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land use organizations

F
I don't know if this has been brought up in the past but here goes.

As I look at the fight to access public grounds I notice that "our side" is fighting big groups like the Sierra Club or The Wilderness Society. These groups have the backings of millions with full time staffs. These big groups are used for closure in areas of millions of acres down to small parcels of several acres. When we fight smaller closures in our states, we usually fight them at a local level, with small groups.

An example, I'm from the midwest and do much of my riding in the Hiawathi National Forest in the eastern u.p. of Michigan. When some local "tree huggers" wanted to shut down snowmobiles and atv's because of the Canadian Lynx, they had the backing of the Sierra Club with all its money and staff. Fortunately they failed, for now. The local clubs did a great job in this case.

Our problem is we are not united, we have too many groups. The manufactures have groups, both atv's and snowmobiles. There are snowmobile groups, atv groups, motorcycle groups, horse groups, etc. All these groups do the best they can and I applaud them for there efforts.

We are asked to "join" multiple associations to help in our fight. I recommend that we do away with smaller groups and form one large group with local chapters, like the Sierra Club, Issac Walton, etc have done. Like it or not money and lobbying are big parts of wildernes groups.

We need to speak with one voice on the national level. Not being from the west...yet, I never heard of groups like SAWS until I looked at this site. No matter where you live, the west, midwest, east coast, south, we are all under fire and closures are happening everywhere.

I would like to hear peoples comments on how we can better unite. I am not a public speaker or writer. I struggle with words and writing and hope someone sees this idea and runs with it. Thanks for your time.
 
W
Nov 2, 2001
3,460
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Boise, Id
There are national groups, such as BRC (blue ribbon coalition). But, snowmobiles are just part of their work. Plus, they pick and chose their battles. Have too, not enough money too take on everything.

Me being from this area, may not be happy with BRC letting my forest go; in order to save Yellowstone. Or letting a forest in Montana go, to save a forest in Idaho. Plus BRC is expanding back east. It will help to have a larger pool of supporters, but will pull their attention away from the Northwest and snowmobiles, even more.

SAWS is a snowmobile only organization, concentrated on the NorthWest. Not because they don't like or support other sports, just that someone's got to stay focused on snowmobiles. It really is a different set of problems. They are dedicated to fighting any "more" land closures. They have nearly every Northwest state snowmobile association join them. There's other states they would like to cover, but their model requires that someone from that state; volunteers to become their state representative. See, SAWS is all volunteers. They all have full time jobs and families. What I personally believe they need, is a benefactor that will hire one or two full time staff members. With that, they could easily manage more state's reps. Dave, the chairman of SAWS, is a smart and dedicated guy. He really believes he is fighting the good fight.

Write SAWS a donation check every year, I do. Get your friends to join SAWS, it's free. Get your friends to write letters. It really helps.

The model is there, the funding and manpower isn't. Anyone, dedicated to snowmobiling should think about becoming a state representative. Or, at least become a forest watchdog. ( A person that watches a single forest, they are familiar with, for upcoming closures. It doesn't take much time.)
 
F
wade, you make some good points but we need to look at the bigger picture. This isn't just a west coast problem. We need one voice for all access with each group represented in the larger group. What we've been doing isn't working and the "treehuggers" groups are. I don't know if this is the solution be we need to change the way we fight for access.
 
W
Nov 2, 2001
3,460
279
83
Boise, Id
Yha, BRC has "projects". You really need someone on their board, to get their attention.

I understand what your saying about Northwest versus Northeast, but unless your talking to a Easterner that goes out west a lot, most don't understand, or support off trail riding. It's a concept I didn't understand until I moved here either.

We've actually had Eastern riders not support us over land closure. So, Northwest riding is a lot different from IP riding. We don't call trail riding snowmobiling. We call trail riding, getting to the snowmobiling. If all I had was trail riding, I won't ride.

But your right, we need to all fight the greenies together. It really bugs me that groups like the Sierra club are so well funded. Unfortunately, there's no beating them. We can only slow them down. They will just keep pressing endlessly. No matter how wrong they are, there's no punishment for their mistakes. The only thing that will ever stop them, is a collapse of our governmental legal system, for without that, they are meaningless. There's another way to beat them, but I doubt many would support it.

It's just another freedom, we are losing. This isn't limited to sledding.

We recreationalist need to get political, and run for offices.
 
F
wade you are correct on so many points. we will all be outlaws soon. midwest and northeast areas have many more areas of groomed trails. for example in michigan where our cabin used to be, i could ride hundreds of miles of groomed trails in a single day. we didn't, we rode 50 miles in deep powder. could brc work with saws?
 
W
Nov 2, 2001
3,460
279
83
Boise, Id
wade you are correct on so many points. we will all be outlaws soon. midwest and northeast areas have many more areas of groomed trails. for example in michigan where our cabin used to be, i could ride hundreds of miles of groomed trails in a single day. we didn't, we rode 50 miles in deep powder. could brc work with saws?

BRC and SAWS have to work together, at some level. They can't work against one another. They have different ways of looking at things. And, different motivations. But, they want the same thing ultimately. To preserve the right to recreate.

Personally, I might be a little more snowmobile rights pro, than either group. I believe that about half the "wilderness" should be made into some type of "backcountry" designation, where motorized recreation has a right to exist.

Have you checked out these other national organizations.

http://www.snowmobile.org/

http://www.snowmobilers.org/
 

Hardass

Well-known member
Lifetime Membership
Nov 26, 2007
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Troy Montana
I agree with you Dave There are so many splintered groups trying to do something but mostly not working together. As far as the brc well ??The point is i feel it would be better to have a sort of general fund and parent for every one to turn to,just as you suggest. Can that happen? probably not ,peoples toes would get pinched.This should have happened long ago way before it ever got this far.Where would you start? How much over head do all the groups have that goes to admin? We have our little group here trying to change things here in Lincoln county there's no one else helping us so were trying to do what we can. From where i'm at looking out,there's alot of noise but not much happening in a real way. I have donated time and money to some of these things but seeing whats happening i feel it's being wasted.A couple of ants here and there no big deal, but an army of ants is cause for concern and down right devistating if it's a big one. The money is the key to it all no if, s,or butts about it , if our side had the money we would win hands down. We do not have it so this is where were at. The future does not look bright from the window i'm looking out of today.I hope yours is a little clearer.
 
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