Arctic Cat 2018?

89sandman · Dec 4, 2016

Where has it been proven that the new Doo is any better than the Cat? By Doo's marketing people? Has anyone actually had these sleds in the steep and deep together for longer than a couple of hours? Seems the Doo is having some teething problems and a motor that is totally unproven. Looks like Doo is relying on a bigger engine just to hang with the competition.

I owned a 11 and 15 Pro and a 13 Xm and IMHO my 16 Cat is better than any of them. Have only rode an Axys twice and never even seen a new Doo so I can't comment on it. Looking forward to riding with the Axys this year, don't know anyone who bought the new Doo but hope to see one on the hill and spend some time with all 3 in the trees together on the same day and same conditions.

Vern · Dec 4, 2016

I've found it amusing all year on how many people "know" how awesome and reliable the new doo will be when until recently most people haven't even seen one in person, let alone put any miles on one.

scratley · Dec 5, 2016

Vern said:
I've found it amusing all year on how many people "know" how awesome and reliable the new doo will be when until recently most people haven't even seen one in person, let alone put any miles on one.

Spent 8 hrs on 850 yesterday,was an x model with full Raptor setup, Ace rear skid and 280 track, so not apples to apples. Sled is nice and crisp off the bottom, nice grunt down low, mid and top seem similar to the 800. We had 4 other 800 doos with so was easy to compare. Handling wise I still prefer my 16 cat, but I did fell comfortable on it. It is a lot better than the xm. Did not have my sled with so tough to do a side by side comparison. Could use some toe holds as I found myself jumping to one side. Its a bit more predictable once on its side but does seem to hit a spot where it stops coming over. All in all I liked it. Power wise I was expecting more. should be a runner with boost, which this sled will have in the next week.

Vern · Dec 5, 2016

scratley said:
Spent 8 hrs on 850 yesterday,was an x model with full Raptor setup, Ace rear skid and 280 track, so not apples to apples. Sled is nice and crisp off the bottom, nice grunt down low, mid and top seem similar to the 800. We had 4 other 800 doos with so was easy to compare. Handling wise I still prefer my 16 cat, but I did fell comfortable on it. It is a lot better than the xm. Did not have my sled with so tough to do a side by side comparison. Could use some toe holds as I found myself jumping to one side. Its a bit more predictable once on its side but does seem to hit a spot where it stops coming over. All in all I liked it. Power wise I was expecting more. should be a runner with boost, which this sled will have in the next week.

I'm sure they'll be great sleds, especially once all the first year bugs are worked out which seem to be popping up now people are getting some miles on them. However, my comment was in reference to all the folks who have been touting it as the best sled to hit the snow since it's release last spring without having even slung a leg over one. Ya some folks demod them but nobody's put enough miles on them to accurately claim any sort of longevity.

scratley · Dec 5, 2016

Vern said:
I'm sure they'll be great sleds, especially once all the first year bugs are worked out which seem to be popping up now people are getting some miles on them. However, my comment was in reference to all the folks who have been touting it as the best sled to hit the snow since it's release last spring without having even slung a leg over one. Ya some folks demod them but nobody's put enough miles on them to accurately claim any sort of longevity.

I agree, but that's with any brand. You will always have your brand loyal that no matter what, it's the best thing since sliced bread. I have owned all but Polaris. They all have there 1st year problems it seems. Look at the 12 Proclimb. But I see your point with the bandwagon, it worked for Doo though. I'm sure they sold a pile of them. I don't see any issues with the motor except it could use some more juice on top. Third party testing gives the motor double life span as Polaris. That's pretty good. They had almost zero failure to 5k. Polaris was like 45% failure.

Scott · Dec 5, 2016

I see Yamaha going to a full dedicated snow bike program and letting cat have (ahem ditching) their sleds back.
If that happens, Cat will be gone fishing like they did in the mid 80s.

Then there will be just two OEM sled makers. NOT what the industry really needs to thrive.

Vern · Dec 5, 2016

scratley said:
I agree, but that's with any brand. You will always have your brand loyal that no matter what, it's the best thing since sliced bread. I have owned all but Polaris. They all have there 1st year problems it seems. Look at the 12 Proclimb. But I see your point with the bandwagon, it worked for Doo though. I'm sure they sold a pile of them. I don't see any issues with the motor except it could use some more juice on top. Third party testing gives the motor double life span as Polaris. That's pretty good. They had almost zero failure to 5k. Polaris was like 45% failure.

I agree, I find it amusing from any brand when something new comes out and people already know all about it with no experience. The whole die hard brand loyalty thing in itself is amusing to me, I mean ya, everyone's gonna prefer one or the other but all the my way or nothing mentality is silly. I myself have been loyal to cat for the past 10 years due to personal experience, polaris left a bad taste in my mouth long ago as far as reliability goes and I can't get used to the laydown steering on the doo. To each his own. Not sure if polaris is a good benchmark to use for engine longevity? but hopefully the 850 will prove to be solid.

To get back on topic, as it's already been stated I believe the biggest thing cat needs to work on is marketing. It seems there is alot of folks now days that actually have an open mind that try the cats and actually prefer them to the other brands. So the product is fine, they just gotta figure out how to get the word out. Seems they tend to focus more on the flatland/sno cross side of things and could care less about promoting the mtn sleds. They've been #1 in the mtns before so I'm sure there's someone around there that knows what they're doin, unless they all got fired during the whole shutting down dealers spree.

bdcat162 · Dec 5, 2016

That would be awesome. Sure hope that 850+ engine with efficiency comes into the picture as well as weight reductions to a point without sacrificing durability. Belt drive would be sick.

bdcat162 · Dec 5, 2016

I am a brand loyal Arctic Cat rider, simply saying you can't deny that 25lb lighter, 10 more hp, 30% more responsive, and even more fuel and oil efficient than the XM isn't appealing on the skidoo. Durability is the only thing that is yet to be tested on the doo. 4/5 ski doo riders I ride with all got the new Gen4 165. Will see how it compares to 17 MC 162. Will run them side by side and see how they hold up.

goridedoo · Dec 5, 2016

Scott said:
I see Yamaha going to a full dedicated snow bike program and letting cat have (ahem ditching) their sleds back.
If that happens, Cat will be gone fishing like they did in the mid 80s.

Then there will be just two OEM sled makers. NOT what the industry really needs to thrive.

Speaking of snowbikes... What happened to the Cat snowbike that is not Cat anything? Maybe they realized that they were "developing" something that has already been available for 5 years. I just dont get it. Not even a little. Who is gonna buy a single purpose-"non purpose" built snow bike that costs as much as a bike and a conversion kit.

scratley · Dec 5, 2016

ShaunBecker said:
I am a brand loyal Arctic Cat rider, simply saying you can't deny that 25lb lighter, 10 more hp, 30% more responsive, and even more fuel and oil efficient than the XM isn't appealing on the skidoo. Durability is the only thing that is yet to be tested on the doo. 4/5 ski doo riders I ride with all got the new Gen4 165. Will see how it compares to 17 MC 162. Will run them side by side and see how they hold up.

850 will get you out of the hole, but you will catch it

nosajlleb · Dec 6, 2016

Scott said:
I see Yamaha going to a full dedicated snow bike program and letting cat have (ahem ditching) their sleds back.
If that happens, Cat will be gone fishing like they did in the mid 80s.

Then there will be just two OEM sled makers. NOT what the industry really needs to thrive.

Yamaha is officially an engine provider. That was revealed last summer. There not interested in snowmobiles because its a loss on their profit sheets. They could never build a lightweight workable snowmobile so jumping into the snow bike world would be hilarious to watch. They would be better selling the YZ or whatever it is now and telling peeps to head to timbersled for the conversion kit.

hd4rob · Dec 6, 2016

goridedoo said:
Speaking of snowbikes... What happened to the Cat snowbike that is not Cat anything? Maybe they realized that they were "developing" something that has already been available for 5 years. I just dont get it. Not even a little. Who is gonna buy a single purpose-"non purpose" built snow bike that costs as much as a bike and a conversion kit.

They are making a kit that will still be dual purpose, wheels will come with it, but also legal to ride in all states. Most snowmobile trails or use agreements are for snowmobiles, which need a left handed brake, headlight, and a tail light.
All of these have been changed, so that the SVX will be a license-able snow vehicle. By the way, they developed the rear skid and the front ski and mount if you want to check the patents, the prototype ran a narrowed and shortened powerclaw track. Ever think that they are selling the kit in agreement with Camso because it will be more available to the masses. Funny how Polaris doesn't call the it the Polaris Timbersled.

goridedoo · Dec 6, 2016

Was not aware that it was going to be sold with dirtbike parts as well. Stupid, regardless.

goridedoo · Jan 25, 2017

Jaynelson said:
Same prediction as last year...going broke.

Close enough?

jakey-boy · Jan 25, 2017

goridedoo said:
Close enough?

Looks to me like the exact opposite. Just became the deepest pocketed company in the industry. Not to mention gained access to all sorts of patented technologies.

goridedoo · Jan 25, 2017

jakey-boy said:
Looks to me like the exact opposite. Just became the deepest pocketed company in the industry. Not to mention gained access to all sorts of patented technologies.

You are correct but they became that because they could no longer stand on their own feet financially. Good for them though, I would sure think it will be a good thing.

Calvin42 · Jan 25, 2017

One huge thing Cat needs to work on besides those mentioned above, is expanding their dealer network. Dealers seem few and far between now a days and Cat was little or no help to them. Cat made them take so many sleds that they knew they could never sell, then have to discount them to a point of giving them away. Not a good business model. Then going to a complete new sled line in 2012 and all the problems that came with that, they're lucky they were able to weather the storm without going under. Hopefully with Textron and some new money, technologies and design, they can get back in the game. Not to say they haven't had some successes in the past, but there is a reason they are number #3. That won't change over night. However, with them producing their own engine and bringing in new technologies, they will stand a better chance of competing with Poo and Doo. Should be an interesting year.

TRUEBLUEMAX · Jan 25, 2017

goridedoo said:
You are correct but they became that because they could no longer stand on their own feet financially. Good for them though, I would sure think it will be a good thing.

Many companies are acquired that are still very capable of existing. Whether this was the case with cat or not I don't know but unless you have insider info it's hard to accurately make such a statement.

goridedoo · Jan 25, 2017

Yeah I have no idea, just giving you guys chit. But I do know that I dont remember the last time I saw a cat atv or utv anywhere but a showroom floor and sled sales are certainly behind the other 2. Dealers have been dropping like flys around here as well.

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