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engine swaps

R

redneck_raser

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Feb 1, 2009
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hey all I need some advice and opinions. I just picked up a 04 rev w/brand new '07 800 drop in. i own a 600 outlaw and a 503 both 136s which chassis will work better w/the 800? i wanna build a deep snow 800 and flatlander 600. will the 800 skud pipe work in the hawk or do i need a jaws to fit? will either the 600 or 800 fit in the 503 chassis with redrilled engine mount holes? the rest of the chassis cuts look the same between my 2 machines. i have never seen a 800 hawk so no clue if the chassis is cut the same around the engine? i know gearing, secondary, and fuel system needs improved. are the fork springs the same in all 3 models?
any and all advice would be welcome
thanks ray
 
S
Nov 26, 2007
2,684
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Kennewick Wa
Decisions, decisions!

Your easiest swap will be 600 to 800, bolts right in same as 600.
The only differences from a stock 800 will be one less heat exchanger, handlebar riser, color, and 12gal tank. Carbs are the same as 600 just larger jets. Don't change the cog gearing even AD Boivin went back to original 503/600 gearing after problems with 2007 Top Gun's fourth pully and longer belt. The heat exchanger could be retrofitted but if you ride in deep snow and never had a problem with your Outlaw before should not with the swap.

If you print and study the manual PDF's on ADB's site you can decifer the differences notice the 503F engine mounting plate is placed higher, the block is bolted ridgidly through dowel spacers and its mounting holes are spaced different. The 6 and 800 engines are rubber isolated. The 503F engines are piston port, not the cylinder reed type, putts the carbs much higher requiring partial bulkhead (triangular steering stem mount) removal and shorter steering stem. Your 600 has extra brace bracketry which also mounts the MPEM.

Our prototype 2006/7 Top Gun 800 was simply a conversion from a 2004 600ST so it was missing a few upgrades yet never had a failure.
The primary TRA III and secondary clutch on 800's are the REV 2004 on, which requires a different diameter stronger steel secondary jack shaft. Better to upgrade to Artic Cat secondary the guys on here Sledder 2, etc. for their replacement steel upper and lower jack shafts. Put four new premium bearings in while you are at it, all same size.

Replacing both shafts with solid steel units and bearings often is a must in the long term since it seems that Eighthunnert seems to wear and break things quicker, go figure.:eek:

You could contact Whitesurf in BC for their suspension rail heat exchanger conversion. http://whitesurf.ca/

Your suspension should be fine just set up for total weight including rider and riding style. Either the Jaws or quieter Matek exhaust is the same 600/800. If you do not need the fuel range the bulky 12gal can be cumbersome but an 800 is a thirsty beast.

Attac Altitude compensator should be installed if your new engine is not a Summit DPEM powerplant. Scram600, Sledder2, and a few others have some great ideas and retrofits for all machine models.

I would like to see an Etec 600 swap, 22mpg would be nice just think of all the weight you could lose by only needing the stock 503F 5gal tank.
600 has plenty of power if clutched right.

Have fun with your project.:cool:
 
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S
Nov 26, 2007
2,684
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Kennewick Wa
Old topics.

At the bottom of a topic catergory (Snow Hawks, Snow bikes, Ski-Doo, Yamaha, etc.) there is a display options option. If you search by "Beginning" you will access all old topics.:)

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T

TLKDPROD

Well-known member
Jan 25, 2008
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Salmon Arm, BC
Keep the 503, swap the 8

If I were you I'd swap the 800 in the 600 frame and keep the 503. That's pretty much your only option unless you don't mind doing the R&D redrilling your 503 frame to fit the 6-800 motor mount & cut your bulkhead.

Sure enough the 600 is a good mid point between the 503 and the 800 (and is a better machine than 99% of the sleds on this planet) but it's clearly not as light as a 503 and clearly not as powerful as an 8hunnert for the super deep (sub 24") stuff with a 144 or longer track. Since you can have both, go with the best of both worlds and swap your 600 motor for the 8.

Get some custom rail extensions from sledr2 (on this forum) that will fit 8" idler wheels and get a challenger extreme 144-146-150 or 151" tracked 800 Hawk to rip the deeeep pow in the mountain (a 600 will not be enough power to spin a 151, maybe 144 would be ok if clutched right on the spot) and keep the 503 for the 550 swap project ! Anyway, all Hawk guys need a 503 because it will always remain a super fun thing to whip around when you're tired or overhung from the night before.

Clutch it right, I can help you on that. Dump the cog belt drive you'll have problems with it (we all did) with an 800 motor if you're hard on the throttle through rough trails.

And I don't know if I should shut up with that... but fair enough now, a lot of guys already know it... Jaws will be producing a Snow-Hawk 800HO specific exhaust & silencer for next season. No more guessing which exhaust we (800 guys) should put on our hawks (27 pound Mattech, modified Mattech, Jaws 600, Jaws 600 with a bit of work or a Rev800 expansion chamber all cut & rewelded to fit...). We'll have the best sled exhaust builder in the world producing a non restricted or a non-"ADB de-tuned" exhaust system especially for our 800 machines. I expect that to be the best mod to put on our 800HOs for sure. Finally, we'll have the opportunity to have our 800 machines to run as they should. That was the missing link (powerwise) I was looking for.

I can't wait for next season.

Good luck with the swap man.
 
R

redneck_raser

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Aha

At the bottom of a topic catergory (Snow Hawks, Snow bikes, Ski-Doo, Yamaha, etc.) there is a display options option. If you search by "Beginning" you will access all old topics.:)

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That makes sense please excuse my computer illiteracy:eek: Thanks for all the advice guys. If the 600 and 800 swap easy I'll probably just keep the 503 as is. To be honest the chain drive still scares the s**t outta me. Is the TRA better or worse than comet or p-85 or is it preference? Also any one running extroverts ? I've been to the whitesurf website Peter has some stuff on my upgrade list!
The jaws pipe for the 8 buy that direct from jaws?
 
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roo

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May 12, 2008
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sedro woolley WA
That makes sense please excuse my computer illiteracy:eek: Thanks for all the advice guys. If the 600 and 800 swap easy I'll probably just keep the 503 as is. To be honest the chain drive still scares the s**t outta me. Is the TRA better or worse than comet or p-85 or is it preference? Also any one running extroverts ? I've been to the whitesurf website Peter has some stuff on my upgrade list!
The jaws pipe for the 8 buy that direct from jaws?

530 chain good enough for a 400 h.p. boosted hyabusa, probally good enough for 800 hawk!
 

J&L Snowhawk

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Jan 3, 2008
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chain drive

I've been thinking about the chain drive as well. it is not the horse power as much as it is extreme sudden load. drive belts rated for 1000 Hp. smooth gentle power is way better to handle.
 
I
Jan 4, 2008
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Palmer AK.
As one of the first run the chain drive Iall i can say is after 4 years of pounding I will never go back to the belt drive. As for clutching neither are better there are just some that can tune a tra and some that can tune the p-85. I like the p-85 because i was a polaris guy for along time.
 
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