variety of primary clutch springs than the 4 they have right now.
170/300
170/350
170/400
200/380 (600rs)
Here is a video that Dave Norona put together. Not sure how many of you have seen it but.....
http://youtu.be/HjBlC5KjJYE
http://youtu.be/HjBlC5KjJYE
Any idea if they sized their springs so they will interchange with Poo and Cat springs?
I know... I'm probably being way too optimistic even thinking of that possibility.
Buddy...from what i seen was the primary clutch spring is almost as big of diameter as the secondary spring. I've not had one in my hands to measure the diameter but man that would be "tres kewl" if cat/poo/yammy fit the dooey. I suspect the mindset of Dooey there is not a chinese chance other brand (oem) springs will fit the dooey
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S
No they haven't! I Held a spring from a RS-sled and it is like Joe said closer to a Team secondary spring in size than the old TRA or any of the other mfg's primary springs.
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