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2016 Yamaha YZ450FX Super Hero Builds - CMX - Yeti - TS

philsummers21

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Would love to test these 3 kits out or at least the yeti. I have a 16 TS LT with a 141 2.5 CE and tss. But frankly the snow sucks this late in the year....
 

Hawkster

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Nice write up , the Yeti ski is known for the darting in those conditions and it's to bad Toby did not have TS skis for that condition because you would of had a lot more fun .

The machines have to work a lot harder to push that ski in the condition that you described . And once you notice that you will realize how much any deep center heel ski hinders the machine , in those conditions .

The Yeti is an extreme ski and is absolutely amazing in powder and also rails the hard packed trails like a slot car .

The option of skis is a great idea , your gonna need more than one if you want to get the best out of each ride .
 
D

DriftDiver8

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Nice write up , the Yeti ski is known for the darting in those conditions and it's to bad Toby did not have TS skis for that condition because you would of had a lot more fun .

The machines have to work a lot harder to push that ski in the condition that you described . And once you notice that you will realize how much any deep center heel ski hinders the machine , in those conditions .

The Yeti is an extreme ski and is absolutely amazing in powder and also rails the hard packed trails like a slot car .

The option of skis is a great idea , your gonna need more than one if you want to get the best out of each ride .

Out of curiosity, what is required to put a Timbersled ski on a Yeti kit? Do you need the entire Timbersled front end, or can you adapt just the ski to the Yeti front end?
 

Hawkster

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Out of curiosity, what is required to put a Timbersled ski on a Yeti kit? Do you need the entire Timbersled front end, or can you adapt just the ski to the Yeti front end?

The Yeti ski goes on the TS spindle while still using the TS rubber puck and yeti bolt .
So in reverse order you would need the Yeti rubber puck and TS bolt to put the TS ski on the Yeti spindle .

Rumor was that Yeti made their own rubber puck for those wanting to use the TS ski on their set up without using the TS puck , Rumor ?

Yeti probably can answer that question a bit better .

So far I have 5 different skis , 2 sit in the rafters but the only real difference is the bolt lengths , otherwise when it comes down to it they all pretty much have the same rule of thumb , thankfully .
 

tillbuilt

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Toby,

AWESOME thread!!

The shocks look great... I know that Jake at Raptor works hard on his products... good to see this effort out there.

On the RSS... looks Tight fulcrum point on the lower RSS eye (close to the chassis pivot) ... what is the spring rate on the RSS Spring?

What was the NET added weight (what was added minus what was taken off) for the RSS?

Thank you for the kind compliments!!!!

It may have been the camera angle, but there is lots of clearance for the RRS. I do not know the spring rate of the RRS spring. It is stout!!!! The spring is made to support the weight, but it is designed to complement the ride.

Ride review coming. It is a very nice addition to the kit.

I am sorry, I did not do a weight test when I installed the RRS. I was so excited I forgot. The RRS is very small and the difference in components are minimal. I would say it would add no more than 2 lbs.
 

tillbuilt

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got the call from toby till asking if i wanted to demo the yeti and cmxbk. meet at jones pass, co (aka death on a stick) at 8am today 4/8/2016. the 2016 ts build (the joker) would not be available as there would only be 3 of us and toby was planning to work on the fuel map for his aerocharged yz450f. not a deal breaker by any means as i have been hoping to throw a leg over both the yeti and cmxbk this season to see how they compared to each other and also to my rig. for reference, i have a 2015 ts lt hooked to a 2014 yz450f with engine and chassis mods. i'm sure the 2016 ts has advantages over my 2015 but i feel my rig is a strong runner and a reasonable point of reference regarding the ts kit.

the conditions:

early morning crust from last night's freeze. horrible, horrible, and horrible. gratefully, i had not yet ridden a snowbike ever in these conditions. during the transition from winter to spring, i never ride early morning because i know how bad it sucked for snowmobiles. today, riding down the trail from the parking lot, it was hard packed but not much different from other hard pack during the winter. once it opened up into the first meadow, and this crazy "crust darting" started, the unpredictability made riding either of these machines zero fun. riding down a paved street would have been more fun. seriously. as the temps warmed up, combined with suspension adjustments, things got better and i was able to attempt to make reasonable comparisons.

the yeti:

i started out on the yeti. toby had just installed the rrs strut. it motored down the hardpacked trail well. the ski held it's line. got to the first meadow with crust and almost went over the bars several times. major darting. when i switched to the cmxbk, although still some darting, nowhere near as bad. we determined that the rrs installed length (which is adjustable) was a bit long. this increased ski pressure making the darting much more pronounced. we adjusted the rrs to full soft and raised the forks in the triple clamps and the darting became "manageable" (similar to the cmxbk). i would note that shifting your weight towards the rear of the seat also noticeably lessened ski pressure.

yeti ski: i have been one of those guys wanting a yeti ski. they may be the bomb in powder but for me it was nasty scary in these conditions. speed didn't matter. i will say toby and his right hand man steve seemed more comfortable with the darting, which i'm guessing is from experience but i can tell you, if you put a newbie on this ski in these conditions, it would be a problem, as in lawsuit problem. i also noticed (after fighting it for an hour or so) that in these conditions the ski wants to run uphill when sidehilling or turning around on an incline. once i figured this out, it made turning on crust easier as you weren't always fighting it. it was a disappointment not to be able to run this ski in softer snow but it is what it is.

yeti track: there is a reason for the maxtrax II for 2017. in today's conditions, the original maxtrax inspired little confidence as the lugs constantly folded over or slid-out in situations where serious throttle was required. hopefully the maxtrax II has a better design/durometer that makes it better in conditions like today but doesn't sacrifice too much performance in powder.


yeti performance: again, hard to tell in these conditions but there was one hardpacked hill that, when we climbed it, it appeared the yeti generated more mph speed than the cmxbk. yeti's claim of being able to pull 1 higher gear than the competition may have some merit at least in these conditions. suspension worked well and the small hits and compressions were handled easily. there wasn't anything i noticed, while riding, that i would have concerns about. i would also add that seeing a yeti up close for the first time, it is, in fact, a mechanized work of art; well done.

the cmxbk:

(for the cmxbk ski and track performance, see paragraphs above as this rig was equipped with the yeti ski and original maxtrax track and both performed the same on either machine.)

cmxbk performance: the cmxbk felt very good overall. i expected this as i have had experience with cmx in the past. mark and company take major pride in whatever they produce. i had the chance to jump this kit today over a windlip. the landing was fairly hard and when i went bigger, my ankles hurt a little. in fairness, my ankles are bad and for someone with "good" ankles, this may not be an issue. even though the solid strut may give up some points on big air hits, it was competitive without a doubt under all other conditions today. i did not like how the cover for the belt drive forced my right foot forward. i like to ride with the balls of my feet on the pegs and this was not possible with a size 11 boot. also, it should be noted that toby broke the belt on this kit when he landed after sending it off the windlip. although disappointed, he did say that he had 40 plus hard hours on the kit/belt. now, i have had my share of belt drives and broken belts. shock loading, at least the way i ride, is a frequent occurrence and that makes me nervous about rolling a belt drive. there is no denying the performance gains with a belt drive system, but i have never broken a chain. not saying it can't be done...just sayin'. in fairness to the cmxbk, once the belt broke, we stopped jumping the yeti as well. my gut feeling tells me if you shock load the yeti, it too will break. seeing that they are offering a bigger belt drive system for 2017 could indicate some truth to this.

to wrap things up, i had to get out on my ts kit to see how bad the darting would be on the ts ski. unfortunately, toby and company had to leave so i went solo. when i got to the "meadow of death" my ts ski did not dart at all. i smiled again as i wicked the throttle and started riding how i normally ride. before the yeti faithful throws shade at me, i'm sure the snow had softened up some, but less than 1 hour before, the darting was still noticeable on the yeti ski when we were rolling back to the parking lot. it would have been great to have the yeti and cmxbk there to compare but again, it is what it is. after experiencing this, i'm feeling there is an argument to owning 2 different skis, assuming the yeti is better in powder. i rode everywhere we rode earlier and i gotta say, my 2015 ts setup worked well. i knew performance-wise, it would be as good or maybe better in some areas because of the mods and setup but i was truly surprised that in some of the more "funky" situations, it was rock and roll. good times. i don't think you could go wrong buying any of the big 3 - yeti, cmxbk, or ts. from what i experienced today, and from what i've been reading, no clear front runner; at least for for 2016. try to ride them all but if you can't, buying any of the big 3 won't be a disappointment imho. still hoping to throw a leg over a mototrax (sooner than later) and a camso (?).

thanks again to toby till for the opportunity. if he posts my video "documentary" from today, hopefully i don't come off as too big of a momo....:cool:

jeff


Here is the video clip from Jeff's ride. Sorry for the low volume. I only get one shot at the interview, and I am not a professional video guy!!! I am just documenting what I can with a phone.



This was the first day for riding the kits with total thaw and freeze conditions. It was not fun and I would never choose to ride in these conditions, but I want you all to know how they preform in the powder and in the frozen.

I will be the first one to admit that I did not want to be on the Yeti Ski on this day!!!! It is the first, and only time I can say that. I have loved the ski on every other day I have ridden it this entire season. It would grab a hard rut, and even try to climb up hill. You would have to hold the bars with force when sidehilling just to keep a straight line. After the sun softens up the top layer and bakes the frozen top a little, the ski is back to normal and I could rip with ease.

In the spring time conditions where you have top layer thaw and cold night freeze, I will not ride first thing in the morning. I will sit back and leisurely enjoy my breakfast and coffee until the sun softens up the top and I can enjoy my afternoon ride. We can ride till 7:00PM now. There is no hurry to get started at the crack of dawn any more.

Thank you for your time Jeff!!!!!!
 

WingNutRacing

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Hmm?

I guess my question was,,,,,, could a guy take the TSS and put it on a CMX, or take the RSS and put it on his T-sled...... or,,,, are the fixed strut lengths between the different manufacturers too far off? ??
 

tillbuilt

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Saw a Yeti 129 mounted on a 2015 KTM 450 SX-f in person at Kurt's Polaris in Seeley.

IMPRESSIVE.

Wait until you ride one!!!! I have been riding snow bikes with my best friend and his brother for 4 seasons now, and we are all at the same skill level. The Yeti, Ironman bike earned the new nickname of the "Ferrari", on Saturday. For the last three rides I have been so much faster in the trees, that it has become a noticeable advantage, even to my regular crew. When I ride one of the other bikes we are all hanging together and I do not have to stop and wait much, but when I am on the Yeti I have to wait for them some. I even tested this theory and rode Superman on Sunday. This is a 2015 Yamaha YX450F AeroCharger turbo bike equipped with a 2016 TS SX120 and TSS, with a Yeti Front end built the same as the other super heroes and weighs 333lbs. At our regular stopping intervals i was only about half the distance in front of them compared to when I ride Ironman.


The light weight and responsive handling of the Yeti is IMPRESSIVE!!!!



.
 

Scott

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Which ski do you like better?

I see people trading their "other" kit skis for the Simmons ski.
 

Hawkster

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I have had 33 days on the Yeti ski that have been better than the Simmons ski, and 2 days that I would have rather had the Simmons ski.

That is funny !

When it's good it's reeeaaaaallllll good but when it goes bad one has to stop and wonder is it really worth the AZZ kicking to even live another day :face-icon-small-hap
 
B

brojoe

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There was a lot of good info on the kits, but how did the new Yamaha YZ450FX work out with the WR transmission? Was the gearing correct or was there lots of shifting?

I rode a stock 2015 YZ450F with a yeti kit and it was great.
 

tillbuilt

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Copied from an individual post:

Unread 04-19-2016, 01:04 PM
dooman92
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Ride review Toby Till builds


First off a big thanks to Toby for an awesome opportunity to ride several kits and the yz450fx. We spent two great days in the Snowies riding these well set up bikes. As physical and experience levels influence opinions, I will say that I am nearly 60yrs and about 160lbs with about 200 hours on a snow bike. All hours on a te510 husky with a 13 and 16 ts 120. We had 3-4" of fresh by the end of day one and more than a foot by end of day two. The base was mostly hard set up snow. Lots of in the trees with a few steep pulls.

I did not get an adequate ride on the yeti kit as a shock cross shaft bolt broke before I could ride it so no opinion. Prior riders had positive comments about the yeti kit.

Some bikes had yeti skis and some timbersled. As Toby indicated in the build thread conditions dictate the best ski. I prefered the TS ski on hard or icy snow and the yeti ski on 6" or more fresh snow. Ideally have both and change for conditions. The timbersled washed out more in the powder but I did not have to fight it as much as the more aggressive yeti ski on the hard stuff. If I had just one ski it would be the TS because the fight was more challenging than the wash out of the TS.

The first day I preferred the joker, (120 TS with TS ski) over the hulk, (cmx 120 kit with the yeti ski). The second day I preferred the 120 cmx with the yeti ski. The ski made the difference but as for the cmx vs TS kit I felt they were similar with an advantage in suspension with the cmx kit. Keep in mind I am an older less aggressive rider. I think more aggressive riders would prefer the cmx. I don't remember but, I think both kits had the convex 2.5 TS track? For the same money/dealer probably go the cmx kit. I did not do much climbing with either kit.

Really enjoyed riding the yz450fx. Felt lighter and smother than my husky with great power. The husky is a tractor with slightly more torque and midrange pull, but might be on a fx next season.

Not only does Toby know the kits, bikes and accessories really well he and Kevin can RIDE! Wow, truly anywhere you wanna go.

Hope this helps someone. Great job Toby!
 

J-Tek

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Meet up with Toby this last weekend in the snowies ! Had a great time , two fantastic days of demo rides on five of Toby's bikes and a few of the other riders bikes . I can't say enough about how generous Toby is to build , demo , and do this review !!! Also how well all the bikes were set up and ran !! How often can you demo one bike for a few minutes let alone five for two whole days . A big hats off to Toby for his effort and generosity !!!

My snowbike history , this was my third season and third TS kit with over 200 hrs total . I've put on 75 hrs this season on a KTM 500 xcw 16 ST TSS , prior to this I had a 15 ST and a 14 SX . I have also had a chance to put a few hrs on the 17 ST TSS LE . So I am pretty familiar with timber sled kits .

On to the reviews . The YZ450fx is a great match for all the kits and very fun to ride ! If you are considering a new bike you should look at one of these . The first bike was the Joker , not much to say here as this kit is basically the same as mine . The TS kits are ok and have been fun , but kinda disappointing in quality and Preformance the last two seasons . One thing to mention is the TS track for 16-17 is much improved .The TS ski works better , more manageable in the hard crust and wet pack conditions but is very grabby on trail and would wash out in deep snow . The second bike , the hulk with the CMX . This bike used the yeti ski which worked very well on trail and as the snow got deeper it worked better . You could lay the bike right down and this ski would not wash out . The CMX has a great ride , quality craftsmanship and performs very well , Very fun to ride , more dirt bike feel , can pop the ski up , very agile . The track however is way to soft and is the reason for a new stiffer track for 17 . Overall very fun , playful bike !! The next was the ironman bike with the yeti kit . The quality and craftsmanship in this kit is remarkable !! With the yeti ski again on trail Preformance was great easy to steer and tracked well . In crusty or wet pack snow it was grabby , but as the snow got deeper the ski worked better . You could lay this bike on its side and it would not wash out ! The yeti was the smoothest ride of the three , very controllable , and would just rip !! Again the track was less than desirable in shallower snow but worked surprisingly well in deeper snow and as stated before will be replaced with a stiffer design for 17 . The last bike we demoed was not included in Toby's review but is well worth mentioning . I believe it was the superman bike , this was a YZ450F with an aerocharger turbo and TS ST TSS SX kit . They were still dialing this setup in , but for only the third trip out they were damn close !!! This was a very fun bike to ride and it flat out ripped , through the trees , up the hills , and on the rollers !!! Conclusion , Toby is a very knowledgeable , honest , trustworthy person who is committed to the snowbike industry . No matter which kit you chose , You can count on quality , true tested , kits , accessories , setup , and advice from Toby . Again THANK YOU TOBY for the time , effort , and money you have put in this review !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 

tillbuilt

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Here is another bike review from last season:

Thanks Kevin!!

Snow is falling in the mountains and fall is almost here. I'm seeing interest in the snow sports ramping up!!!!!
I needed to put together the my notes from last springs 2 day ride with Toby Till and his snowbikes.

I little about me.
I started riding snowbikes in Dec of 2012 and went full time snowbikes in 2014/2015
Last winter i as on my 2009 KTM 530 with some engine work, 2015 TImbersled short track kit with custom gearing and the 2016 track update kit. My bike ran well all winter, it took 1st in the big dog shootout in the normally aspirated class with my 230lbs fat butt on it ��
I have been on all kinds of bikes and kits in the last couple winters.
Home kits, timbersled, CMX, and YETI.
300cc 2 strokes, stock and mod, KX and CR500s.
350cc to 570cc 4 strokes, stock and mod bikes.
And a couple turbo snow bikes.
So with that said lets get onto my feelings of the bikes Toby lets me ride.
The bikes used for the demo ride were the new Yamaha YZ450s some with Electric start. (The Yamaha 450 is a very good snow bike)


These are my feelings riding each kit.

I will start with track impressions.

I like the 2016 Timbersled track the most.
It would dig in and bite. I like that! In all snow conditions.

The YETI track would fold over so the rear would wash out in easy light turns on the gas and would spin more in all conditions.
I can tell the YETI track spins easer though.

My my SKI impressions.
I like the Timbersled ski.
I don't have anything bad to say about the Timbersled ski.
I can trust the Timbersled ski in hard turns and I feel in know when a bike will or could washout on a trail open powder field or side hill.

As for the YETI ski.
I found in hard turns the front of the ski that is wider at the front would grab and pull the ski full left or right and act like plow and would throwing me over the bars.

Now for the kits themselves.

The YETI is so smooth and rolls so easy, and I could feel that is very light weight.

The CMX has no rear bumper to lift with and I was not a fan of the chain case being on the right side, when the kick starter was used. The CMX chain case is in the way for good easy kicking.
The CMX has a smooth ride and feels a little lighter the then the timbersled kit.

Timbersled
What can I say about the Timbersled that most of us don't already know.

I like the Timbersled track a lot more then the the YETI.

I like the Timbersled ski more then the YETI

YETI kit is so light and smooth.

CMX is smooth but the chain case on the wrong side and no grab bar or rear bumper.

Timbersled is heaviest and front track shock is the easy to bottom out.
Now for a really cool bike.

Toby has a Aerocharger turbo kit on a Yamaha 450 and the kit works and is so fun!!!

What a kick butt set up. I loved it!!!

Thank you Toby

Kevin Kronfuss
Loveland Co.

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tillbuilt

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With all of the FX builds going on, I thought I would bounce this thread to the top to help some of you out with your builds.

Don't forget that buying your kits and accessories from Rocky Mountain Snow MX it helps us fund these great builds and brings more knowledge to the snow bike community. So if you need anything for your snow bike from Thermobob's, to Fastway pegs, bar risers, to bark busters. along with heated grips, fork springs, radiator guards, and carbon fiber pipe guards. give us a ring and we will take care of you. Along with Yeti and CMX kits.

Thank you for your support and your business.

Toby
 
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