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spring force / pin weight question 800r

C
Jan 26, 2002
743
384
63
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Alaska
just a quick question..

what do you think is better and WHY?

a higher finishing force on the spring and less pin weight....

or

a lower finishing force on the spring and more pin weight?

if they both can be made to reach a desired rpm and constant rpms?

just curious? i would have called dj, but he is still on vacation.

also, what do you mean when you say..."my sled likes heavier weight," or "my sled likes clicker 5" or whatever? as long as the shift is straight and maintains rpm. as long as it backshifts good.


thanks, the reason i ask.......

here is my alaska setup so far......07 800r 151 w/ tra3 and no ring gear.
djs helix ??on angles
160-350 primary spring
dalton adj pins at 17g
stock secondary spring
clicker 6 to get 8400 tach rpms

i am thinking to pull 3 grams out of the pins and run at clicker 4 at 8300 tach rpms


any suggestions? from what ive read, these numbers dont really seem right for running 2-4k altitude
 
S

SylvanLaker

Well-known member
Nov 26, 2007
687
96
28
47
Sylvan Lake, AB. Canada
Hmmmm... I think your a little backwards here, correct me if I'm wrong though.

More weight creates more shift force which makes it shift out further lowering your RPM

More final spring force holds the shift force back increasing RPM.

So putting lighter weights with a stiffer spring will bring up your RPM big time.. As both bring up RPM. The motor needs to be run at around 8200 RPM. (As I've seen from dynos) Remember if you have a lighter final spring force and lighter weights you will have less piching effect on the belt and the secondary can shift up faster and it will slip more. (More heat) Also I beleive as the high ratio shift force comes into play (when the belt starts dropping in the secondary) The primary will control it less with it set up like this..

I think you meant to say Should I run a high final spring rate with heavier pin weight or run a lighter final sping rate and lighter pin weights.. right?

So My reccomendation and what I am gonna do to mine is this..

The lower the clicker the better the upshift and track speed, so It seems you are in a high clicker as you are trying to acheive more RPM. Your primary spring of 160-350 is not bad the 350 will give you good belt pinch and reduce slip. But a 130-350 has a nicer engagement speed. (my reccomemdation) When you have added final spring tension you need to add pin weight as the stiffer spring is holding back the shift and the weight will counter act this.

So run your 16-350 but instead of removing 3 grams I'd be adding weight (not sure how much but someone I'm sure can get you close) By adding weight you'll counter act the spring and bring down the RPM's to 8200. You want to add enough weight so you can lower the clickers giving the roller arm a steeper ramp to climb (faster upshift) Shoot for clicker 2.. I hope this helped. Good luck:beer;
 
C
Jan 26, 2002
743
384
63
46
Alaska
by adding weight i would be bringing down the rpms, the problem is, i want my rpms higher, so i can click down a couple. i would like to get to 4.

this is all going off of the fact that i assume my tach is 200 high, any way to tell for sure. 8400 will give me 8200 on the motor


thanks for the suggestion, any more?
 

winter brew

Premium Member
Lifetime Membership
Nov 26, 2007
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LakeTapps, Wa.
by adding weight i would be bringing down the rpms, the problem is, i want my rpms higher, so i can click down a couple. i would like to get to 4.

this is all going off of the fact that i assume my tach is 200 high, any way to tell for sure. 8400 will give me 8200 on the motor


thanks for the suggestion, any more?

JFYI, my '07 tach ready identical to my Avenger. IMHO the '07 800R with the stock ramps likes the higher clickers, 4-5 seems to be the sweet spot as far as low speed response and top-end shift. Run as much weight as possible and run the higher clicker and see if it works better for you.
 
S

SylvanLaker

Well-known member
Nov 26, 2007
687
96
28
47
Sylvan Lake, AB. Canada
Do you have the 160-350 spring im there already? I thought you were going from the stock 320 to the 350. If you already have the 350 in the primary, then yah you don't need to add pin weight to counteract the spring. If you are pulling 8400 in clicker 6 with that spring, you will need to remove pin weight yes... and then drop clickers. you should always be shooting for clicker 3 or lower. ALWAYS!! Even 4 is too high. And I'm not so sure your tack is off that much, people always say that but we have checked many including motorcycles against dynomometer tachs and they are usually not that bad. Shoot for 8200.. Talk to Al at the sled shed in Revelstoke, man that guy knows everything about this stuff..
 
U
Nov 29, 2007
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clicker settings

my 07 likes the higher clicker settings 4,5,6 Dave you can attest to that you rode with us at turtle last year I had the Blue adr 151.
 
N

Nikolai

ACCOUNT CLOSED
Apr 17, 2002
1,267
141
63
Eagle River, AK
More weight with a heavy finishing rate. My 800 rev used the 200/380 spring and I never went through a belt in the 3 years I had it. I tried the lighter summit spring setup and hated it. Performance on the hill was way better with the stiffer spring. FYI, you want to tune for clicker 2. The stiffer spring will engage later but you have mega clamping force on shift out and no chance of slipping. I tried TONS of different setups in my doo and this was the only one that didn't leave black residue on the primary. Just my .02
 
S

SylvanLaker

Well-known member
Nov 26, 2007
687
96
28
47
Sylvan Lake, AB. Canada
my 07 likes the higher clicker settings 4,5,6 Dave you can attest to that you rode with us at turtle last year I had the Blue adr 151.

Yah your sled ran good, doesn't mean clickers 4-6 are where you should run it. You upshift must have been slow to respond... Even with heavy weight it has to climb the more tilted ramps. Hows everything been going? Been out much this year??
 
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