Powering PIDD from capacitor

TimG · Dec 1, 2018

Is it reasonable to power the PIDD from a capacitor? I know there’s a kit to do it with a small battery, but I’m not crazy about that idea. It’s another thing to keep an eye on. If you forget it on overnight, it could wreck the battery. It adds weight. It costs money.

A capacitor would keep it on when you shift into reverse or stop for a minute. If it was wired so the gauge had keyed power, that would work well. If you forgot it on overnight, it wouldn’t matter.

Could it be wired into an existing capacitor on the sled, i.e. fuel pump capacitor?

Does anybody have a service manual for the 850 so a guy could curl up by the fire and study the wiring diagram? I asked my dealer for the electronic version of the service manual, and they looked into it and said it doesn’t exist yet.

Maybe this is a terrible idea- please let me know.

volcano buster · Dec 1, 2018

I'm curious to see what you find out.

My understanding of using a capacitor is best for max release of energy such as the SHOT start on the Doo. I'm not sure how they handle a slow release like you are describing. I would also want to know how to ensure it is fully discharged before you go putting your fingers in there to do something...

gtwitch · Dec 1, 2018

As a retired electrical engineer, I had to look at this possible solution of using an ultra capacitor to do this job and with some study I concluded that with the largest capacitor I could find that was physically size acceptable, I could get only about 4 min of on time as the PIDD draws about 400 ma. For most of the time this would be OK, but if you wanted to add way points or do other things on the trail, the engine would still have to keep running. So, I decided on a battery pack using 4- 18650 tabbed lithium cells and modified the wire loom to accept the battery and keep it charged while running and I now have well over an hour with the engine not running! Why this way? just my choice I guess.
gtwitch in wyoming

TimG · Dec 1, 2018

Thanks for the reply! That’s exactly what I was looking for! How do you have it wired? Does it turn on and off with the key? Did you just get 4 rechargeable 18650 cells?

gtwitch · Dec 1, 2018

You will need to visit a dealer and get a copy of the hood wire loom diagram for a MY 18 RMK AXYS with a factory installed PIDD, as I cannot find anywhere on line that when I try and print this document that it comes off clear enough to read the wire colors. the Grey wire with the red tracer is the key wire where you tie in and you need a 6 amp diode to avoid back feed into main wireing and a fuse holder with 7 or 10 amp fuse on the battery positive lead. My whole installation is installed and attached to the under side of the hood, thus you are now able to take the hood off and take it in the house to update with maps and other.
gtwitch in wyoming

richracer1 · Dec 1, 2018

I don't know if this will help, but this is from my 2017 Service manual.

Tchetek · Dec 5, 2018

gtwitch said:
You will need to visit a dealer and get a copy of the hood wire loom diagram for a MY 18 RMK AXYS with a factory installed PIDD, as I cannot find anywhere on line that when I try and print this document that it comes off clear enough to read the wire colors. the Grey wire with the red tracer is the key wire where you tie in and you need a 6 amp diode to avoid back feed into main wireing and a fuse holder with 7 or 10 amp fuse on the battery positive lead. My whole installation is installed and attached to the under side of the hood, thus you are now able to take the hood off and take it in the house to update with maps and other.
gtwitch in wyoming

is there a reason not to just attach the battery to the Gauge power test port?

Killer Time Racing · Dec 6, 2018

Mine all stay on until the battery runs dead. Says turn the key off if left on .

Are you guys adding the guage and then trying to power it ? Doesn't it just hook up to the sled and work like a factory installed one ?

richracer1 · Dec 6, 2018

Tchetek said:
is there a reason not to just attach the battery to the Gauge power test port?

The PIDD will stay on regardless of the position the key is in.

TimG · Dec 6, 2018

Killer Time Racing said:
Mine all stay on until the battery runs dead. Says turn the key off if left on .

Are you guys adding the guage and then trying to power it ? Doesn't it just hook up to the sled and work like a factory installed one ?

Without a battery, it reboots every time you shut the sled off and restart it. Then it takes a while to re-acquire the satellite signal for the GPS. This also happens when you shift into reverse. So you end up with gaps in your GPS track. This could be miserable if you were trying to follow your track back in a storm or something like that.

I also like to know what my engine temp is before pinning it to get unstuck. It takes the gauge a while to boot up and show it.

TimG · Dec 6, 2018

gtwitch said:
You will need to visit a dealer and get a copy of the hood wire loom diagram for a MY 18 RMK AXYS with a factory installed PIDD, as I cannot find anywhere on line that when I try and print this document that it comes off clear enough to read the wire colors. the Grey wire with the red tracer is the key wire where you tie in and you need a 6 amp diode to avoid back feed into main wireing and a fuse holder with 7 or 10 amp fuse on the battery positive lead. My whole installation is installed and attached to the under side of the hood, thus you are now able to take the hood off and take it in the house to update with maps and other.
gtwitch in wyoming

This is awesome info. Thanks for sharing. I was going to PM you, but I thought everyone could benefit if you care to share more details. Where do you put the diode? What battery pack did you buy? Does it have discharge protection? Thanks again!

gtwitch · Dec 7, 2018

had to build my own pack using 4 18650 Tabbed cells ( I bought name brand cells Panasonic 3300 mah with tabs on them and was able to find the stacking plastic holders that you can slide the cells into and then solder tabs together. I was able to find on line the plastic stacking holders and you put the cells into these holders and slide them together and then solder the cell tabs in place then cell pack hooked to fuse holder and then to a female to male 2 pin plug set in order to unplug the battery pack from hood installation. I will try and find the plug set part # and the fuse holder # that I purchased and send you a copy of the wiring diagram. need your mail if you want to share info.
gtwitch@uwyo.edu

TimG · Dec 12, 2018

I e-mailed you. Eagerly awaiting your reply. Thanks.

off trail mike · Dec 12, 2018

Gtwitch

Does this sound right? .....

1) You are using Grey wire with the red tracer on the key to feed Li-Ion battery with +ve power. It is fused at 6+ amps.
2) The diode is somewhere between key wire and battery to stop back-feeding main harness when engine off
3) You attach li-ion battery +ve to red/dk green (PIDD power feed) which is connected to gray/red wire from key.

Seems straight forward.

I only have 2 questions

1. What kind of diode are you using? I see a pile of them on Newark Electronics. I see this one, which seems to fit the bill but I'm no wiz on diodes....might have slept through that e-class....30 years ago...lol

https://www.newark.com/nte-electronics/gi756/standard-diode-6a-600v-axial/dp/33C4747

2. Did you install some kind of switch to turn off PIDD, or simply let battery die when finished riding. I thought it was not recommended to fully drain Li-Ion batteries, but not sure if that ever happens with the 18650 batteries as they may have internal protection which prevents this.

Really liking this thread...Thanks in advance

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Powering PIDD from capacitor

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