163 RMK Weight Distribution | Suspension Setup

[matchrocket]

Bought some cheap scales and threw my sled on them today. Been wanting to see the impact / balance of this sled with me on it and unloaded.

Setup:

1 Scale centered under each ski @ Spindle.
1 Scale under FTS at Rail mount point
1 Scale under rear skid just in front of rear idler wheel.

Results:

No Rider. Half a tank a fuel. Tunnel bag on.
LFS: 140
RFS: 135
FTS: 75
RTS: 145
56% Front
44% Rear
495 Total Weight

w/215 lb Rider:
LRS:150
RFS:150
FTS:238
RTS:157
43% Front
57% Rear
695 Total Weight

Observations:

Sled feels very light on the trail, and likes to push corners hard. Off trail works pretty well. Front feels heavy on down-hill off camber side hilling in setup snow, but I think that's to be expected. :face-icon-small-coo

Anyone do this with an axys? have any feedback?

 

[AdrenalineAddict]

I ride a 163 and have tried many combos to get a mountain feel I'm comfortable with. It does push a bit on hardpack and does not transfer enough weight when hillclimbing for my liking. If you go by the book increasing preload to the 8.2" minimum does very little for picking the front end. The next step is decreasing preload in the rear, this does very little as far as weight transfer either, all it accomplishes is settling the rear sooner and collapsing the front quicker which just puts more weight on the ski's. I've learned to ride it as it is but am always wanting a little more transfer to pick the front end over obstacles. I used to fly up rocky gnarly hillclimbs with confidence on my old 155, now I pray until I pull the hill and thank god when I get there.

 

[raleigh111]

Bought some cheap scales and threw my sled on them today. Been wanting to see the impact / balance of this sled with me on it and unloaded.

Setup:

1 Scale centered under each ski @ Spindle.
1 Scale under FTS at Rail mount point
1 Scale under rear skid just in front of rear idler wheel.

Results:

No Rider. Half a tank a fuel. Tunnel bag on.
LFS: 140
RFS: 135
FTS: 75
RTS: 145
56% Front
44% Rear
495 Total Weight

w/215 lb Rider:
LRS:150
RFS:150
FTS:238
RTS:157
43% Front
57% Rear
695 Total Weight

Observations:

Sled feels very light on the trail, and likes to push corners hard. Off trail works pretty well. Front feels heavy on down-hill off camber side hilling in setup snow, but I think that's to be expected. :face-icon-small-coo

Anyone do this with an axys? have any feedback?

Can you give some unloaded specs for your springs with those weights? You still running 210 rear spring? I dont have scales but shocks re valaved to TRS specs 170 rts 8.1 fts 1 round preload ifs and i like better then before. little more playful

 

[raleigh111]

I ride a 163 and have tried many combos to get a mountain feel I'm comfortable with. It does push a bit on hardpack and does not transfer enough weight when hillclimbing for my liking. If you go by the book increasing preload to the 8.2" minimum does very little for picking the front end. The next step is decreasing preload in the rear, this does very little as far as weight transfer either, all it accomplishes is settling the rear sooner and collapsing the front quicker which just puts more weight on the ski's. I've learned to ride it as it is but am always wanting a little more transfer to pick the front end over obstacles. I used to fly up rocky gnarly hillclimbs with confidence on my old 155, now I pray until I pull the hill and thank god when I get there.

I took the 210 spring out and am playing with a 170 and a 190 per Tony TRS recommendations and it does help transfer more to rear. I had Bruce @ b-line re valve my shocks to TRS specs and no bottoming out even with 170 spring. I have come to conclusion it will never be as playful as i want but it is better. I agree on FTS does not seem to help much if you stay within Polaris specs. Need to squeeze it a little tighter then they say you can.

 

[matchrocket]

Can you give some unloaded specs for your springs with those weights? ....

Springs are what came on the sled, so the rear should be the 210.

RTS: Set to 10.5 then backed off a turn.
FTS: Exactly per manual, seems to work well there.

Ski Shocks: My Springs are two different lengths. One is almost 1/4 shorter than the other. Raptor TRS's are in my future as soon as they come off backorder. I set them to 10 and 10.25 ish, but adjusted them so the ride on the front side/side was equal.

 

[SRXSRULE]

Ive been doing exactly the same thing with scales for years now on my pro's and axys sleds.
I do place a 2x4 on edge between the track paddles so the weight is going directly to the rails for a more accurate reading.

I would say you need to soften the spring pre-load on your front track shock. With no weight on that shock, I only have enough pre-load on the spring to keep enough pressure on the spring that the spring seat wont fall out.

With no rider on the sled, my FTS weight is only about 10lbs. With the rider on the sled standing in a neutral position the FTS and RTS weights are almost equal, with the FTS maybe 5-10lbs heavier.

A set-up similar to this will fix the push on the trail (not the goal, but just saying), it will allow the sled to get on top of the snow quicker and also help keep the front end down on a steep climb.

2 more things when on the scales.... you can play with your front ski spring pre-load to equal out the weights left to right. And, you can see the effect of foot placement from all the way forward to all the way back and watch the numbers change on the RTS and FTS.

 

[raleigh111]

Ive been doing exactly the same thing with scales for years now on my pro's and axys sleds.
I do place a 2x4 on edge between the track paddles so the weight is going directly to the rails for a more accurate reading.

I would say you need to soften the spring pre-load on your front track shock. With no weight on that shock, I only have enough pre-load on the spring to keep enough pressure on the spring that the spring seat wont fall out.

With no rider on the sled, my FTS weight is only about 10lbs. With the rider on the sled standing in a neutral position the FTS and RTS weights are almost equal, with the FTS maybe 5-10lbs heavier.

A set-up similar to this will fix the push on the trail (not the goal, but just saying), it will allow the sled to get on top of the snow quicker and also help keep the front end down on a steep climb.

2 more things when on the scales.... you can play with your front ski spring pre-load to equal out the weights left to right. And, you can see the effect of foot placement from all the way forward to all the way back and watch the numbers change on the RTS and FTS.

stock rts spring?

 

[SRXSRULE]

stock rts spring?

I run the same set-up (scale numbers) with stock springs and Raptor springs. Raptor springs just ride better on the trail in the bumps.

 

[newfieassault]

Could you tell me how you have the fts and rts setup? I just installed Raptors.
What is your weight and how does your sled react?
Thanks

 

[matchrocket]

My rider weight is ~215 - 220.

The interesting thing regarding using scales, is that I am pretty close to what the manual calls for. When it was all said and done, I found up with the following:

RTS: Adjusted it to 10.5 (default).
FTS: Adjusted it to 8.325 (Default), then backed off a full turn.

Taking a full turn off the FTS, shifted ~35lbs to the back shock with me on it. Ski Shocks are set based on ride height and weight. (Target 145 - 150lbs with me on the sled) I like a very playful front end, I may not like this adjustment, haven't ridden it yet unfortunately.

I have a narrow front end so its different, and my springs are not the same length unloaded.

P.S. Are the triple rate springs back in stock????

 

[newfieassault]

Not sure, bought em second hand.
Just wondering how much thread left on fts
Thanks

 

[matchrocket]

Not sure, bought em second hand.

Just wondering how much thread left on fts

Thanks

I measure unloaded spring length. It's about 8.4 inches.

Sent from my Pixel 2 XL using Tapatalk

 

[newfieassault]

Thanks


Let me know how it responds after your next ride.

 

[Snowman.PRO.]

I'm running the Raptor Kinetic series with the Raptor Triple rate springs.
turbo 16 axys pro 163 2.6. Im about 190lbs with no clothes on.

FTS is set at 8.5" length, I'm going to try going to 8.0" length to hopefully add a little more ski lift/ playfulness to it.

Ski shock springs are loose, I don't have a measurement, but they are just tight enough to keep the retainer on. Its set at whatever raptor says to start at.

RTS was set at 10.5" length... After two days of riding on it, I couldn't run it at that and cranked it up to 10". It had way to much sag. To the point I felt uncomfortable running it that low. Thankfully this shock has a quick cam adjustment. I could add .5" preload to it with just a spanner wrench out on the mountain. Nice job on that raptor. I'm starting to feel it get dialed in now. If your around my weight, I'd start with 10" as right now, I think its a good all around setting.

RTS: I have had it cranked to 9.5", It really keeps the skis down on climbs, it will still wheelie, but under complete control. At this setting it felt stiff and I couldn't feel the suspension collapsing doing its job. IMO, i don't feel a need to EVER go stiffer than 9.5" length. I currently am at 10" and I think I'll leave it there for now, it feels the best so far.

 

[matchrocket]

Thanks


Let me know how it responds after your next ride.

I have about 150 miles on the adjustments. It's a bit stiffer on the train now, but I really like the way it handles in the powder. Gets up on the snow a little quicker, and doesn't want to lift the skis as much.

Trail manors/pushing is about the same, but it's liveable.

 

[newfieassault]

Just checking to see how the sled handled and if you made any more adjustments?


Thanks

 

[Teth-Air]

Bought some cheap scales and threw my sled on them today. Been wanting to see the impact / balance of this sled with me on it and unloaded.

Setup:

1 Scale centered under each ski @ Spindle.
1 Scale under FTS at Rail mount point
1 Scale under rear skid just in front of rear idler wheel.

Results:

No Rider. Half a tank a fuel. Tunnel bag on.
LFS: 140
RFS: 135
FTS: 75
RTS: 145
56% Front
44% Rear
495 Total Weight

w/215 lb Rider:
LRS:150
RFS:150
FTS:238
RTS:157
43% Front
57% Rear
695 Total Weight

Observations:

Sled feels very light on the trail, and likes to push corners hard. Off trail works pretty well. Front feels heavy on down-hill off camber side hilling in setup snow, but I think that's to be expected. :face-icon-small-coo

Anyone do this with an axys? have any feedback?

Firstly, thank you for the effort you are putting into the setup and sharing. Too many just ride with stock settings and are oblivious of how much better these sleds can be when set up properly. Personally I don't use a scale anymore but go for the traits I want in the sled. I start with the FTS and set the spring tension to where the limiter is just tight with my weight on the sled. Then RTS to control bottoming and transfer. At that point set the ski shock springs to control a balance between ski pressure, and diving. The clickers are a nice adder to dial in for changing conditions.

I do find these sleds get very heavy in the steering coming down hill and am working on some upper A-Arms that have an adjustable caster. I believe that by running the spindle a bit more upright, the steering effort can be greatly reduced. Might be next season for results now though.

 

[matchrocket]

Just checking to see how the sled handled and if you made any more adjustments?


Thanks

I've been very happy with this setup so far this season. In hard spring snow, I added about a 1/4 turn to the front and 1/2 to the rear as I was blowing through travel on whoops in setup snow.

Impact weight wise, I am not sure, haven't put it back on scales. its in the shop again for run ability issue.

 

[newfieassault]

I'm running the Raptor Kinetic series with the Raptor Triple rate springs.
turbo 16 axys pro 163 2.6. Im about 190lbs with no clothes on.

FTS is set at 8.5" length, I'm going to try going to 8.0" length to hopefully add a little more ski lift/ playfulness to it.

Ski shock springs are loose, I don't have a measurement, but they are just tight enough to keep the retainer on. Its set at whatever raptor says to start at.

RTS was set at 10.5" length... After two days of riding on it, I couldn't run it at that and cranked it up to 10". It had way to much sag. To the point I felt uncomfortable running it that low. Thankfully this shock has a quick cam adjustment. I could add .5" preload to it with just a spanner wrench out on the mountain. Nice job on that raptor. I'm starting to feel it get dialed in now. If your around my weight, I'd start with 10" as right now, I think its a good all around setting.

RTS: I have had it cranked to 9.5", It really keeps the skis down on climbs, it will still wheelie, but under complete control. At this setting it felt stiff and I couldn't feel the suspension collapsing doing its job. IMO, i don't feel a need to EVER go stiffer than 9.5" length. I currently am at 10" and I think I'll leave it there for now, it feels the best so far.

What are your clicker settings on each shock.

Thanks

 

[frntflp]

Over the summer, I pushed out my 155 to a 163 and changed over to Fox Floats. Now I get to run the whole process again. Sled is an 18 PRO 800 SC

Last year, using stock WE shocks (shortened '19 Pro RMK specs) and Z Broz dual rate spring on 36" arms set up on the front, I started with the factory spring lengths (in the owners manual). Scales under each spindle, and under the lower mounting point of the front and rear torque arms. Adjusted spring preloads so that i had 40% in front, 60% in back. Roughly even side to side (front) and even front to back (rear) - while standing on sled in a neutral position. Worked really well during multiple rides in WY.

I'm expecting to do the exact same thing now that I have the 163 installed. Only difference is that I'm adjusting main chamber air pressures instead of turning springs.