URGENT !! INJECTOR OIL UPDATE

Murph · Dec 14, 2014

Merlin said:
Has anyone been able to track down any published technical specs. for VES Gold?

It's difficult to make an informed decision on whether a non-OEM oil will cut the mustard if you don't know where the "bar" has been set..........

FWIW, although it wasn't the OP's intention, I can see many leaving this thread with the opinion that the use of mineral based oils will result in the death of any direct or semi-direct injected 2 stroke engine without considering the important variables of ambient operating temp. & the specs. of the oil itself.

There have been various versions of VES gold. This version is from late 2012. I believe it is the latest version.

All Polaris oil msds- http://purepolarisoil.com/msds/

Polaris VES Gold specific. (The directory tells you it's from October of 2012 but the msds lists the revision date as 2007)

http://purepolarisoil.com/msds/Polaris 2T VES Synthetic Oil _0125_.pdf

2010 revision of VES Gold plus

http://purepolarisoil.com/msds/Polaris VES Gold PLUS 2 Cycle Oil _10309_(1).pdf

Polaris Semi Synthetic (Blue)
http://purepolarisoil.com/msds/Polaris Synthetic Blend 2T _2065_.pdf

VES Race
http://purepolarisoil.com/msds/Polaris VES Race Oil _10302_(1).pdf

I just towed out my 2011 yesterday-- with a crank bearing failure. BUT-- it was @ 4200+ miles all on non- synthetic petroleum based oil. I knew it was time to swap the motor-- I have two Indy Dan long rod motors on order-- they just haven't arrived yet. Tried to push it and paid the price. Don't think I can blame the oil at 4200+ all mountain miles though. However, I do have a TRS recommended skidoo oil cap on order and I will be switching to a synthetic.

Still need to determine which brand of oil...

Bowfisher · Dec 14, 2014

Murph said:
I just towed out my 2011 yesterday-- with a crank bearing failure. BUT-- it was @ 4200+ miles all on non- synthetic petroleum based oil. I knew it was time to swap the motor-- I have two Indy Dan long rod motors on order-- they just haven't arrived yet. Tried to push it and paid the price. Don't think I can blame the oil at 4200+ all mountain miles though. However, I do have a TRS recommended skidoo oil cap on order and I will be switching to a synthetic.

Still need to determine which brand of oil...

My limited knowledge of oils tells me that synthetic oil doesn't provide superior bearing lubrication.

redrockwr · Dec 14, 2014

Thanks for this thread. I have learned a ton about oil that I was really curious about. Thank you, Thank you.
I have been running Dominator in all of my sleds since new. I also have the same question what the difference between Dominator and Interceptor are and if one is better to run then the other.
Great Thread!

Merlin · Dec 14, 2014

Murph said:
There have been various versions of VES gold. This version is from late 2012. I believe it is the latest version.

All Polaris oil msds- http://purepolarisoil.com/msds/

Polaris VES Gold specific. (The directory tells you it's from October of 2012 but the msds lists the revision date as 2007)

http://purepolarisoil.com/msds/Polaris 2T VES Synthetic Oil _0125_.pdf

2010 revision of VES Gold plus

http://purepolarisoil.com/msds/Polaris VES Gold PLUS 2 Cycle Oil _10309_(1).pdf

Polaris Semi Synthetic (Blue)
http://purepolarisoil.com/msds/Polaris Synthetic Blend 2T _2065_.pdf

VES Race
http://purepolarisoil.com/msds/Polaris VES Race Oil _10302_(1).pdf

I just towed out my 2011 yesterday-- with a crank bearing failure. BUT-- it was @ 4200+ miles all on non- synthetic petroleum based oil. I knew it was time to swap the motor-- I have two Indy Dan long rod motors on order-- they just haven't arrived yet. Tried to push it and paid the price. Don't think I can blame the oil at 4200+ all mountain miles though. However, I do have a TRS recommended skidoo oil cap on order and I will be switching to a synthetic.

Still need to determine which brand of oil...

Murph,

Those are MSDS not the technical data sheets.

We need to know both viscosity specs. which are typically measured at 40C & 100C.

See below:

Kcjepperson · Dec 15, 2014

I found this on legends website.

FrankTheTank · Dec 16, 2014

The Polaris VES Race sounds good!
Thats what im going to use.
Its what Polaris recomends for extreme cold weather.

Polaris VES Race -70°F (-57°C).

GoBigParts · Dec 16, 2014

Jaynelson said:
Yup. Buy the biggest, most powerful vehicle you can find, put even bigger tires on, drive it like a wild man, and then endlessly debate fuel economy :lol::face-icon-small-con

Too funny. You pay almost $70,000 for a truck and then the cost of the lift, rims, tires and all the mods the price of fuel is not an issue. As a matter of fact you can justify that the price of anything shouldn't be an issue.

sledneck_03 · Dec 16, 2014

i run this stuff, seeing this thread is going this way.

http://www.stacoop.com/news/flyer/2-uncategorised/81-sonic-xl-s-2-cycle-engine-oil

-81.4 degrees f pour point.

same color as polaris ves. The co-op refinery regardless what people think is very technological advanced, my cousins a power engineer there and gets chemical engineers there to answer any of my questions.

'77 Rider · Dec 16, 2014

sledneck_03 said:
i run this stuff, seeing this thread is going this way.

http://www.stacoop.com/news/flyer/2-uncategorised/81-sonic-xl-s-2-cycle-engine-oil

-81.4 degrees f pour point.

same color as polaris ves. The co-op refinery regardless what people think is very technological advanced, my cousins a power engineer there and gets chemical engineers there to answer any of my questions.

That looks pretty impressive! Can any of the gurus comment on this one?

08F6SP · Dec 17, 2014

I'm no guru but, I did run XL-S in my F6 for the first 3 seasons and it seems like a good oil. I had no need to clean the valves any time I looked at them and what I could see of my pistons looked like brand new. It doesn't smell as nice as Legend but, I've smelled worse.

sledneck_03 · Dec 17, 2014

08F6SP said:
I'm no guru but, I did run XL-S in my F6 for the first 3 seasons and it seems like a good oil. I had no need to clean the valves any time I looked at them and what I could see of my pistons looked like brand new. It doesn't smell as nice as Legend but, I've smelled worse.

My dads f8 oil pump arm came off and he didnt know till the throttle stuck a few times and had to blip the throttle to un stick it. I was looking around and blipping it and noticed the linkage flipping around. Should have seized but didnt. He ran oil in the gas tank for the rest of the season as well but it also did use oil with arm off... So who knows. He drives wide open everywhere too...and who knows how long it was off. Has 5000 some miles on that sled now... Maybe it was the sonic xl-s oil? Haha

Its also ~$7-8 a litre at coop hardware stores.

Merlin · Dec 18, 2014

'77 Rider said:
That looks pretty impressive! Can any of the gurus comment on this one?

I'm not a guru but I did stay at a Holiday Inn last night................

FWIW, pour point info. without the complete viscosity specs. is next to useless for determining the performance of an oil.

I.E. cleaning solvent may have an impressive pour point but has little. to no, lubricating qualities for an engine.

That said, I am impressed to see that Co-op lists the complete viscosity performance specs.

Many of the oil manufacturers listed on this thread do not publish the complete viscosity performance specs of their product which is IMO is purposely misleading. To add, I noticed that one of the manufactures has a link on their website to an "independent" analysis conducted on their product & a handful of the competitors. This analysis refers to an "RPM Break Down" test that was conducted on all of the oils. From what I could find on the 'net the "RPM Break Down" test is not used / acknowledged by any of the major oil certification / accreditation organizations(API, ISO, JASO, etc.) While I can't validate nor dispute the effectiveness of this test, I have to question the motives of the manufacturer for not using recognized testing protocol for their product. Based on feedback from the forums alone, it is clear that this company does not produce an inferior product however if they wish to retain their credibility with those who have a small understanding of lubricants they should play by the rules & publish officially recognized specs.

TheBreeze · Dec 18, 2014

Merlin said:
I'm not a guru but I did stay at a Holiday Inn last night................

FWIW, pour point info. without the complete viscosity specs. is next to useless for determining the performance of an oil.

I.E. cleaning solvent may have an impressive pour point but has little. to no, lubricating qualities for an engine.

That said, I am impressed to see that Co-op lists the complete viscosity performance specs.

Many of the oil manufacturers listed on this thread do not publish the complete viscosity performance specs of their product which is IMO is purposely misleading. To add, I noticed that one of the manufactures has a link on their website to an "independent" analysis conducted on their product & a handful of the competitors. This analysis refers to an "RPM Break Down" test that was conducted on all of the oils. From what I could find on the 'net the "RPM Break Down" test is not used / acknowledged by any of the major oil certification / accreditation organizations(API, ISO, JASO, etc.) While I can't validate nor dispute the effectiveness of this test, I have to question the motives of the manufacturer for not using recognized testing protocol for their product. Based on feedback from the forums alone, it is clear that this company does not produce an inferior product however if they wish to retain their credibility with those who have a small understanding of lubricants they should play by the rules & publish officially recognized specs.

Exactly. I run his oil, but that test sheet that he has laminated and carries with him at all the shows is total BS. IMO he made the damn list himself, and is infact "The Chemist" that published that scam of a test.

Merlin · Dec 18, 2014

TheBreeze said:
Exactly. I run his oil, but that test sheet that he has laminated and carries with him at all the shows is total BS. IMO he made the damn list himself, and is infact "The Chemist" that published that scam of a test.

I read your post, the thread, & any other relevant info. I could find & have to say that I agree.

That said, the company does clearly produce a quality product.

Why not simply publish credible specs.?

nosajlleb · Dec 18, 2014

sledneck_03 said:
My dads f8 oil pump arm came off and he didnt know till the throttle stuck a few times and had to blip the throttle to un stick it. I was looking around and blipping it and noticed the linkage flipping around. Should have seized but didnt. He ran oil in the gas tank for the rest of the season as well but it also did use oil with arm off... So who knows. He drives wide open everywhere too...and who knows how long it was off. Has 5000 some miles on that sled now... Maybe it was the sonic xl-s oil? Haha

Its also ~$7-8 a litre at coop hardware stores.

Pretty sure once that linkage comes off it goes to full open on the oil so that would explain why you didn't burn it up.

sledneck_03 · Dec 18, 2014

nosajlleb said:
Pretty sure once that linkage comes off it goes to full open on the oil so that would explain why you didn't burn it up.

Yah... We thought so but it burns more oil not hooked up. Not sure.

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URGENT !! INJECTOR OIL UPDATE

Murph

Polaris Moderator/ Polaris Ambassador/ Klim Amb.

Bowfisher

Well-known member

redrockwr

Active member

Merlin

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Kcjepperson

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FrankTheTank

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GoBigParts

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sledneck_03

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'77 Rider

Free Member

08F6SP

New member

sledneck_03

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Merlin

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TheBreeze

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Merlin

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nosajlleb

Well-known member

sledneck_03

Well-known member

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